Forums

Should Tesla offer TACC as a lower priced option than full autopilot? (Plus a POLL)

Should Tesla offer TACC as a lower priced option than full autopilot? (Plus a POLL)

Thinking aloud. I have autopilot and love it. But I know that it's too expensive for some.

I'm wondering if it would make sense for both Tesla and customers to offer TACC only for a lower price than full autopilot (say $1500).

The logic is that there are a lot of people who would be much more likely to pay $1500 than $5K for full autopilot. At the same time, I am guessing that Tesla would more than net gain from offering it, because I would hypothesize that relatively few people who purchased autopilot for $5k would downgrade to TACC only for $1500.

Do you think Tesla should do it?

And here's the POLL part:
If you DID buy autopilot for $5k, would you instead have taken only TACC if it had been offered for $1500?
If you DID NOT buy autopilot, would you have bought TACC if it had been offered for $1500?

(And if you want to get advanced, answer the same question for $2k instead of $1500).

EVRider | 08. Dezember 2018

I’ll save you some time: most people would like to see Tesla offer TACC without EAP (why wouldn’t they?), but it’s not going to happen. There have been many threads about this. I would have bought AP even if TACC was available separately.

M3BlueGeorgia | 08. Dezember 2018

$2.5K would be a more likely price for TACC, and I think Tesla should offer it when they start selling the $35K (or $38K) version of the car.
Basically, when paying $50K, coughing up the extra $5K is, percentage wise, is much easier to stomach than $5K on a $38K car. I've seen some stats that around 75% of current owners paid for EAP, including myself.

So, would you pay $2.5K for TACC ?

Note: My current feeling on the SR is it'll be priced at around $38K, but Tesla will offer some accommodation for reservation holders. Just adjusting for inflation, $35K when promised equates to above $37K in mid-2019.

ModernTriDad | 08. Dezember 2018

Bought EAP and FSD in my original order. Without knowing the financial impact to Tesla on breaking up the options and how it affects all of our Tesla future updates, I dont know that I want them split apart as options. As long as the majority of buyers, like me, are as willing to buy them together (including FSD that isn’t even here yet), I don’t know why they’d split the features up. Tesla also seems to want to keep the options menu simpler, so I think it’s unlikely in the short-term.

This topic seems to be posted here every 1-2 weeks. Although many on here seem to agree with the original poster, obviously the majority of buyers don’t mind paying for all the features in bundles.

SalisburySam | 08. Dezember 2018

@EVRider, +1. People want it, Tesla doesn’t, lots of threads on topic. Personally I like the other features of EAP and would never have purchased just the TACC if so available; I also bought the vaporish FSD as did many others.

thedrisin | 08. Dezember 2018

Should people be able to exchange their EAP for TACC only and get refund price difference then?

thedrisin | 08. Dezember 2018

Maybe split everything up. I only use TACC and Autosteer but have no use for NoA, Autopark, or Summon.

RES IPSA | 08. Dezember 2018

For the past 6 months I have been dreaming of only TACC for $2500... I would buy that right now.

But I understand why Tesla and other auto companies keep things together in a package. However, Tesla has advertised for years on their website how "customizable" their cars are and that they are made to order...

thedrisin | 08. Dezember 2018

Resale value will be better for those vehicles with full EAP if it is not broken into components.

Kikujiro | 08. Dezember 2018

TAC should be the default cruise control and should not be any cost. I've used EAP trial for a week now and I think TAC is just as good. With EAP, if it is completely hands free, I'll buy it but at this time it's not worth $5-$7K.

Doug n Evie | 08. Dezember 2018

It sounds so far like I'm in the minority, but I'll share my thoughts.

I was back and forth about 20 times a day deciding if I want to jump in or not before the November 30th deadline. I don't doubt that the Tesla is definitely worth the money, it's just money I don't have. I'm interested in an entry-level luxury car, roughly 35 to 40,000. For my wife and my child, I would have been able to get the MR3. Several people felt it's silly to pay 1500 for the color choice, but we would have done that. In my household, upgrading to 19 in was not worth it.

I really was pushing for the autopilot, but the only thing I really wanted was the t a c c. I currently don't do enough stop & go on the way to work to justify 5000 just for that. it's just too much at the edge of our budget.

