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LR RWD gradually back down to ~310 miles after 325 update

LR RWD gradually back down to ~310 miles after 325 update

Has anyone else received the 325 mile update now seeing it back down to 310? For me this wasn't instant, its been gradual in the 6k miles driven since the update. Now at 21K miles on odo. I've done a "battery re-calibration" on my own which didnt change anything.

beaver | 05. Juni 2019

Mine has dropped from a max of 315 to as low as 309 (range before update).

jamespompi | 05. Juni 2019

I'm hoping its software related and not true degradation. It seems like it would be just software considering I haven't really heard of any AWD guys with more than ~5 miles of loss and I didnt experience any loss for first 15k miles prior to the update.

vmulla | 05. Juni 2019

Some of us never saw the bump to 325 to begin with.

Average efficiency over the life of the car is 246wh/m - if it matters.

jamespompi | 05. Juni 2019

@vmulla Im also about that (245wh/m), but i've averaged around 220wh/m since the update

vmulla | 05. Juni 2019

@jamespompi, I'd attribute that drop in what/m to the weather. I had sub 200wh/m last summer, as low as 179wh/m -- that was many many updates ago.
I'm not are where you live, but factor in the weather too.

beaver | 05. Juni 2019

Make sure to charge to 90% a few times and even better drive it down to 20% and charge to 90% to calibrate the system

TexasBob | 05. Juni 2019

FWIW. I am still at 258 @ 80% = 321. Wife's car still at 260 @80% = 325. Running 16.2.

(I would note that main difference in our two Model 3s is that mine has been charged to 100% on several occasions and wife's car has never been charged above 80%. I think this has a bigger impact on degradation than I originally appreciated. Neither car has been to supercharger more than 3-4 times in past year. Both relatively low mileage in first year.)

weluvm3 | 05. Juni 2019

Maybe it is due to driving style?

M3G | 05. Juni 2019

Mostly I’ve been getting 296 @90%, which is 329 at 100%.

danieldtn | 05. Juni 2019

How do you dictate 80 or 90 % level of charge? Is that corresponding to the bars shown on the battery in the phone app and on the car's monitor?

gmr6415 | 06. Juni 2019

Assuming I received the bump it only added 4 miles to 314. It slowly creeped down to 308 at a full charge. Last weekend we went on a long trip and hit 10 superchargers. Now the battery indicator is back up to the original 310 on a full charge. I know because I fell asleep at a supercharger, and when I woke up it was at 100% - 310 miles on the indicator.

Yes I had it set at 100% because we were on the road. Although we have never charged to 100% at a supercharger, well, I fell asleep at about 11:00 pm while charging.

I don't really think any of this matters. With the cruise control set @ 75 mph for most of the trip, the tires @ 45 psi cold, the AC set on 74˚, outside temperature at 94˚ and above during the day (two people with luggage and a cooler) our LR RWD averaged 220 Wh/mi for the trip.

The usable capacity of the battery is debatable, but most agree it's near 75kWh. That's close to 340 miles of actual range if we were to drive from 100% to 0%.

There is no disappointment in those numbers. It's better than I expected at 17k miles on the car.

jamespompi | 06. Juni 2019

After reading a post on TMC, I've decided to set up a service appointment and contacted them to verify if I had an impacted VIN. My car was built in July 2018 so it falls within the service bulletin parameters.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/battery-replacement.141959/page-3

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2018/MC-10148848-9999.pdf

Passion2Fly | 06. Juni 2019

Never had a jump to 325 miles on my LR RWD.
20k miles after purchase, my car charges to 304 miles. 2% degradation after the first year. Totally normal...

jamespompi | 06. Juni 2019

@Passion2Fly 304/325 is like a 6.5% loss not a 2% one. Although the trend of S and X are similar, model 3's BMS and cell chemistry is much improved. Most 3 owners have no degradation.

SalisburySam | 06. Juni 2019

Currently getting about 320-mile range, i.e., 256 miles @ 80%. LR RWD, 07/18 delivery, firmware 16.2.

LA-Fohlen | 06. Juni 2019

I got bumped up to 314 miles but over the past month I'm down to under 300 miles.

Passion2Fly | 06. Juni 2019

@james
As I said, as reported by numerous owners, I never had a 325 miles bump. I’m referencing everything to 310 miles baseline...

gmr6415 | 06. Juni 2019

@jamespompi, Mine is an August 2018 build. I contacted Tesla and they stated mine is not in the VIN range for battery replacement. I had actually asked for a link to a list of VINs that were affected, but they never provided that information...only stating mine was not.

@Passion2Fly, I don't think you can depend on the battery indicator to calculate any kind of degradation. It's an estimate based on algorithms that look at who knows what.

