Just wondering how many years I'll have to wait for my new Tesla pick up???
5 to 10.
DTsea is probably right.
Wouldn't it be great to have a low bed for loading? That would facilitate loading anything with wheels and any heavy objects.
Go, go Tesla!
Best Guess: Tesla Model P 220 dual motor all wheel drive dually crew cab pickup with Class IV towing, unveiled 2020 for a 2022 launch.
Y isn't for a Y'll yet.
or is it (?)
I really think Tesla is missing a golden opportunity with a small to midsize truck on the Model S chassis and drive train. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, just a nice little truck that will get 200 miles per charge for around $30-35k. It would compliment the Model 3 very well.
People love trucks - and the good thing is, they mostly use them locally so there wouldn't be a ton of range anxiety.
How hard could it possibly be to design a truck body that would go right on the Model S chassis?
At least as hard as designing the X which uses the same S chassis and still has taken years and counting.
And then there is the Model 3 which is a hugely more difficult project than the X.
After that, the truck.
I'd be surprised to see a truck for at least 10 years. The battery needed to haul loads any distance would be huge ... you need the right tool for the job .. Batteries are great for light transport or maybe short range trucks that a city utility would use ... but I'll stick with my diesel for now for my farm and hauling my trailer.
You people must not live in the South. 1/2 of all vehicles are pickups - pickups that have never had a thing loaded in them. We just put some rims on them and some bigger tires, maybe a bull bar on the front, and drive it like a car. That's all. Since they have the AWD in place, a truck would be easy.
And, the X was delayed a year because of those doors. That's why I said, just make it a very simply truck, that's all. There's no dang way it could possibly take that long.
@buddyroe, yes, you understand. There are some trucks that are actually used as trucks, but there is a huge portion of the truck market where there really should be air quotes around it because people just like the look and feel of driving a truck, and it's not used for anything heavy duty.
All I need to enough interior for my family of 5 and the dog and a bed big enough for our camping gear. Based on past experience, roughly 20 ft^2 will do so a 48"x 60" bed is all I need. Then I need it to be able to drive on/over 6-8" boulders into the woods and sit for a few days. I don't need much, but it does have to be a pickup. Nothing else with less than 80 ft^3 behind the second row will do that and these days that means Ford Expedition EL only. Vans won't handle the rocks.
Given the fact that Tesla will most likely need another manufacturing plant for the truck, and it is not even on the radar screen yet, 10 years is probably a a minimum.
Personallly, 3 yrs would be fine with me, but it's not going to happen.
Elon would rather eat what he emits than make a not-useful truck for suburbanites, even if it were a hot seller.
buddyroe intimated, "I really think Tesla is missing a golden opportunity with a small to midsize truck on the Model S chassis and drive train."
It isn't that this is a bad idea. Tesla Motors could definitely build a pickup or van or Ranchero/El Camino/Caballero inspired vehicle on the Generation II platform. There are good reasons it should not be done, though.
This is the high end, Premium platform, meant for all aluminum construction. It would be far too expensive for what it accomplished, or was capable of doing. It would further solidify the standing of Tesla Motors vehicles being 'Toys for The RICH!' -- poser-mobiles for urban designer cowboys -- and nothing more in the eyes of Naysayers.
This would end up being a low volume subset of Model S sales. It would have limited appeal (though I'd be proud to have one). That would be embarrassing to Tesla Motors, since so many insist their plans for mass market sales are [BOLSHEVIK]. The resultant attitude may turn away potential buyers of a truly mass market pickup vehicle to come.
Toyota and Nissan already tried it that way, and it didn't work. Because of that, Mazda knew better than to try. The original Toyota Tundra was technically 'full sized', but was still a Tacoma under the skin. Likewise, the Nissan Titan was perceived as merely an up sized version of their mid-sized truck series. Both paled in direct comparison to F-150, Silverado, and RAM offerings. They may be a lot better vehicles today, but F-150 sales have only continued to soar to ever-higher levels since the newcomers were introduced. Their market share is nigh nonexistent in comparison.
