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Tesla boss Elon Musk wins defamation trial over his 'pedo guy' tweet

Tesla boss Elon Musk wins defamation trial over his 'pedo guy' tweet

Tesla boss Elon Musk wins defamation trial over his 'pedo guy' tweet
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-musk-lawsuit/tesla-boss-elon-musk-win...

Now we can get back to the business at hand.

kthnxbye.

Edit: Changed title

from: Elon Musk found not guilty in defamation lawsuit
to: Tesla boss Elon Musk wins defamation trial over his 'pedo guy' tweet

Magic 8 Ball | 06. Dezember 2019

Prolly should have not told Elon where he can stick his sub.

M3phan | 06. Dezember 2019

Elon rightly won because his tweet did not meet even the minimum standards of defamation. Glad the jury saw that.

“TESLA MODEL 3!” (Saying that to meet the minimum standard to keep this post on this forum)
; )

raqball | 06. Dezember 2019

M3phan | December 6, 2019
Elon rightly won because his tweet did not meet even the minimum standards of defamation. Glad the jury saw that.
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I didn't think they'd find against him but you never know what a jury will do....

Bighorn | 06. Dezember 2019

The jury laughed it out of the courthouse and that was after culling the potential jurors who wanted to work for Tesla or SpaceX.

calvin940 | 06. Dezember 2019

"you never know what a jury will do"
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it's clear that after only 45 minutes of deliberation there was not nearly enough there legally to find him guilty.

raqball | 06. Dezember 2019

calvin940 | December 6, 2019
"you never know what a jury will do"
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it's clear that after only 45 minutes of deliberation there was not nearly enough there legally to find him guilty.
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Agree... 45 minutes means they had already decided, no debate and that was the time it took ot vote and fill out the paperwork..

Bighorn | 06. Dezember 2019

I hope Vern has to reimburse everyone for this charade and monumental waste of time and money.

billlake2000 | 06. Dezember 2019

Now that would be karma

spuzzz123 | 06. Dezember 2019

Interesting verdict. Wonder if the legal system was concerned that, if elon lost this suit it might have opened the floodgates of thousands of new civil cases of Twitter slander. Hell half of what I see on Twitter is slander.

RoadDevil | 07. Dezember 2019

“If it does not fit, you must acquit” ? ! ?

inconel | 07. Dezember 2019

His lawyers must have convinced Vern that $190mm was assured because the other guy was rich.

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

He probably was sick of being called “Hey Vern!” and saw this as an opportunity for a name change.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

I thought his name was Pedo Guy???

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

The guy well never be able to go anywhere without people saying "hey it's Pedo Guy", poetic justice is often the best justice.

SamO | 07. Dezember 2019

Lots wrong with this thread.

1. Op should be changed to “not liable” since guilt is associated with criminal, not civil cases.

2. The legal system didn’t provide this verdict. A jury did and found that not all elements of libel were satisfied, namely that pedomguy didn’t refer to a named individual. Namely the subtweet defense.

3. The jury took less than 20 minutes to make their determination. It wasn’t about how much he asked for (a ridiculously disproportionate sum).

Shusterman told me that the judge gave them clear instructions on how to determine defamation and that it had to clear five points. The main sticking point was that the jury could not determine "acquaintance." That means: Can a reasonable person who read Musk's tweets know for sure it was about Unsworth? The jury decided that the person couldn't and based their decision mainly on that. They were unanimous on this and moved quickly once establishing (less than an hour). Musk's defense team led made it a clear argument that Musk's "pedo guy" tweet never mentioned Unsworth by name. That ended up being the key.“

https://twitter.com/RMac18/status/1203106211001819136?s=20

The above quote was from an interview with a juror (double Tesla owner) who is also a lawyer.

bjrosen | 07. Dezember 2019

It was an open and shut case of defamation. Musk accused the guy of being a child molester with absolutely no proof and he did it out of malice. I think the reason that Musk won the case was because the plaintiff demanded such an outrageous amount of money that that he offended the jury. If he had asked for 3 million dollars instead of 190 million dollars then he would have won, but demanding 190 million made him look like he was just doing it for the money. The plaintiff also made a mistake by suing Musk in the US instead of the UK. The plaintiff is a British subject and this was an international case given that he was in Thailand at the time. The UK has far far stronger libel laws than they US, I suspect that he filed in the US because he thought that American juries were so much more generous but it was a strategic mistake.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

@bjrosen Did you read the post just above yours? Yes the money was outrageous but that was not the reason for laughing the guy and his dumbass lawyer out of the sacred halls of justice.

