Title says it all

hcwhy | 03. Dezember 2019

Mike 83: Thanks for the link.

SamO | 03. Dezember 2019

Cross posting this. More evidence for Tesla’s stability compared to their peers.

Altman-Z scores (bankruptcy likelyhood ratings) for various automakers. High = bankruptcy unlikely; low = bankruptcy likely:

1.91 Tesla
1.84 Honda
(financial distress zone is any score below 1.81)
1.77 Toyota
1.38 Nissan
1.35 Fiat Chrysler
1.14 Volkswagen
1.09 Daimler
1.09 GM
0.95 Ford
0.79 BMW
-4.36 NIO

The score is of the form:
Z = 1.2X1 + 1.4X2 + 3.3X3 + 0.6X4 + 1.0X5.
X1 = working capital / total assets. Measures liquid assets in relation to the size of the company.
X2 = retained earnings / total assets. Measures profitability that reflects the company's age and earning power.
X3 = earnings before interest and taxes / total assets. Measures operating efficiency apart from tax and leveraging factors. It recognizes operating earnings as being important to long-term viability.
X4 = market value of equity / book value of total liabilities. Adds market dimension that can show up security price fluctuation as a possible red flag.
X5 = sales / total assets. Standard measure for total asset turnover (varies greatly from industry to industry).

ht/James Stephenson

acegreat1 | 03. Dezember 2019

Sooooo...... Is it time to buy more???? ;)

SamO | 03. Dezember 2019

Probably time to sell the other OEMs.

Mike83 | 03. Dezember 2019

Good news for investors; not so for short selling gamblers.

NKYTA | 03. Dezember 2019

“@NTYKA "Both SamO and Matthew98 have kids, and are respected people. And both are passionate about the Mission."

Both are unmitigated negative trolls. Seriously nasty human beings unless they are substantially different in real life compared to this forum. A lot of us have kids. So? Does not excuse their behavior here.”

Both are unmitigated Tesla fans, on a Tesla forum where they believe in Tesla’s Mission Statement. I do too.
Fixed that for you.
Both of them believe that the “collective we” are ruining our environment, so I can agree with them there.

I interact with them daily, even though we are geographically diverse.

SamO can be to the point which bothers some folks, but he can be counted on as a good friend in good times and bad. Solid.

Matthew98 has a twisted take on the world and wicked smart set of kids. I would be worse off not knowing him.

DarthAmerica is a known troll and a paid shill. Otherwise he wouldn’t keep up the facade, continuously. If you can’t recognize that, well....

Feel free to call me when the Taycan is a reality, on the track “winning”, in owners homes, or can travel easily cross country.

I’ll wait for the first two. The third seems very unlikely and is sad. #NotWinning

What do your kids think about AGW?

Mike83 | 07. Dezember 2019

@NKYTA Nicely said. Getting to know various personalities from posts has been a pleasure for me. Many of us have been owners for over 6 ;years and have heard and seen it all. We know who can't be trusted. I enjoy good jokes along with some useful information and have been well satisfied with our Tesla vehicles. We Trust the brand and the company more than any other in the world.
I also have more hope for humanity as Elon recently said when judged by a jury and it casts light on the enemies of Tesla exposing their nasty tactics. Momentum has shifted. I am sticking with the winners and hope the losers open their eyes to living in a better world. The paradigm shift to a cleaner and safer future is in the cards worldwide now.
Now back to our travels in our Tesla enjoying the beauty of America. A great time to be alive.
Can't wait to try out the 250 kWh Superchargers which are popping up all over.
Now we will be saving to buy the Cybertruck and if the stock goes up to it's real value a Roadster II may be in the cards.
The grin is huge ;-)

Silver2K | 10. Dezember 2019

PCG is rocking!

Bighorn | 10. Dezember 2019

They "only" have to pay $13.5B to fire victims. Great for the bottom line!

Silver2K | 10. Dezember 2019

that was good news.

on tdameritrade

*PG&E shares are trading higher on continued strength after the company on Monday announced a $13.5 billion settlement with CA wildfire victims.

Bighorn | 10. Dezember 2019

I know--the unknown of the downside was depressing the price apparently.

Silver2K | 10. Dezember 2019

they're making money and if they get into trouble, they will get bailed out.

I should have listened to my bro-in-law on thanksgiving when it was $8.

I didn't listen on a pharma stock and it shot up 80% in less than a week...

