Model 3

Possible explanation for recent range loss and "degradation"

edited November -1 in Model 3
Lots of threads and consternation about recent firmware affecting the car's range and efficiency. Oddly, it only affects a subset of owners. Any chance that the folks who are affected have the new wheel configuration set to the less efficient wheel choice? We know that new firmware now offers Wheel Configuration under the Service tab. Obviously, this will input distinct efficiency rate constants depending on wheel choice. I'm guessing that people who have seen their rated range suddenly drop a few percent have the larger diameter rim chosen. So maybe no CLASS ACTION this week?
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Comments

  • edited October 2019
    Isn’t is auto selected? Unless you changed wheels after buying the car ?
  • edited November -1
    It *
  • edited October 2019
    Suppose it were pre-selected and until now both 18 and 20 inch wheels were given the same efficiency rate constant of say 235 Wh/m. Now that there are multiple options, presumable the 18" choice would still be 235 Wh/m, but the 20" might be 260 Wh/m and the 19" somewhere in between. That would explain why some are seeing a different rated range spontaneously and others are not.
  • edited November -1
    Bighorn, I already checked my car. The correct wheels (18") are chosen. My 90% charge these days is estimated as 260-265 miles, and my 100% charge comes in at around 298 estimated miles.

    However, if I drive in the neighborhood of the EPA basis (wh/m) nothing has actually changed - only the estimated miles for SOC. I can still get 310 or better out of a full charge.
  • edited November -1
    My conclusion has been that my car has not experienced battery degradation or range loss, but that it does not estimate available mileage based on SOC as well as it once did.
  • edited November -1
    @gballant
    Thanks. My estimate has been all over the map this past year over the course of 40k miles, down and up. I've always chalked that up to the inability to measure battery capacity precisely. This particular hypothesis applies more specifically to those who claim a sudden, significant range change brought on by a recent FW update.
  • edited October 2019
    My mileage estimate discrepancies started suddenly in a manner that easily could have been attributable to a software update, and perhaps were associated with one. However, real world data shows as I stated above.

    I can see why people conclude that they are losing range and/or battery capacity, but a closer look reveals that is not the case - at least with my car.

    A wrong wheel diameter choice could have also showed up that same way, but I checked and the wheel choice in my car was and has been correct.
  • edited October 2019
    One of the first things I did setting up the car prior to driving it out of the Tesla center was to change the display from miles to %. Ignorance really is bliss.

    I did charge my car to 100% a few weeks back and I flipped it over to miles which reported 306 miles (dual motor non P with ~18k miles). Perhaps I’ll charge it to 100% tomorrow and see what it now says on the current version.
  • edited October 2019
    My 90% was 274 and now is 264. I'm sure this is a software issue and not a true loss of range. However, I always tell people that the true range is 250 not 310. 250 on the highway at 80 and 250 around town since I floor it all the time,hey I got the performance I'm going to use it.
    I don't drive a lot but I did use 40% of the battery yesterday. Usually 10% is 25 miles. Yesterday 40% was 40 miles.

    Has anyone tested a longer drive to see if range is less?
  • edited November -1
    On and this is not a direct attack, but people who say set it to percentage and don't worry have straw manned the original complaint. If 100% truly became 50 miles I'm sure people wouldn't have the same response.

    I do believe this a software glitch and not something permanent.
  • edited October 2019
    Along these same lines, I am now worried about the lack of sudden range loss in our mid-range Model 3.

    The car is approaching its first birthday and has about 8500 miles on the odometer. Near as I can tell by calculating based on battery percentage and miles left, it has lost about 4 miles of range. Based on a rated 260 mile range, that's 1.5%. For those more scientifically inclined, that's within the what we assume is the likely measurement error range, so we can't even clearly demonstrate any loss at all.