Long story short, (too late?) I did not pull the trigger. I am still a long-term reservation holder, but I would have gone for it with the t a c c 1500.

It's a Tesla, a computer on wheels, to get it without any type of smart cruise control seems ridiculous. I had adaptive cruise control on my 2004 Toyota sienna. Admittedly, it disengaged below 28 miles an hour, but that's 14 years ago.

Waiting to see how pricing will be on the standard range I guess, and to see over the next 2 months how quality looks with the last-minute rushes, to see if I am kicking myself or made the right choice.

shank15217 | 08. Dezember 2018

Here is another option, how about offer TACC with no option to ever upgrade to AP? Go to any other manufacturer/dealer and that's what you get, spoilt brats.

thedrisin | 08. Dezember 2018

If you want premium features, purchase EAP. All car manufacturers have different trim levels. If you start breaking up these features, you cheapen the higher trim level.

cbmilehigh | 08. Dezember 2018

I have no use for EAP but would find TACC useful enough to pay for it.

thedrisin | 08. Dezember 2018

Chevy Bolt is $41k and no adaptive cruise control. Why would you expect it in a $35k car? SR and EAP for $40k is a bargain.

Wildcardtaylortesla | 08. Dezember 2018

I’m still on my EAP trial. While I agree that the TACC is the only thing I would pay any money for in this package, it’s annoying how often it slows the car down for shadows, cars that cross the road, etc.

earlohm | 08. Dezember 2018

I'd go for the TACC @ $1500. I know it's not going to be offered and since I passed up prior offers for EAP; it's now priced @ $7000. So EAP is not going to happen for our M3 either.

klesley | 08. Dezember 2018

I've had my M3 10 days now and am still on the EAP trial period. I'd gladly pay $1500 for TACC, but not the $5000 for the EAP. Two years ago, I bought a Ford Fusion Hybrid specifically for the TACC like features it supports. For a $50000 car, I was surprised that the TACC features were not part of the package.

burdogg | 08. Dezember 2018

I don't know much....but have heard people comment at how great Tesla's TACC is vs others....I have never tried any others, so don't know if that is true. But the fact remains...Tesla's TACC USES hardware designed for EAP. TACC does not come standard because it is INTEGRATED with EAP hardware AND the software programming. Hence they want to get paid for all that.

But I could be so, so wrong - as I have no idea how Tesla programs their TACC vs EAP - but I would find it funny that Tesla wouldn't make use of all the EAP hardware to make TACC work better than say some of the other manufacturers, I mean, why not - it is all there, so why would you dumb down your TACC...hence back to the first statement that I have heard others make - that Tesla's TACC is better - and rightfully so if they are using all those cameras to help out with recognition of things going on....

Anyway, nonetheless...I will continue to say - it will be a long time before they offer TACC without EAP - if they ever do. They put way too much time and energy in the hardware and development of EAP, that they feel the two combined is the only way right now...I could see once FSD is going, that they would then allow TACC by itself...because at that point...really who is not going to want FSD :)

patesla | 08. Dezember 2018

Absolutely! I did not upgrade to EAP, but would certainly take a stand alone upgrade to TACC for $1500. EAP at $5k is still a great value imo, but it's realistically more bells and whistles than I need and more $ than my already maxed out budget will allow. Stand alone TACC is a great idea also considering that other luxury brands offer it standard; but I think splitting up EAP features any further would be opening up a Pandora's box.

billtphotoman | 09. Dezember 2018

Now that the novelty of Autosteer has worn off on my last 2 road trips I have used TACC about 90% of the time and Autosteer about 2% of the time. Until Autosteer is capable of avoiding road debris it won't really be useful to me in anything other than stop and go traffic jams. Until Auto lane change is capable of not changing lanes into another vehicle's blind spot and in the path of a rapidly closing vehicle I won't use it. So, I view my $5000 expenditure on EAP as paying $1000 to TACC and funding Tesla $4000 to improve the rest of the EAP suite and/or use the extra money to expand the Supercharger network.