Tesla Motors learns from the mistakes of others as well. When Tesla builds a pickup, it must be full sized, with superior cargo capacity, extreme range, superb utility, and excellent towing capability. Any show of weakness before hand will be detrimental to future growth. Better to wait until they can do it right.
Put a Tesla electric rail gun in the back window. Who would buy an ICE pickup once they saw one of those in action?
buddyroe suggested, "You people must not live in the South."
I do not live there. I did grow up there. In the thirty years since I graduated High School in Mississippi, things haven't changed much regarding pickup trucks. I have observed their being primarily used for work purposes as daily drivers.
Often you couldn't see the paint, because they were splattered with mud all over. Even the bed of a pickup would be caked in mud. If someone were to actually clean their truck, it would just expose the spots where the body had rusted through. I learned that's why there would always be a 4x8 sheet of 1/2" thick plywood in the back of some pickups.
Here in Los Angeles, a work truck will typically have a business or contractor name on the doors. Otherwise, the pickups are largely show cars. Way too shiny. Way too clean. Covered with pretty, shiny bits. Never introduced to sand, gravel, dirt, or mud. 4x4s that have never gone further off road than the front lawn.
Lucrative or not, I'm not interested in impressing the posers. They will come anyway. It must be a real, fully functional pickup truck to be a truly successful endeavor.
Well observed Red Sage.
It would make sense to build a unibody Ridgeline truck first as it could be built on an existing platform. They may not be able to hold tons of rocks or whatever, but would be popular for the non-poseurs.
Later a dedicated factory could be built to manufacture a big full-framed F-150 sort of truck. Then have cowboy-voice ads and all that.
Both markets are big, no need to choose one over the other.
There's no reason why a unibody truck cannot be full sized. Traditional automobile manufacturers like to mix-n-match the front cabin with a variety of different rear end solutions. So pickups, bobtails, dumptrucks, campers, and flatbeds share the exact same sub-assembly. Tesla Motors is free to design each vehicle they sell for a specific application, without a separate bed. Please note the Chevrolet Avalanche and Cadillac Escalade EXT are both unibody crew cab pickups.
Less than 13,400 Ridgeline, and under 150 of Avalanche and Escalade XTS combined were sold in the US last year. The big bucks are in REAL pickups. Well over 750,000 Ford F-Series with another 530,000 Chevy Silverado pickups. The GMC Sierra at #4, step brother to the Chevy Silverado, outsold the #6 Toyota Tundra by around 90,000 units. A Tesla pickup cannot take half measures if it hopes to not be relegated to the anonymous status of Nissan Titan, or worse.
@Red Sage - You definitely are WAY out of touch with the South and pickup trucks these days. Accountants drive $75k Ford Raptors to work. You will rarely see a "ragged" out truck with a sheet of plywood in the back. People buy F250s and F350s to work. F150s are for show and hunting.
Want evidence? Go look at the sales numbers of trucks (all brands) in the the South. Heck even in all of America for that matter. Trucks are by far the #1 seller. You really think there are that many people that still work in manual labor/construction jobs that require a truck? Not hardly.
BTW - my son is a high school junior and drives an F150 SuperCrew. When his friends all show up to play basketball, guess what they ALL drive - TRUCKS! And guess what else - not a single one of them has a job. Heck, my son has never put a single thing in the bed of his truck. He worked to get himself some chrome rims and some Nitto Tarra Grappler tires, a lift kit, and a bull bar. Oh, and some smoke headlights and tail lights. Trust me - it's all about the look. Nothing to do with work. This ain't 1980 any more. Ford doesn't sell $75k Raptors so people can ruin them by using them for work. It's about vanity. Trucks sell. Dogs love trucks! (and so do guys).