Bighorn | 10. Dezember 2019

You've also got to be able to sleep at night. Neither industry is particularly upright. I hedged with an oil ETF once and not only did I feel dirty, but lost money. Some crazy tax implications with a Schedule K as well.

SamO | 10. Dezember 2019

Thanks NKYTA.

Tesla hittin’ three fiddy.

Take a gander at PD’s hot takes on Tesla stock over the years. Delicious troll tears.

Mike83 | 11. Dezember 2019

OH WOW. Jim Cramer is now drinking the Kool Aid. He even shows a Tesla M3 in a video they are also getting the Tesla roof and likes the financials. Looks like Jim has come around.
First they ignore you, they they ridicule you, then they fight you, then they build a statue to you,,,,or something like that.

NKYTA | 11. Dezember 2019

Then you win.

Tropopause | 12. Dezember 2019

Tesla hittin’ three siddy. ;)

Ohmster | 12. Dezember 2019

Tesla is now biggest holding in my 'go for broke' portfolio. :)

GoldAK47 | 12. Dezember 2019

Time to sell the stock. Now with the older versions losing 2 years of warranty overnight, prices of the used cars are going to drop since they will need $20k repairs soon. There will soon be tons of teslas on the market, and I personally know of 3 trucks cancelled today over this. I lost 2 years of warranty on a car I just bought because it had warranty.

NKYTA | 12. Dezember 2019


Bighorn | 12. Dezember 2019

He’s trolling several thread with BS. #TSLAQ

NKYTA | 12. Dezember 2019

Yup, noticed that.

inconel | 12. Dezember 2019

He's rights about tons of Teslas on the market though. One Model S is already about 2 tons.

Bighorn | 12. Dezember 2019

I think he’s confused the cancellations with the Taycan city car. Lots to keep track of.

Tropopause | 12. Dezember 2019

These Porsche trolls are short circuiting with all the Taycan shortcomings. I'm sure there are more Porsche surprises to come and the Taycan still isn't out yet.

sentabo | 12. Dezember 2019

I remember some trolls recommending selling when it was below $200/share three years ago. Where are they now?

jjs | 12. Dezember 2019

TSLA goes up, I smile. TSLA goes down, I stay calm. TSLA trolls spread FUD, I laugh. For some reason TSLA is my investment moment of Zen.

Mathew98 | 13. Dezember 2019

Someone is working OT in an oyster farm to offset his losses from the untimely short...

SamO | 13. Dezember 2019

I dont think he’s short. He doesn’t have the courage of his convictions.


Pungoteague_Dave | 13. Dezember 2019

SamO "Take a gander at PD’s hot takes on Tesla stock over the years. Delicious troll tears."

Again, SamO os pathetically lacking facts. I have never predicted TSLA share prices and have always been a Tesla supporter. I have spent many hour in support of the Tesla effort, including at their request, going with TEsl executives to Richmond to lobby the legislature and governor, who is a neighbor and acquaintance, to successfully gain outlets in Virginia. What have YOU done for TSLA except be an unquestioning fanboi? But keep making stuff up.

And no, Mathew98, as an investor and graduate finance/economics instructor, I know better than to short anything. I wouldn't in any case with respect to TSLA, as I believe that a high share price, whether or not reasonably justified by fundamentals, equals a lower cost of capital and better long term prospects. Being a believer in the EV cause and a fan (generally) of what Tesla has accomplished, I am long Tesla in ownership of several of their vehicles. Please lighten up, you nattering nabob of negativity. 8-)

Pungoteague_Dave | 13. Dezember 2019

@ Mathew98 - And the oyster farm isn't a material part of our finances as you indicate - it does provide a bunch of jobs and is a significant carbon sink, making our lives carbon negative on a net basis, with all profits pledged to the Chesapeake Bay Foundation. What material thing have YOU done for the environment lately? And please spare me the fanboi "I drive an EV" bs.

Pungoteague_Dave | 13. Dezember 2019

sorry about typos, fumble fingers.

SamO | 13. Dezember 2019

Dear Dave,

I've been reluctant to measure our comparative contributions to "the mission" . . . however,

1. I've given hundreds of rides in my car and I attend earth day each year in Compton to provide EV access to communities that have never seen, sat in or ridden in an EV.

2. I've owned three teslas and have a reservation for a Cybertruck.

3. I had a dozen referrals before there was even a referral program.

4. I was the first Tesla owner to go coast to coast and back in 2014 using the Tesla Supercharger Network in an S60.

5. I co-founded an advanced manufacturing school in 2008 which provides vocational training to wounded and disabled veterans which has graduated over 1000 students since it's founding.