For example, mine was creeping downward by a few miles from the original 310, and after a weekend of supercharging it's right back to where it was the day I picked up my car last August. As far as I know LI batteries can't be conditioned like NIMH batteries to restore degradation, so I don't see what the continuous supercharging did over a 2000 mile trip other than result in some sort of recalibration of the indicator.

LA-Fohlen | 06. Juni 2019

I don't really look at the indicator itself but get my data from the battery report of Teslafi. For the first 6 months of ownership the battery range was quite stable with the bump in March to 314 miles. A month ago then the range decreased and I'm not at around 5% degradation. It could be just normal but I will keep an eye on it. Too bad this started happening just that I prepare for the first road trip.

jdcollins5 | 06. Juni 2019

Mine originally jumped to 319 after the update. It drifted as high as 321 but has since drifted back down to about 315. I have done a couple of 15-20% to 100% Superchargers during this time so calibration should be good.

CASEMAN | 07. Juni 2019

I was charging up to 260 miles at 80% shortly after the bump. I am now consistently seeing 245 miles at 80%. LR RWD. Picked up 6/1/18 and 9500 miles.

GreenCommuter | 07. Juni 2019

For the miles estimate on the dashboard of my LR AWD (picked up in Dec 18), I have 252 miles at 85% (equivalent to 296 miles at 100%). My lifetime energy consumption is 212wh/m over about 8500 miles here in SoCal... I have never re-calibrated the battery though, always charge to around 85% and used down to around 64%. So I am not sure if it's a 7% battery degradation or just need to re-calibrate the computer...

vmulla | 07. Juni 2019

If the range was 310 to start with, what's the logic in assuming that the battery degraded because the range now shows 310 instead of 325?

I never liked the way Tesla claimed increased range via an ota update - there was just too little info shared on how to interpret that claim, or what to expect. To make things worse not everyone is seeing consistent changes in range after the update.

I'm not happy because my car didn't see the range upgrade.

BUT, the car was sold as 310mile range car. It's only fair to judge the car against a 310m baseline.

beaver | 07. Juni 2019

Don’t worry about range unless you properly calibrated by driving down to 20% and charging to 90% a few times. If you are charging to a lower SOC then your range calibration may be off.

bj | 08. Juni 2019

Do people here understand that the range estimate is just that - an estimate - and it is based on recent driving efficiency as well as battery capacity. If it goes down it is almost entirely due to changes in recent driving efficiency (e.g. lead foot, use of climate control, hilly driving) and essentially none of it is due to battery degradation?

Some are unnecessarily obsessing... you guys don’t know what battery degradation is unless you’ve owned a LEAF.

vmulla | 08. Juni 2019

@BJ,
Hmmmm.. No
The car has a range of 310, after the update the range is 310. So what changed? Certainly not driving habits, or car usage.
Oh, and to remove any doubt we have a wh/m measure to check. If wh/m is holding steady, and still the software update is not doing much for the range then what gives??

Magic 8 Ball | 08. Juni 2019

Biggest impact on range estimate seems to be temperature and there is no evidence driving habits have anything to do with the estimate on a TESLA. The fact is TESLA could send an update to make the number say anything you want.

There are established methods to determine degradation and looking at an estimated range is not part of it.

bj | 08. Juni 2019

@vmulla - “The car has a range of 310, after the update the range is 310. So what changed? Certainly not driving habits, or car usage”

If after the update the range is the same then you’ve answered your own question. Nothing has changed.

bj | 08. Juni 2019

“There are established methods to determine degradation and looking at an estimated range is not part of it.”

For once I agree with @M8B.

LA-Fohlen | 08. Juni 2019

We are talking about the rated miles and not the estimated miles based on driving habits. The rated miles with the Model 3 started at 310 miles. Sometimes in March Tesla introduced through OTA increased rated miles up to 325 for the LR RWD. If this numbers are lower now it should represent battery degradation unless there is an imbalance in the battery.
I can see that e.g. temperatures might impact the rated miles.

vmulla | 08. Juni 2019

@BJ,
I was saying that nothing has changed , but it should have. You're basically agreeing to the conditions that would make your own hypothesis invalid.

If the range is the same after the update as before
If the driving habits are consistent
If the weather is not playing a factor
If it's a relatively new car (certainly the case with 3s)
Then, Tesla's claimed range bump should have happened after the ota update
If not, something is off

Considering that many of us are experiencing the 'if not' situation, I'm saying Tesla did a poor job communicating to the owners about the exceptions.

Tesla claimed a win on broad terms with the ota range upgrade, many are happy - but that left many others wondering what the heck is happening with their cars that did not see range uptick. Are these cars an exception? Did these cars experience battery degradation? (unlikely) Was some kind of calibration needed? Is the range 'loss' within spec for warranty concerns? Should these cars be checked by Tesla?