Expect Tesla to fully exploit the advantages of EV and not just build a conventional pickup with a battery. Repeating my self, that includes a low floor.
Many pickups are used to haul motorcycles or ATVs to the desert. They have to be ramped up to the bed. My own experience is hauling horse buggies; again the standard high bed makes it a challenge to load. There is a market for a low-bed pickup and we will see them. But not soon.
@cmcnestt -"the image they portray" - uhh, like I said, VANITY. Maybe you didn't read the last part. "Trust me - it's all about the look." "It's about vanity."
And my gosh Tesla is selling so many cars and making so much money that they can chose NOT to sell a particular style of vehicle because of the image it MIGHT portray. Ok, tell me this. Ford is considered a working man's car company. How badly has selling $35-75k trucks for vanity hurt them? People are buying the hell out of them. In fact, the F150 is the best selling vehicle in the WORLD.
And how much work do you think goes on in the Honda Ridgeline? And, to take this a step further. Most SUVs around here have ONE person, 2 at the most, in them. People like the way they look. Yes, a lot buy them to haul their kids around, but both of my next door neighbors have brand new Ford Explorers - and both are retired and no one ever drives with them except their spouses.
And finally, who says a good looking truck can't also be a working man's truck. Heck, the F150 XLT is now over $30k. If Tesla can make a good looking truck that gets 200 miles, it WILL be a blue collar truck. People that do use trucks for work don't drive them on vacation. So, that's the perfect target customer for Tesla - people that use their vehicles locally.
There can't be anyone on this forum who thinks that Tesla shouldn't build a truck ASAP that lives in the South. Trucks are mega down here. And people will pay for them - plain and simple. Will they buy an electric truck. Now that I can't answer. The percentage of people that would are probably similar to the general percentage throughout the entire country. But, as far as gas savings, there is no better place than trucks to target for gas savings. Going after the BMW 3 series, Toyota Camry, and the Ford Fusion doesn't present people much of a gas savings. The Fusion gets 35 mpg in some models. If you drive 12-15k per year, you simply aren't saving much money on gas. What's the point. If you are driving a truck, you're getting at BEST 20 mpg. These people can cut their gas bill by a significant mount.
It's just a no-brainer to me.
@Buddy, why do you think tesla could make a gen-2 platform truck for $35k, when they can't get near that for the gen-2 platform model S?
By my understanding, "Model S" is a sedan, "D" is the dual version, and the "Model X" is a crossover. Ford owns "Model E" and will not let Tesla use it.
Would a Tesla truck be a "Model T" or does Ford still own that?
Larry, that's why I suggest Model P, as in pickup. Ford probably doesn't own the rights to 'Model T' any longer. That wouldn't stop them from filing an injunction anyway.
buddyroe, there is something you are missing here. If Tesla Motors makes their first impression on the truck buying public by focusing on inept poser-mobiles, they will forever be associated with that market segment, no matter how well they build trucks afterward. It may be a lucrative market, but it is also a very small one. Tesla would do better to enter a wider market with therir pickups.
Tesla made a great car that looked like a regular car but exceeded current expectations of cars in as many ways as they could. I don't think looking like a pickup while being significantly limited will cut it (even if many pickups are actually very limited cars that just LOOK like they can do more).
It seems the Model ≡ will also try to look like expected car designs (at least the first design on the Gen 3 platform will) - but it too will want to exceed expectations of all onlookers. And THEN Tesla would rather break existing preconceptions in innovative ways, move the industry on to something new.
grega, yes, I concur. There will someday be a new concept pick-up; maybe low bed with its advantages (wow, how about a camper?). Tesla was so wise to make a car-looking car. So very wise. A radical pickup (Model P?) is a long way off, if ever.
The point being missed here regarding a Ridgeline sort of truck is that it could be put into production far more quickly, alongside a car assembly line. It could be in production for years before the big truck factory is built.