ODWms | 09. Dezember 2018

The good news is that, as this is an ever evolving and improving set of benefits, the likelihood all these needs will be satisfied soon is good.

bigroccrek | 09. Dezember 2018

EAP does not really work for my driving locations (rural roads) it always says "...limited to 45 mph" I would pay $1500 for TACC but wouldn't pay $5000+ for EAP

thedrisin | 09. Dezember 2018

Just make base model $40k and include EAP as a standard feature.

Besthand | 09. Dezember 2018

This topic existence itself says that a lot of owners interested in TACC and not so in anything else if it too expensive. While a lot of manufacturers sell not expensive cars with TACC, I think that it is a shame that Tesla does not include it in a standard. I paid about $60K with taxes and TACC is not included. It should not be like that. I do not think that Tesla will separate TACC.

burdogg | 09. Dezember 2018

I must say - you all say your car is a $60K car and should have xyz...

Ok, first - no, your car is a $35,000 car. To get to $60K - you have chosen to add options to make it that. Yes, one might say you can't get a 35,000 car, but that is still the base car. To get to $60K - you chose to add options to the base care (sure, can't be bought yet, but will be at some point). You want more range - add it to the base. Want premium interior - add more. Want AWD - add more money - Want performance...add more money - You get the gist.

burdogg | 09. Dezember 2018

So sure - your car cost $60K now...but that is your options making it that. It is still a $35,000 car - so just because one options it out, does not mean it should have x....

burdogg | 09. Dezember 2018

But what do I know - I am sure all cars that are $60K have TACC come standard...right?

burdogg | 09. Dezember 2018

Pretty sure that is not an accurate statement, but again, what do I know - all cars should have everything standard once we hit 60K!

lilbean | 09. Dezember 2018

It's funny how people want to dictate the price a company should charge for things. Don't like the price? Don't buy it.

perkefam | 09. Dezember 2018

After completing my trail for EAP:

Summon Feature:
Strengths - That I could access the garage [homelink] opener from my phone. Loved using the summon feature if I was in a tight parking spot.

Challenges I found that most often then not, it did not always clear the garage sensor. Experienced the garage door coming down on car while parking. However, aside from accessing the homelink garage system from my phone, I felt the summon feature was a novelty. But, could be quite useful in an AZ Summer.

Autosteer:
Strengths - Lane changes were amazing.
Challenges - Lane changes were not always consistent. The variable seemed to be lane differences; solid lines vs broken lines. A few times I I had the vehicle dip into a lane change and then the car would cancel lane change in midway. I experienced, no response with lanes with reflectors and broken lines.

Overall I had my reservations with the inconsistencies, but took into account that the car needed to learn from me. I did not have much luck with auto park. I once spent a morning trying to autopark in a mall parking lot. No luck! I found the Autopark feature did not respond consistently.

Also when in Autopilot, I experienced the 30 sec “hands on the wheel” warning ⚠️ even when my hands were on the wheel. The car would request pressure and often times I would have to grip the wheel tightly or slightly tug on wheel to reset the warning. A few times I experienced EAP jail, by the software taking my EAP privileges away for the rest of the ride. ( I have poor circulation and found that when the temperature was low and my hands were cold my warnings increased. ) My one takeaway is that I wish the car had assistive cruise control. Most gas powered cars have this feature.

My Subaru had lane assist and ER braking. I could also set my car length in cruise control. It was almost like the traffic jam assist feature that BMW’s have. This is a feature I paid for and found very practical. I can name 10 cars that have this as a standard feature. I would pay the suggested TACC amount of 1500-2500 for it. IMO, I think the car should have this feature and should not be EAP function.

perkefam | 09. Dezember 2018

After completing my trail for EAP:

Summon Feature:
Strengths - That I could access the garage [homelink] opener from my phone. Loved using the summon feature if I was in a tight parking spot.

Challenges I found that most often then not, it did not always clear the garage sensor. Experienced the garage door coming down on car while parking. However, aside from accessing the homelink garage system from my phone, I felt the summon feature was a novelty. But, could be quite useful in an AZ Summer.

Autosteer:
Strengths - Lane changes were amazing.
Challenges - Lane changes were not always consistent. The variable seemed to be lane differences; solid lines vs broken lines. A few times I I had the vehicle dip into a lane change and then the car would cancel lane change in midway. I experienced, no response with lanes with reflectors and broken lines.