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019
Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

Looks like the haters are triggered since they were so totally wrong the entire time.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

"Suffice that legal experts generally conclude...."

Suffice that dumbass legal morons generally conclude.......

Fixed it for you, no charge.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

Legal system did the country a solid allowing this to become a high profile smackdown.

My faith is restored in humanity ; )

Tronguy | 07. Dezember 2019

Read quite a bit about this over on Arstechnica. Agreed: the lawyer who happened to be on the jury (everybody gets called sooner or later) said that they the jurors got stuck on who the tweet was directed at. This was in the jury instructions.
Second interesting thing: Turns out that in Musks youth in Pretoria, "Pedo" was slang for a creepy old guy; no sex involved. Not that I'm exactly excusing Musk for throwing insults, but what he meant by Pedo and what the general population of the USA understands what Pedo means are, apparently, two different things.
Third interesting thing: Musk didn't go looking for a PI. The PI (who turned out not to actually be a PI, but was rather a con man) approached Musk with the claim that the (fake) PI had data on Unsworth. Musk was fooled for a bit, but that changes the dynamic a bit, doesn't it?
Not that the two of them weren't throwing insults at each other. And it looks like Unsworth started it with a "stick it up your ass" statement; both of them were being childish.
Finally: I've been up for jury duty several times and served twice, once on a criminal trial and once on a civil. My experiences, I'm sure, are strictly anecdotal (i.e., they happened to me, specifically, and nobody else). But in both cases the lawyers are definitely talking to the jury in a trial and nobody else. Both trials lasted about a week and there was a _tremendous_ amount of information being listed and looked at. Think of it: In an 8 hour day in the trial, roughly six hours were spent focused on what was going on in front of one. And that went on for roughly five or six days in both trials. All the jurors I served with took the instructions dead seriously. And as far as demeanor: You've never seen such a bunch of poker faces. Unlike the Movies, the jurors really were trying to work out the facts of the cases before them and cared about doing the right thing.
There's a lot of blather after the public reporting of practically any case reported on the news. To which I always say: You weren't there, in the court room, listening to the details of the case. I think that juries get it right far more often than people think they do.

Tronguy | 07. Dezember 2019

One last comment. On one of the threads around here somebody made a joke; two or three posters immediately following didn't get it, although others did, and there was finally a post that said, "Tough crowd..".
You ain't never seen a tough crowd until you've seen a jury in action.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

Vern, Pedo Guy, moron was not a hero and far from it. The guy was a cave mapper and had knowledge of the cave. The moron tried to grandstand his involvement and drag the rescue out for over a year. Must lit the fire and forced action. The sub may or may not have worked, the result was the divers were pushed to get up from drinking tea all day long while they watched the weather.

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

Apparently watching Matlock doesn't qualify you as a legal authority.

His role was calling a friend who had experience.
"He recommended that the Thai government seek help from divers in the United Kingdom, and Unsworth called friend and fellow diver Rob Harper. Harper, who had just returned from exploring Thai caves with Unsworth, brought two other divers, John Volanthen and Rick Stanton, to help with the rescue."

" It concedes that Unsworth was not involved in the final planning stages of the rescue because he didn’t have enough experience to make the dive."

"Hero UK diver" is a bit of a misnomer or delusion of grandeur, if that's his characterization

Tronguy | 07. Dezember 2019

Public Service Announcement:

FISHEV is a troll of several years standing and several user names whose agenda is to disrupt threads, insult posters, and, deflect the conversation off topic. Please avoid responding to his/her/its posts.

calvin940 | 07. Dezember 2019

Neat to see all the pretend legal experts in this thread.

Open and shut cases have legal merit. This one did not. Nice try bjrosen and Eagles. Change pretend careers.

@SAMO

That topic was actually the title of the article here:
https://www.axios.com/elon-musk-wins-court-defamation-lawsuit-cb004094-c...

but I'll change it nonetheless to the Reuters.

Magic 8 Ball | 07. Dezember 2019

@FISHEV Why did you change your name from EaglesPDX to FISHEV?

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi | 07. Dezember 2019

Some one is butthurt )

raqball | 07. Dezember 2019

FISHEV | December 7, 2019
"It was an open and shut case of defamation. Musk accused the guy of being a child molester with absolutely no proof and he did it out of malice."

Correct.

Judges all ruled case had merit which is why legal experts allowed the case to go forward as it was an is clear cut defamation.
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100% disagree...

The jury didn't even debate as coming back with a ruling in 45 min is an instant all agreed no dice..