I would not take previous Ridgeline sales as an indicator. The new model will be far more compelling. Let us see how that does before the concept is written off.
Even a very compelling Tesla full-sized pickup will be up against it. So much brand loyalty, the image thing, the noise, the monster-truck in miniature sort of thing...Toyota and Nissan, capable companies to be sure, have had a very hard time competing and seemingly have almost given up trying very hard.
And, if say Ford felt some heat they could put out a decent electric F-150 and I have no doubt Ford fans would buy it over even a superior Tesla alternative.
While I won't hope against you, I have minimal need for a low-bed pickup but lots of need for a high-clearance truck. I want clearance to get over things. I'm on a trip now with my 4X4 ICE, I would really much prefer to be doing this in a Tesla but I've spent most of the time off the grid and off paved and flat roads so a low-bed pickup would do me no good.
carlgo2 suggested, "And, if say Ford felt some heat they could put out a decent electric F-150 and I have no doubt Ford fans would buy it over even a superior Tesla alternative."
That, you see, is The PLAN I have in mind. Build something that is so good it dwarfs sales of Ridgeline, Avalanche, Frontier, and Tacoma -- combined -- practically overnight, while being statistically superior to full sized trucks in Class III for only slightly more money than a fully loaded Class I truck. My Brother wants a fully electric, 220 kWh, Supercharger enabled, Ford F150 Supercrew right NOW -- but it doesn't exist. If there were a Tesla equivalent to a Ford F450 he would mortgage his children to get it.
Nissan Frontier and Toyota Tacoma, or versions for their market segment, have been around for decades. The Ridgeline doesn't come close to their sales numbers. Combined, the three of them don't come close to RAM, Silverado, and F-Series total sales. Thus, the more capable trucks, which can command higher price points, should be the target for fully electric trucks.
There is a broader market of potential customers for full sized trucks. Higher price points bring a greater likelihood of achieving profitability on a per unit basis. The larger frame could accommodate the weight of batteries more easily. Since higher priced trucks are generally judged by their tow rating and range the immediate, smooth application of available torque for the electrics would be an awesome selling point. The higher capacity battery packs would allow superb range, even while towing.
When it comes to deploying a truck program, it is more important to address doing it right, in an impressive fashion, than it is to introduce a product for immediate release. It is imperative that pricing be in an affordable range, appropriate for the market segment. It is less urgent to attack the low end, in pricing and capability, as that market can wait. Once traditional automobile manufacturers decide to also offer fully electric full sized trucks the mission is complete, because their own customers will demand more of the same.
100% a real truck. Elon specifically said Ford F-150. Sure they could build a car with a truck body on the S/X chassis, but they should wait until after they build a real truck.
A low bed floor, and good ground clearance are not mutually exclusive. I'm sure the truck will still have a flat floor mounted battery, a frunk, and at least dual motors. I think they'll do independent air suspension, with a big range of adjustable height, maybe even quad motors. Torque vectoring could make it almost unstoppable off-road, especially with adjustable suspension.
"quad motors. Torque vectoring could make it almost unstoppable off-road, especially with adjustable suspension"
Now you're talking about a truck! I also agree with Red Sage the they should probably start high-end, not commodity like the F-150 - even though I'd prefer a more affordable vehicle to beat up offroad.
Should be as capable as an F-150 to start with. With the added advantage of a six-way plug box and extra cargo, so contractors can leave their homes every morning with all the saws, screw guns, mitre saws, and jam boxes full on power and the pickup ready to drive across the county and frame a house and able to recharge the tools or plug them in as the work day goes along. Leave the generators at home.. 1/2 a million first year.. And oh yeah, must have 1/2 ton tongue weight to take the bassboat to the lake and not short out when dumping it in the lake to keep the ladies from making fun of you...
The S-!0 or Ranger versions could follow. How they could do it. I do not know...
plus 1 Red Sage (if that's a *like his comments on the subject)