General

Supercharger is Too Cheap

My home’s semi-peak rate is $0.37/kWh. I don’t know the peak rate since I have solar and always generate more than consumed, thus rate not showing on my bill.

My closest Supercharger (San Diego - Fashion Vally) charges just $0.31/kWh at 12pm noon. No wonder it’s always full during waking hours.

Tesla should study local residential rate to make sure to charge just a bit more, so that nearby owners don’t clog up the charging stalls just to achieve saving, leaving travelers and shoppers frustrated with long wait time.

Bottom line; Superchargers are not meant for local residents looking to save a few bucks.
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Comments

  • I doubt many would go out of their way to charge at a station instead of at home to save sixty cents.
  • What's your off peak rate?
  • He's got SDGE, the most expensive utility in the Continental US. I could not get out of their service area fast enough.
    I think the very cheapest is $.09/kWh on an EV-only tariff that requires a second meter. That's serious bucks that would really kill the value proposition unless you charge for a lifetime.

    I'm not sure if SDGE has a sub-metering alternative that measures the EV consumption and subtracts that from the whole house, then bills the EV consumption at the TOU-EV rate.

    SCE had a pilot program that did this several years ago, but that rate plan is no longer. I suspect this great idea disappeared due to utilities having to deal with a third party ("MDMA", not to be confused with the drug of that same designation) that tracked the submeter. I had many months where SCE claimed they didn't get the data from the MDMA in time and got hit with unexpectedly high bills those months.
  • "Tesla should study local residential rate to make sure to charge just a bit more, so that nearby owners don’t clog up the charging stalls just to achieve saving" OP - Perhaps you are unaware, but Mission Valley, of which the Fashion Valley Supercharger is a part of, is home to hundreds of middle to high end condos and apartments. Those "nearby owners" use that Supercharger as their only close by DCFC charging opportunity. That's not to say that people who live farther away don't charge there, but for those who can charge at home during off peak hours, I don't see a lot of incentive for them to clog the Fashion Valley Supercharger.
  • > @pkmantmc_98177178 said:

    > Bottom line; Superchargers are not meant for local residents looking to save a few bucks.

    Very true with the caveat it is also for local residents without home charging.

    On many of the chargers I use, most of the people charging are locals who have home charging but either have free supercharging or just like the idea of plugging in while shopping.
  • My off-peak rate is $0.307/kWh, from 10p-6am; which is essentially the same as Tesla’s daytime rate (don’t know if it’s cheaper at night).

    “ SDGE, the most expensive utility in the Continental US”. Wow! I know my rate is high but didn’t know it’s the highest. Thanks God I have solar. I believe peak-rate is $0.40+ so the saving per charge is way more than sixty cents.

    Check PlugShare and you’ll see that many condos/apartments in Mission Valley have EV chargers, especially the nicer ones. I know many renters probably do drive Tesla and go there just to charge. I just hope they can go after 10p, when the mall is closed and travelers less likely to stop by.

    It’s now 10p and the stalls are 15/22. See, good time for renters with Tesla to go charge. They may pay $0.0033/kWh more (assuming my off-peak rate) but they’d be good Tesla citizens.
  • > @pkmantmc_98177178 said:

    > It’s now 10p and the stalls are 15/22. See, good time for renters with Tesla to go charge.

    No...10P is not a good time to go charge a car. Issue of local Tesla owners charging at the SC's when they don't have to is...well...an issue. You'd think the overcrowding would discourage them but they don't care, they can just park the car and go shopping, they don't have to charge.
  • Those are some crazy high rates. I have a rural Oklahoma electric cooperative for my supplier and it’s $0.09/kWh during the day and $0.05/kWh from 9pm to 5am. Supercharger rate here is $0.23/kWh.
  • Put 65 miles of range in on my way home yesterday for $3.35. 65 miles of range used to be almost 2 gallons of gasoline. Model 3 is literally cheaper to run than a toyota camry.
  • Peak price of petrol here today is £7.22/UK gallon (UK gallon is 20% more than a US gallon, so you can much direct translate a UK gallon £ price to $USD US volume - so around $7.20 to $7.40 USD per US gallon.