Judges will not toss a case unless there is clear evidence that it's frivolous. Most judges will err on the side of the plaintiff and let the case go to trial....

Musk should have counter sued for attorney fees...

rxlawdude | 07. Dezember 2019

Wow, now @FISH is claiming legal expertise.

The scales of justice, my piscine friend, are piled way above your gills.

raqball | 07. Dezember 2019

FISHEV | December 7, 2019
Musk admitted calling the guy a "pedo" and even apologized. He got away with it with a US jury is best you can say.
---------------------------------
According to a jury, he got away with nothing and justice, per our system, was served...

I think Musk should have counter sued for attorney fees..

yudansha™ | 07. Dezember 2019

Does this mean I can call somebody a pedo if I don’t mention HIS username? Cool.

FISHEV | 07. Dezember 2019

"According to a jury, he got away with nothing and justice, per our system, was served..."

And juries often send guilty people to die and free murderers. It's a chance at justice, not a guarantor. Ever see a person you know was guilty get off?

Just going by Musk's own admission. Yes he called Unsworth a pedo. Musk admitted it and apologized.

raqball | 07. Dezember 2019

FISHEV | December 7, 2019
Just going by Musk's own admission. Yes he called Unsworth a pedo. Musk admitted it and apologized.
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It's not a matter of if he said it, if it was inappropriate, or if he apologized for it.. It's a matter of law and the jury quickly said NO DICE to defamation... Case closed...

raqball | 07. Dezember 2019

FISHEV | December 7, 2019
risked it in US because the case was so clear cut
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The jury did in fact think it was clear cut as it only took them 45 minutes to reach a verdict.. That's lightning fast in jury verdict time...

Joshan | 07. Dezember 2019

I actually feel stupider after having read Fishs post of nonsense.

ReD eXiLe ms us | 07. Dezember 2019

FEESHICE is a Troll and is always wrong.

Rawballz is a Troll Collaborator.

Bonya is happily among the [IGNORED].

Elon Musk is awesome.

I am your friendly neighborhood over-the-top optimistic Tesla certified apologist fanboy.

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi | 07. Dezember 2019

Maybe Fish/Eagle can tell us story how he reinstated himself from ban few years ago. Care to share your story?

Joshan | 07. Dezember 2019

you have to prove monetary damages idiot. Hurt feelings don't count.

ReD eXiLe ms us | 07. Dezember 2019

Fascism: To Punish and Enslave.

FUDsterism: To Obfuscate and Confuse.

Trolldom: To Lie and keep Lying.

FANBOYism: To Defend and Inform.

FISHEV | 07. Dezember 2019

"you have to prove monetary damages idiot. Hurt feelings don't count."

"Presumed Damages. Presumed damages (also called assumed damages) are those that, in the eyes of the law, necessarily result from the publication of some kinds of defamatory matter (they are presumed to exist). In other words, even if the plaintiff cannot prove actual damages, the court can assume that the plaintiff has suffered harm to his or her REPUTATION or some other loss."

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

I prefer my hero divers to get wet.

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

Did someone say “triggered”?

spuzzz123 | 07. Dezember 2019

Public Service Announcement:
FISHEV is a troll whose agenda is to disrupt threads, insult posters, and, deflect the conversation off topic. Please avoid responding to his/her/its posts.

FISHEV | 07. Dezember 2019

"I prefer my hero divers to get wet."

Thai kids owe their lives to Unsworth as UK and Thai governments and all those involved agree.

Musk calling him a pedophile was a black mark on Musk no matter what jury says on defamation.

Bighorn | 07. Dezember 2019

FISH is bothered by reminders that he’s out of step with the human race.

TexasBob | 07. Dezember 2019

Useful take on this from Reuters. “I think defendants in modern defamation cases are likely to point to the vitriolic no-holds-barred nature of modern social media, cable TV, and political discourse, in contending that many words and accusations formerly considered defamatory are now understood only as mere opinions, not factual assertions,” Lawyer who specializes in defamation.

IOW, the jury recognized Twitter is a cesspool of childish name calling and general incivility, People who choose to swim in the cesspool will get stinky. Nothing personal.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-musk-lawsuit-landscape/musks-defamati...

SamO | 07. Dezember 2019

Someone should explain the elements of defamation to the legally handicapped on this thread. Hint: just because you hate someone, doesn’t mean they are liable for damages.

The corollary of this is: when you tell someone to shove a sub up their ass, expect to be Insulted in return.

Also, google unclean hands.

https://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=2182

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