    Oh, we've tried to lose more range. We've charged it up to nearly 100% before long trips. We've driven it for miles and miles between charges. We've supercharged when needed. We've installed update after update and are now on the latest one available. Mostly, after figuring things out in the first few weeks of ownership, we've completely ignored the range and just driven the car. Clearly we're doing something wrong, as we are left with no complaints about battery degradation.

    Tesla should fix this right away!

    (All tongue in cheek, and not meant to dis those who truly have suffered range loss for whatever reason.)
  • edited October 2019
    Mine is 8'' aero wheels. Currently 241 at 80%. It was at 296 when I charged to full for a road trip last week.

    Dual motor long range, delivered at 9/30/2018, about 18k miles in.
  • edited October 2019
    Checked mine recently. 309. AWD ~10k miles. 1 year.
    Meh.
  • edited October 2019
    Probably 315 after I inflate with nitrogen :)
  • edited October 2019
    Software cannot cause battery degradation... stop talking nonsense.

    Software can also be undone if they desire. Its not like it burned up 5% of your battery.
  • edited November -1
    “Software cannot cause battery degradation... stop talking nonsense.”Joshan

    Don’t see where @Bighorn made that claim. Or did you misread my message above?
  • edited October 2019
    I too thought it might be related to the wheel size setting
  • edited October 2019
    @bighorn,
    It's not wheel size. I think it's just loopy software update. Should settle itself over the following updates. The current numbers range vs consumption numbers just don't make sense.
  • edited October 2019
    Here's another example from me. I started with 90% as usual and the starting range was 273 miles. I had the usual 1 - 1.5 hrs stop. This time it was raining so the consumption was on the higher side.


    https://photos.app.goo.gl/TaMB3AfUMMTarKbKA
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/uoc9gHPEkyEH1J7t7
  • edited October 2019
    I just did the math, that's ~33 miles of unexpected loss for a 1 - 1.5 hr stop.
    I'm just saying the software estimate of the range/consumption in this update Is noticeably off. I'm not at all worried about battery health.
  • edited November -1
    cant believe I am going to say this... I did misread your post fish. Plz disregard, my bad.
  • edited October 2019
    While I do feel that I lost some displayed range with the v10 update, some of it is fall temperatures. Today the car was sitting at 215 miles, it was a little warmer out, all week has been cold and it's been sitting at about 210. Before v10 it would usually be about 220 on the warmer mornings.

    LR AWD new 18" Continental aeros 29k miles 70% charge and red (which definitely holds faster electrons than other colors).

    Btw. I had been charging at 11pm for the TOU. With winter coming, based on my typical driving I have changed my start time to 3am to get charging to finish closer to 7am. This way, the battery hasn't been cold soaking for 5 to 6 hours before work. Curious if it will have an impact since the battery will still sit and cool for an hour, maybe two.
  • edited October 2019
    Today I drove Model 3 about 60 miles at speeds of 60-75 mph and city driving for a total of 76 miles but my battery range started at 250 and ended at 150 so battery used 100 miles, Temp outside about 50, no air conditioning, used seat heater and temp set to 69. No fast acceleration. Car was new May 2018. Is this normal? Software has ben updated as it becomes available.
  • edited October 2019
    My 90% used to be 278. Now it’s 270 (and 100% the one time I fully charged recently was 299). I think it’s related to how the software estimates the ideal range.

    I have the 3P with 20” wheels so the new 300mile estimate may be closer to reality than 310. If that’s the case I’m not worried.

    Interestingly if you use Tesla api to get your cars range (needs some programming ability) it will give you two metrics. One is the ideal range, the other is the estimated range. The car and the Tesla app report the ideal range and that’s the number that’s dropped.
  • edited October 2019
    @rsingh05,
    It's understandable if the estimated range dropped because of some unique usage data, but I'd think ideal range is going to be based on the same factors for all cars. What you just shared is causing more confusion.
    Both the numbers you mentioned are just software generated and do not suggest real degradation - so I'm just going to wait for a software correction.
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