6. There are now a total of 74 graduates placed at Elon Musk enterprises, between Tesla and SpaceX as welders or machinists. Graduation was yesterday so that number may have increased.

7. Our school has 4 Tesla vehicles used as shuttles for students without transportation and a Semi and two Cybertruck reservations for use as work vehicles.

8. I've also lobbied Rep. Adam Schiff directly, as well as other local politicians to prevent then-Governor Jerry Brown from cutting off tax credits to Tesla buyers.

9 . I have been interviewed or contributed numerous times to publications including Bloomberg, TheDrive, CityLab, Forbes, CleanTechnica and Electrek about my experiences owning or driving a Tesla.

10. I am a long-term TSLA shareholder.

I have hesitated to post my personal story in response to your constant bragging, because

1. you are an immensely unpleasant person who tries to make himself the hero of every story,

2. you constantly acts as if you are smarter than Elon Musk, and

3. It doesn't matter what I have done.

There is a Youtuber with 1,000 referrals who could argue he's done more for Tesla. But he doesn't because he is a decent person and just wants the mission to succeed. Same as me.


jimglas | 14. Dezember 2019

Respect SamO

NKYTA | 14. Dezember 2019


Tropopause | 16. Dezember 2019

A new 52-week high set today.

Tropopause | 16. Dezember 2019


SamO | 16. Dezember 2019

Congratulations to all the TSLA fanboi$.

Tropopause | 16. Dezember 2019

For the most part, the news channels are silent.

SamO | 16. Dezember 2019

Bet the shorts know.

TSLAQ: turning billionaires into millionaires since 2010

Mathew98 | 16. Dezember 2019

@PD - Perhaps all the EV preaching I have done this decade convinced a few to alter their perceptions. But I don't need to brag about all the places I've visited or all number of people who converted to EV. Ask me how many cops I've shown my ride to so far? None of them stopped me to give me a ticket.

Heck, I won't even mention the number of times I've been propositioned to because of my Tesla.

Mike83 | 16. Dezember 2019

Media got real quiet. Wonder why?

Ross1 | 16. Dezember 2019


rxlawdude | September 2, 2016

"@Ross - just be happy that at some point "soon," TSLA shares will be worth more than we paid. :-)"


Tropopause | 16. Dezember 2019

Great link Carlk. When one falls, they all will fall.

222 | 16. Dezember 2019

@carlk interesting link yes.
Haven't really posted in a couple years but I do like coming back intermittently and reading the comments from the peeps who have been around for at least as many years as I've been here. Regardless on our different opinions, it's nice to see you guys/gals keeping the banter going.

$380 was my last check. With targets of $10 through long term estimates of $4000 this really is a rollercoaster of emotions for a newbie (3 yrs) investor like me. My question to the group is assuming best case scenarios for solar, ride sharing, and auto, what's your ceiling target in the next few years? Obviously a broad hypothetical but let's play and see what you think.

My opinions are based on nothing but guesses but I'm hoping we're reach Amazon levels in 2 to 3 years? Thoughts?

Ross1 | 17. Dezember 2019

Not answering the post above but just for the record:

In 3 Musk years, TSLA will be private, Tesla cars will no longer be sold but leased or shared. Expect something unusual. These reasons are why EM espouses existing Tesla cars will be sold by you at $250k in 3 years.
Model 3s coming off lease will be absorbed by the company as taxi/shared rides.
Tesla will reinvent the sales, lease and Uber business.
MS and MX will be dropped. Even M3 possibly.
Power ahead with MY, CT, solar/storage and credits and royalties , the machine that builds the machine (robotted gigafactories for sale as a product.
Remember, the Secret Plan Part Deux is to transition the world to sustainable energy and transport.
Surely you are not expecting "ordinary"?
So when does it start?
Watch for the EOY 2019 report, I suggest.

Will he offer to buy us out at $420? Possibly. So you wont have shares in 3 years possibly except for loyal early adopters who will be considered part of the company.

Tropopause | 18. Dezember 2019

All-time high reached today of $390. Nearly $70B market cap.

Mathew98 | 18. Dezember 2019

Looking to break over $400 before new year. EOY window dressing aided by shirt covering.

GF3 progressing faster than some bears estimated. GF4 to break ground in about a month.

Just wait till they unveil he minibus...

Mathew98 | 18. Dezember 2019