Overall I had my reservations with the inconsistencies, but took into account that the car needed to learn from me. I did not have much luck with auto park. I once spent a morning trying to autopark in a mall parking lot. No luck! I found the Autopark feature did not respond consistently.

Also when in Autopilot, I experienced the 30 sec “hands on the wheel” warning ⚠️ even when my hands were on the wheel. The car would request pressure and often times I would have to grip the wheel tightly or slightly tug on wheel to reset the warning. A few times I experienced EAP jail, by the software taking my EAP privileges away for the rest of the ride. ( I have poor circulation and found that when the temperature was low and my hands were cold my warnings increased. ) My one takeaway is that I wish the car had assistive cruise control. Most gas powered cars have this feature.

My Subaru had lane assist and ER braking. I could also set my car length in cruise control. It was almost like the traffic jam assist feature that BMW’s have. This is a feature I paid for and found very practical. I can name 10 cars that have this as a standard feature. I would pay the suggested TACC amount of 1500-2500 for it. IMO, I think the car should have this feature and should not be EAP function.

perkefam | 09. Dezember 2018

After completing my trail for EAP;

Summon Feature:
Strengths - That I could access the garage [homelink] opener from my phone. Loved using the summon feature if I was in a tight parking spot.

Challenges I found that most often then not, it did not always clear the garage sensor. Experienced the garage door coming down on car while parking. However, aside from accessing the homelink garage system from my phone, I felt the summon feature was a novelty. But, could be quite useful in an AZ Summer.

Autosteer:
Strengths - Lane changes were amazing.
Challenges - Lane changes were not always consistent. The variable seemed to be lane differences; solid lines vs broken lines. A few times I I had the vehicle dip into a lane change and then the car would cancel lane change in midway. I experienced, no response with lanes with reflectors and broken lines.

Overall I had my reservations with the inconsistencies, but took into account that the car needed to learn from me. I did not have much luck with auto park. I once spent a morning trying to autopark in a mall parking lot. No luck! I found the Autopark feature did not respond consistently.

Also when in Autopilot, I experienced the 30 sec “hands on the wheel” warning ⚠️ even when my hands were on the wheel. The car would request pressure and often times I would have to grip the wheel tightly or slightly tug on wheel to reset the warning. A few times I experienced EAP jail, by the software taking my EAP privileges away for the rest of the ride. ( I have poor circulation and found that when the temperature was low and my hands were cold my warnings increased. ) My one takeaway is that I wish the car had assistive cruise control. Most gas powered cars have this feature.

My Subaru had lane assist and ER braking. I could also set my car length in cruise control. It was almost like the traffic jam assist feature that BMW’s have. This is a feature I paid for and found very practical. I can name 10 cars that have this as a standard feature. I would pay the suggested TACC amount of 1500-2500 for it. IMO, I think the car should have this feature and should not be EAP function.

SalisburySam | 10. Dezember 2018

@perkefam, your 3 repeated posts demonstrated serious commitment to your findings. Respect.

Revelate | 10. Dezember 2018

There's a good chance it's not separate in the software.

Do I think there should be another price point somewhere between the two for TACC without the other features? Absolutely from a Tesla revenue perspective, but that's additional time, and additional testing, and as others have mentioned on the forum Tesla has been in hardcore optimization mode which includes limiting options.

I think the trend for all manufacturers in the future will be towards more a la carte customization and that includes Tesla; actually I think that holds true for a lot of potential products, but right now we're still early in that process.

mknewman | 10. Dezember 2018

I also just completed my 'trail' I mean trial here are my very brief, but considered findings

I loved Summon and Autopark. I'd pay $1000 for those.

EAP drives like a new driver, doing stupid things like moving abruptly to the right when in the right lane and an entry lane merges. It wanders around the lane, and can't handle poor road markings and seams in the road. It scares the heck out of me at night, and basicly I would not pay anything for it, I'm a good driver and enjoy driving.

TACC is useful but the car is a breeze compared to my 6 speed Subaru WRX to drive in traffic. I live in Houston so this is a non-trivial issue. I see this as standard equipment on a lot of similarly priced vehicles so I don't see paying for it either.

