Model X

Bigger Battery?

edited November -1 in Model X
Someone floated a rumor that there would be a 120kWh Model X. Anyone have any info, or opinions?
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Comments

  • edited November -1
    Wishful thinking in my opinion, but incremental progress could make a 100 kwh battery possible by the time the Model X debuts.
  • edited November -1
    I think they had mentioned in the thread that the wheelbase was going to be larger and thus a 120kWh battery was a possibility. I don't know anything about a larger wheelbase. I thought it would be the same skateboard size as the Model S.
  • edited November -1
    Slightly extended. They've got their own stamping equipment to play with, you know!
  • edited November -1
    Going from 3.1 to 3.4 batteries would provide part of the boost.
  • edited November -1
    Wow, a 120 kWh battery would really boost the range of the Model X. The maximum range then would be about 600 km (at an average speed of 90 km/hr)?
  • edited November -1
    @&lt;b>Brian H</b> | DECEMBER 14, 2012: <cite>Going from 3.1 to 3.4 batteries would provide part of the boost.</cite>

    The 3.1mAh batteries weight 45.5g each. The 3.4mAh weight 46g each. The 4.0mAh weight 56g each.
    http://panasonic.co.jp/corp/news/official.data/data.dir/en091225-3/en091225-3.html
    http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/includes/pdf/ACA4000CE254-NCR18650A.pdf

    They could get extra range with the 3.4mAh battery with not much weight gain. Switching to 4.0mAh would mean more weight for more power - or they could reduce the number of cells for about the same power/weight ratio.
  • edited November -1
    Alex;
    Indeed, I meant range boost.

    Yes, it's strange; the 4.0 seems to have a <i>worse</i> energy/kg ratio. Very odd. It would be valuable only where space was more important than mass.
  • edited November -1
    Going by your numbers, the 3.4 Ah cells have the best power to weight ratio, 3.5% higher than the 4.0 Ah and 8.5% higher than the 3.1 Ah.

    Notice also that the 4.0Ah cell has a lower discharge voltage of 3.4 volts vs. 3.6 for the 3.4Ah battery.

    The 4.0Ah a silicon base negative electrode, instead of carbon. It sounds like significantly different battery, while the 3.4Ah is more of a drop-in.

    On the other hand, I see now that the datasheet for the 18650B shows slightly less capacity (3.35Ah), and weighs one more gram (47.5): http://industrial.panasonic.com/www-data/pdf2/ACI4000/ACI4000CE54.pdf

    I could find no datasheet for the 4.0Ah cell, so who knows what its real specs are? I am fairly sure it's not even in production yet.

    My guess is that the Model X will have the 18650B, and I would further guess that this same battery will find its way into the 2014 Model S.

    The 4.0Ah cell is further out. Panasonic needs to start producing, ramp, stabilize yields, etc. Tesla would need to get some experience with it in automotive use. I don't think such a cell, even if production does start this year, will find its way into a Tesla model before 2015.

    Still, even with the with the 18650B, an 85kWh pack becomes a 92kWh pack, while the 60 becomes a 65. Not bad.
  • edited November -1
    @BrianH, those 4.0Ah batteries have silicon-based anode, and silicon is heavier than carbon. Volumetric energy density increases, but gravimetric decreases. At least for this first generation of silicon-based anode batteries.

    @danielccc, I too think that this is not in production, however it has been mentioned in their webpage for about two years now, so it is a bit weird that it isn't in production yet. Maybe it has some serious flaw in it (like very poor cycle durability).
  • edited November -1
    So, with the 18650B cells, as from 2014 we could be buying a Tesla Model X with a 92 kWh battery pack (instead of the 85 kWh battery pack), or a Tesla Model X with a 65 kWh battery pack (instead of the 60 kWh battery pack). Is that correct?
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