I'm calling out Tesla for poor communication, not for range 'loss' - and that's basically because I have faith in the product quality.

bj | 08. Juni 2019

@vmulla - if others received an update that changed the range estimate presented on screen, but your update did not do that, then who knows? Maybe you didn’t receive exactly the same software update the others did. Maybe the hardware in your car is different to the hardware in cars that did show an increase, and so the outcome is different or the software makes no difference on your particular hardware variant. I suggest you take it up with Tesla if you want to find out.

But as @M8B says - Tesla could tweak its software to present any number it likes on the screen as the range estimate. It could say the range is 800km if they wanted too. And it would be right, provided you drove on the flat at a steady 40 km/h all the time. Which is why it is so pointless to obsess about the number on the screen.

vmulla | 09. Juni 2019

@BJ,
Well, we do know several of the things you suggested could be different. We know because we share these things as a community in this forum. I have 2 other threads that crowdsourced range increases after OTA update, the software version applied. The info from those threads suggests there are quite a few people who are seeing range discrepancies after the update - this thread exists to share such occurrences.
To say Tesla can tweak the software to show any number suggests that we should not really focus on the number, then why all the hoopla around the 'range increase'? Next, if Tesla is saying for LR-RWD the range will be increased - then deliver. It's Ok if there are a few exceptions, it maybe because of normal variance in production quality. BUT, unfortunately it's not a few isolated cases.

This is why I'm calling out Tesla for bad communication. Because of that poor communication we can expect people assuming ~3% degradation in battery (cannot be true), and we can expect many service center calls from anxious owners.

40milecommuter | 15. Juni 2019

July 2018 LR RWD - 2019.20.1 - 17,816 miles

305 miles @100% charge

lilbean | 15. Juni 2019

11,000 miles 324 12.1.2

-TheJohn- | 05. August 2019

15k miles. Made on July 8th 2018 and eagerly taken charge an LR RWD on August 8th 2018 after 866 days of waiting.
300 mile 100% current max stated charge despite several attempts to reset (drain to 1-2%, charge to max, rinse repeat 1-2 times). Never saw any max state of charge above 313ish either so no bump that I noticed when they pushed the 5% increase to the LR version.

Really I should set it to Kilometers and give our brains more exercise.

gmr6415 | 05. August 2019

Can someone point out, based on release notes, an OTA that extended range? EM tweeted that it would happen, but didn't say when. Subsequent to that tweet we received two separate updates stating 5% increase in performance, but there has never been an updated specifically noting an increase in range from 310 to 325 miles.

You would think that being something that significant it would be noted in the release notes.

VeeBee | 12. September 2019

I have a Model 3 LR RWD (325 mile range) that I bought in March 2019. Up until say three weeks ago, charging to 80% showed the range as 260-262 and charging it to 90% showed the range as 291-293 (80% of 325 = 260 and 90% of 325 = 292.5).

Now, over the past 2 weeks or so, charging to 80% has dropped from 260ish to 257 to 255. Similarly, 90% dropped from 290ish to 287 to 285. I contacted the service center and they asked me to bring the battery down to 10-15% and then charge it to 90% and leave it unplugged for a while so it can re-calibrate. I did that and charging to 90% just showed the range as 282 after completion...:/

My driving/charging habits have not changed. The only thing I can think of is that my car was not receiving updates a few weeks ago, so I took it in just before I started noticing the drop and they had pushed 2019.28.3.1 on it. I have noticed the range drop ever since. The numbers seem to be more in sync with the 310 range AWD. Is this something to worry about? Is it possible that the tech that pushed the update to my car probably thought it was a 310 range AWD and screwed something up? Btw, I only have about 8200 miles on it.

Magic 8 Ball | 12. September 2019

@VeeBee No it is not something to worry about.

The range estimate is just an estimate.

M3BlueGeorgia | 12. September 2019

I never ever saw the 325 (LR/RWD built June-18).
Never anything more that 310, though now down around 304 after 27K miles.

beaver | 12. September 2019

I am down to 302 miles at 100% for my LR RWD with 37,000 miles

beaver | 12. September 2019

Highest I saw was 315 miles, so loss of 4.1% from max to current according to TeslaFi

CST | 12. September 2019

I'm at about 310 miles - I think I extrapolated up to 315 once after the update.

ReD eXiLe ms us | 12. September 2019

Is your Model 3 Long Range RWD displaying less than 228 miles range available when charged to 100%?

Less than 205 miles range at 90%?

Less than 195 miles range at either?

No...?

Ah. Then you don't have a problem. Carry on.

M3phan | 12. September 2019

(Doesn’t really mean anything but...) Mine shows 257 miles at 80%, so approx 321 at 100%