Tesla really missed the opportunity to differentiate themselves by including all this extra stuff as standard equipment.

coleAK | 10. Dezember 2018

@burdogg. Have you ever looked at the options on a Porsche 911? Nothing is “standard” and the options are endless when you figure in custom colors. Really when you look at high end (6 figure plus, not $60k+) there are many more options. And yes TACC was an option on my Lexus that was almost $100k

thedrisin | 10. Dezember 2018

They could have included EAP and even FSD as standard equipment but then would have to increase the base prices. Marketing decision.

Rt002k | 10. Dezember 2018

Bought EAP and likely still would have if they were unbundled. They should unbundle them if it would make a business sense to do it.

No car maker that does include it includes it because they're being nice, the price of the car is adjusted to account for it, so the argument of "well Toyota includes it" is moot. Tesla could include it. They would just have a higher starting price.

Rt002k | 10. Dezember 2018

@perk - The wheel is not wanting to be squeezed, just a little torque on it like resting your hand on it is enough. Common misconception. Autopark requires two cars to park between, whether it's parallel or perpendicular. It will not park if there are not two cars to use as reference. TACC = assistive cruise control and can be activated independently of autosteer.

BostonPilot | 11. Dezember 2018

I agree with @billtphotoman. I tried EAP and it's a gimmick at this point. A dangerous gimmick. If a cop watched what it did when I tried it, he'd probably pull me over thinking I was drunk.

For those of you who love it, I'm happy for you, but I wouldn't trust the safety of my family with that system, it's that bad. And from aviation experience, I can tell you that systems that take you out of the loop but need constant monitoring have huge risks. People are lousy at monitoring automated systems and then taking over when things go wrong. They get bored and don't notice for a long time that things are going south, and it takes significant time for a human to get back in the loop. Results are like the Bay Area crash into the concrete barrier that killed the (ex Tesla wasn't it?) guy...

TACC on the other hand is a very simple system. It doesn't need AI to operate. It's a premium offering on some cars, so I could see Tesla offering it as an extra-cost option on the lower cost cars, but frankly I think it's outrageous that Tesla wants someone to pay $5,000 for cruise control on a $71,000+ Performance Model 3.

I think it should be $1,000 on the $35K Model 3 and free on any of the more expensive Model 3s.

greg | 16. Februar 2020

I didn't like the way Auto Pilot felt when I test drove (for 1200 miles) it so opted out. I would definitely pay $1500 for TACC if it were available stand alone.

andy.connor.e | 16. Februar 2020

Yes i would like TACC. Their reasoning as to why TACC is not offered by itself is because it utilizes the autopilot system sensors. Which to me is not really a good reason. All Tesla cars have all the hardware necessary for FSD, so anything more is simply software. Theres no reason why they cant offer it. Just like how they used to software limit batteries. Its literally opening the gate for more money. But now all cars come with AP standard so i guess this issue is now void.

shank15217 | 17. Februar 2020

AP is free now so not sure why this thread is resurrected from the dead.

AWDTesla | 17. Februar 2020

Nope, AP costs $4000 CDN

AWDTesla | 17. Februar 2020

"greg | February 16, 2020
I didn't like the way Auto Pilot felt when I test drove (for 1200 miles) it so opted out. I would definitely pay $1500 for TACC if it were available stand alone."

I got to try AP for free twice. The 1st time I was impressed but not to the point where I was $4000 impressed. 2nd time around, I was really impressed as they fixed a lot of bugs from the 1st time I tried.

Still not $4000 impressed and pretty sure the new Teslas will be that much more advanced 4 years from now when I buy another one. New ones come with basic AP included so I wont be buying it for my 3 anytime soon.

WW_spb | 17. Februar 2020

There is no basic AP. New ones have AP included and FSD as option.

AWDTesla | 17. Februar 2020

Yes, there is basic AP. When i login to my app, under auto pilot upgrades;

Basic Autopilot, $4000.

AWDTesla | 17. Februar 2020

But let's argue about it for 8 pages.

WW_spb | 17. Februar 2020

One that is included now is not basic AP

AWDTesla | 17. Februar 2020

What's included now is the $4000 basic ap that early adopters still need to pay out of pocket for.

I also have the FSD option for $9200 CDN under AP upgrades in my app.

Pages