    I can charge at home and add 100 miles of range overnight for £1.40. That would be the equivalent of 70p per gallon in an average frugal petrol car.

    The local Tesla supercharger rate is higher than charging at home, but still much cheaper, by a factor of around 4, than petrol and diesel.

    With price savings like this, and significant tax advantages on top, it’s easy to see why ICE is on its way out even before the ban on new sales kicks in between 2030 and 2035.
  • Anytime I want to charge at my local supercharger I will for ANY reason or none of your business reasons, have home charging but the supercharger is never busy, never even seen a busy supercharger, FISHSTICK lies
  • > @blkice said:
    > Anytime I want to charge at my local supercharger I will for ANY reason or none of your business reasons, have home charging but the supercharger is never busy, never even seen a busy supercharger.

    Your lack of experience is not relevant.
  • > @FISHEV said:
    > > @blkice said:
    > > Anytime I want to charge at my local supercharger I will for ANY reason or none of your business reasons, have home charging but the supercharger is never busy, never even seen a busy supercharger.
    >
    > Your lack of experience is not relevant.
    >
    >
    blkice’s experience not matching your narrative is not evidence of a lack of anything.
  • I've seen as much as 5/6 stalls being used at any given time by me, but there are quite alot of Teslas in my area now. I suspect that high travel holiday weekends or such will be very utilized. As is pretty much everything.
  • A check of supercharge.info shows 3 more Superchargers for San Diego have been permitted recently. It will probably be a year before they are built and operational, but that should ease the load on the Fashion Valley Supercharger. I charged there yesterday and saw as many as 6 cars in the queue over the noon hour. No one waited more than 10 minutes to get on, but it's a busy place.
  • > @M-A-B-MCMLXXX said: > blkice’s experience not matching your narrative is not evidence of a lack of anything."

    More that @blkice anecdote is not fact based. Lines, reduced charging, reduced charging times and broken chargers are everyday experience for those who charge at Tesla SC's in metro areas.

    All three chargers I use regularly are "high usage" with all those factors.

    Plus for Tesla is they are building two new super charger stations near both work places. Both are in construction and should be open soon.

    These will still likely have a large complement of "free supercharging" owners who will use them out of convenience not necessity, this topic.
  • More that @blkice anecdote is not fish fact based.

    There, fixed that for ya.
  • edited September 15
    https://forums.tesla.com/discussion/175166/superchargers-in-mackinaw-city-are-broken

    "Heavy holiday traffic leads to long lines at Tesla charging stations"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Vyv3NDdVDk

    "Tesla Reps Give Out Water To Those In Long Supercharger Lines During Thanksgiving Weekend"
    https://cleantechnica.com/2019/12/09/tesla-reps-give-out-water-to-those-in-long-supercharger-lines-during-thanksgiving-weekend/

    "Long lines at the supercharger stations in Central Valley between LA and SF YESTERDAY"
    https://forums.tesla.com/discussion/170244/long-lines-at-the-supercharger-stations-in-central-valley-between-la-and-sf-yesterday

    "Wait times indication at Superchargers"
    https://forums.tesla.com/discussion/169941/wait-times-indication-at-superchargers

    "Musk has to wait in line at Super Charger."
    https://forums.tesla.com/discussion/173651/musk-has-to-wait-in-line-at-super-charger
  • Correction: ...without the help of any other auto manufacturer.
  • I’m the original poster; can we get back to the subject?

    I’m guessing SC’s rate significantly lower than residential’s is the exception, not the norm, and Fashion Valley’s situation is further worsened by its surrounding affluent condos / apartments where many drive Tesla but cannot charge at home.

    Still, Tesla should check the local rate to make sure it charges a bit more. Nothing wrong with making a small profit as well, to afford future expansion.
  • My anecdote is better than yours!
    -Fish
  • @pkmantmc_98177178

    It was always intended that the superchargers not be specifically for profit. I got some charge just this past weekend and the price came out to less than what i'd spend on gas for my camry. Enjoy your cheap fuel.
  • “price came out to less than what i'd spend on gas”

    Yes, that’s expected and should always be the case.

    I’m referring to SC’s kWh rate vs. residential’s.
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