Model 3

Truth about your M3 and why FSD will always be a BETA

Lesson 1. Outdated Cameras and Sensors.

Let's put our differences aside and stick to the facts.

We can all agree that computing power inside cars is an increasingly important feature. A significant amount of computing power is necessary to enable optimal driver assistance and automated driving and activate safety features.

To optimize automated driving, many of the automakers choose from variety of sensors such as cameras, radar, lidar, and ultrasonic sensors, so that vehicles can detect in the surroundings they are in. All the data derived from the sensors must be grouped together, and this is where the control unit comes into play.

General M3 owners believe all the hardware pieces inside M3 are technically the most advanced available on the market. But is it?

A peek under the hood, though, reveals that Tesla’s primary design goal for Model 3 was to reduce the cost of ADAS (Advanced Drivers Assistance Systems), making the model “affordable”.

For automotive sensors in Model 3, Tesla is using eight cameras, one radar and 12 ultrasonic sensors. Model 3 uses no lidars.

Ok, before I bore you to death, let's get straight to the detail specs.

Tesla Model 3 overview of sensors for ADAS Applications:

Main Forward Camera : Max Dist. 150M
Narrow Forward Camera : Max Dist. 250M
Forward Looking Side Camera : Max Dist. 80M
Wide Forward Camera : Max Dist. 60M
Rearward Looking Side Camera : Max Dist. 100M
Rear View Camera: Max Dist. 50M

Ultrasoics: Max Dist. 8M

Radar: Max Dist. 160M

The sensor package designed into Tesla Model 3 includes: eight cameras which provide 360-degree visibility around the car within a radius of 250 meters; 12 ultrasonic sensors that complete this vision system. Together, they allow the detection of hard and soft objects at a distance and with almost twice the accuracy of the previous system. The package also incorporates a forward-facing radar system with improved processing capabilities. It provides additional data about the surrounding environment on a redundant wavelength that can see through heavy rain, fog, dust and even beyond previous cars.

On the camera front, there are four cameras facing the front that support the radar and have different characteristics. The main one, covers 250 meters but with a very narrow-angle of view, and there are others that cover shorter distances (150-, 80- and 60 meters) but with a wide-angle view of the environment around the car and are those used to read the road signs. The other four cameras face the sides and rear of the car and can see up to 100 meters away.

Sonar, on the other hand, uses ultrasound to detect obstacles within a radius of 8 meters around the car. It works at any speed and also controls the blind spot. The data collected by the sonar is also used by Autopilot to manage the automatic lane change during overtaking. Finally, GPS is used to detect the position of the car concerning the road.

I'm sure most of you already know this, btw.

To enlighten your knowledge, Eight cameras in total designed into M3 are based on the same 1.2 MP image sensors released by O.S. in 2015. The low cost 1.2 MP sensors are neither new in technology nor high resolution.

Tesla sourced all eight image sensors from the same supplier to cut costs, obviously.

So the Triple Forward Camera of the M3 features three CMOS image sensors with 1280 x 960 1.2MP resolution.

Phantom Braking anyone?

Upcoming Lesson 2:
Autopilot ECU: HW3.0? Why it will be short lived and HW4.0 with new AP rewrite will be available shortly.

In summary, you will never ever have a fully functioning FSD with your current M3. It's like buying Apple iPhone Version 1 and wishing eventually it will miraculously turn into a retina 5G smartphone.

Save the money. Buy the FSD when it's completely finished and safety approved by the powers to be.


  • How’s the campaign goin fellas?
  • You provided a description of the system, but no supporting evidence that the current hardware is not sufficient to make FSD feature complete. The linked article speculates that it is a test mule for the Cybertruck, which has nothing to do with the hardware being insufficient. If you have some compelling factual evidence that the current hardware cannot achieve level 5 autonomy, please post it. Otherwise, this is just your opinion based on your disdain for Tesla and its fans.
  • Wow. How pathetically transparent.
    Guess the Battery Day announcement re completion of the new AP rebuild and the complete FSD suite coming out in about a month for public testing zipped right by guys like this.
  • (These guys...unbelievable commitment to their desperate and delusional attempts at fud. Also is quite a test of one’s commitment to not use foul language...)
  • Same troll who said pressing the accelerator is unintended acceleration.
    Is this campaign number 3?
  • The truth about Andrew.

    He claimed an unintended acceleration event. Several owners replicated his issue in a sincere attempt to help him. His wife accidently shifted the car in neutral and pressed the accelerator, then Andrew reached over and shifted back into drive. With the accelerator pressed, the car accelerated. Of course, he blamed the car and labeled it a "real danger".
  • New thread? What happened to old one? Andrew new Fish?
  • > @WW_spb said:
    > New thread? What happened to old one? Andrew new Fish?

    It is still there. He is just spamming the forum with his disdain for Tesla.
  • Yeah, I'm not sure I believe the opinion of someone who doesn't know how neutral works to tell me FSD will always be beta.

    Also, so what if it is always beta? That means it's always improving. It doesn't mean it won't do what it says it does. Tesla has a defined timeline for removing the beta label for anyone that cares to review it.
  • @hokiegir1 - absolutely! Every car manufacturer releases things that could be improved even more, but with Tesla, you have a car that can receive updates and fixes to make it even better. Other cars, you just wait it out until you can buy another year's model. The reason Tesla can release Beta features (and provide a way to turn them off if people don't want to mess with it) is that they are continually improving and sending those updates to the car. So those that enjoy trying to new features as they're being honed in can enjoy them. Those that don't, can turn them off until they are "feature complete".
  • Well, I will be driving 600+ one way or 1200+ roundtrip soon. I will test my brand new EAP upgrade and see how that performs vs claims by Trolls and Anti Tesla nuts.
  • It works alright. Definitely takes the edge off and significantly reduces the amount of energy demand to do a long highway drive.
  • > @andy_connor_e said:
    > It works alright. Definitely takes the edge off and significantly reduces the amount of energy demand to do a long highway drive.

    The lane changes alone is something from fight sci-fi movies.
  • Lane change works flawlessly in my experience. I do not like on-ramps being on my right. The car pulls to the middle of the double wide lane and hard brakes if someone is approaching the highway to merge regardless of if they are easily in front or behind you.
  • Lol why it said fight when I used speak to text I have no idea
  • > @andy_connor_e said:
    > Lane change works flawlessly in my experience. I do not like on-ramps being on my right. The car pulls to the middle of the double wide lane and hard brakes if someone is approaching the highway to merge regardless of if they are easily in front or behind you.

    This is the reason I have not driven in the right lane for the last 2 years, at least not past on and off ramps.
  • Lower resolution cameras are common in both control and metrology systems. Frame rate and the capability to process at that frame rate are of higher priority.

    You can’t possibly evaluate the suitability of the sensors without a solid requirements analysis.
  • I don't have FSD but I did just purchase the new EAP for $4K.. For all I care it can stay in 'Beta' forever as long as the features I paid for work and they work as intended and described.
  • I agree that there is a way to go before FSD is ready to "solo" all the time, however, 1st order camera resolution is far from the weakest link and I'm fairly certain it os close to adequate today. Camera dynamic range, sensor cleaning, and, most of all, all of the processing are way in front.
    Good thing the OP isn't setting the priorities for Tesla's engineering team.
  • Let's see we got Andrew in one corner and Elon in the other. Who do we listen too. Hard choices again. I go with F&H for comedy material.
  • Hard to determine how long it will be for true FSD until the software rewrite is released. The current functionality of the software does not reflect the work they have been doing to rewrite the entirety of the FSD code. Yesterday announced some beta versions of the software will be ready in about a month. Pushing me closer and closer to buying it.
  • Holly crap, the guy who seemed to be unable to understand how to use the “transmission” stalk is now a full blown automotive expert.
  • I have a dream, that in 18 months from now i will have an autonomous Model 3 acting cab, and a cybertruck.

    Is my dream.
  • I say nothing wrong with being optimistic and dreaming! 100% better than hate and say no to everything new
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