Model 3

Tesla Seeks FCC Approval For New Radar Sensor: What You Need To Know

"Why It Matters: Tesla is betting on cameras and radar in furthering its self-driving push, with Musk taking a public stance against the use of lidar sensors, noted Electrek. "

"The new sensor reportedly appears to be a move that would improve the company’s efforts to enable full-self driving."

"Waymo said it was working on a Lidar, radar, and camera-based autonomous strategy that was “orders of magnitude more advanced” than Tesla."

Wonder if this will be a retrofit for those with FSD?
Is this needed to reach Level 3/4?

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/tesla-seeks-fcc-approval-radar-081833000.html
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Comments

  • Wonder if you will ever go away so we can reach Nirvana level ourselves?
  • I seriously doubt it will be necessary for level 5. Just chasing the 9s. As new and better equipment becomes available, of course they will incorporate it into future vehicles.
  • Once again belongs in general forum. Flag please.
  • A radar operating in that frequency band has super high resolution, but is subject to significant signal attenuation by the elements. Hope they give it a good test in heavy rain, snow and dense fog.
  • > @"TeslaTap.com" said:
    > The "new" radar looks identical to the old radar. It could be the same as the current radar, but a different vendor or Tesla elected to develop the radar in-house. Tesla has changed the radar over the years and it could be for better accuracy or just a new unit is cheaper to buy/make. Doubtful it has anything to do with FSD.
    >
    > I wonder if Waymo is so advanced why they can only operate in very limited geofenced areas at slow speeds. They still have nothing that works on freeways either. I don't count them out, but they are not a competitor to Tesla today or anytime soon.

    Well there you go again, blowing holes in Howard's glee in trying to make something out of nothing. You are no fun! 🤣
  • "Waymo said it was working on a Lidar, radar, and camera-based autonomous strategy that was “orders of magnitude more advanced” than Tesla."-Howard

    Waymo is working on a “strategy”? Aren’t we all? And then they precisely quantify how much more advanced their strategy is “than Tesla”, by using a logarithmic scale.

    Who writes nonsense like this?

    Our “strategy” is logarithmically better than your (fill in the blank).
  • > @"TeslaTap.com" said:

    > I wonder if Waymo is so advanced why they can only operate in very limited geofenced areas at slow speeds. They still have nothing that works on freeways either. I don't count them out, but they are not a competitor to Tesla today or anytime soon.

    Spoken like a true fanatic. Tesla does not have Level 3 much less Level 4 in use at all. Compared to millions of miles by Waymo and Cruise who have been doing Level 4 for years. Yes, it is geofenced and speed limited, however, you are totally delusional if you even remotely think Tesla is going to be Level 4 on a freeway at the posted speed limit. PERIOD! What a joke that you keep promoting this fantasy. Waymo and Mobile Eye technologies will be provided/integrated into other auto manufactures and it will most certainly be Level 4 before a Tesla does it. Tesla has years of catching up to do before it reaches a true Level 4 capability. Given all Tesla has to show for the last 5+ years is 12 miles of Level 3 maybe even you can see the absurdity. Nevermind, I know employees can do nothing but continue the Elon charade. Level 5 by year-end 2019. Did I mention what a joke?
  • Howard, you’re misusing the term fanatic. It can be applied to your behavior though.
  • I am so glad people cannot delete their own threads anymore.
  • > @howard_98305575 said:
    >Given all Tesla has to show for the last 5+ years is 12 miles of Level 3 maybe even you can see the absurdity.

    THERE IT IS! LOL I knew it was coming. Every time you say it I cant stop laughing. Just remember to let me know when Waymo goes faster than 35 MPH or leaves its Geofenced area.

    BTW there is a reason Waymo is testing their cars in Arizona. It doesn't rain very often so their Lidar doesn't constantly shut down. Did I mention what a joke?
  • And waymo has a strategy.
  • Actually, they don’t have a strategy, they are working on one.
  • Do I detect Howie getting a little upset? Is he going into level lunacy again? LOL
  • > @howard_98305575 said:
    >
    > Spoken like a true fanatic... Compared to millions of miles by Waymo and Cruise who have been doing Level 4 for years. ...
    >
    I think there is plenty of fanaticism and hyperbole to go around here. Waymo has not been doing L4 for "years". L4 means car is responsible for the driving task, i.e., no safety driver. Waymo has been doing true L4 in Phoenix for several months now. The only objective truth here is Waymo and Tesla systems are different with very different goals. So Waymo's system is way ahead of Tesla in Waymo's goals (L4 in a small fleet of centrally monitored driverless taxis), but Tesla is way ahead of Waymo in Tesla's goals (driver assist in consumer vehicles with limited L3 capability). L5 in Teslas with the current hardware - new radar or not -- is, IMO, not ever going to happen, and there will be no driverless taxis on the HW3.1 platform. All I hoped for when I paid for FSD three years ago is L3 on highways so I can drink my coffee, eat my salad, or read my email to and from work or on long trips. I am hoping one day in the near future we see this.
  • > @Goose66 said:
    > > @howard_98305575 said:
    > >
    > > Spoken like a true fanatic... Compared to millions of miles by Waymo and Cruise who have been doing Level 4 for years. ...
    > >
    > I think there is plenty of fanaticism and hyperbole to go around here. Waymo has not been doing L4 for "years". L4 means car is responsible for the driving task, i.e., no safety driver. Waymo has been doing true L4 in Phoenix for several months now. The only objective truth here is Waymo and Tesla systems are different with very different goals. So Waymo's system is way ahead of Tesla in Waymo's goals (L4 in a small fleet of centrally monitored driverless taxis), but Tesla is way ahead of Waymo in Tesla's goals (driver assist in consumer vehicles with limited L3 capability). L5 in Teslas with the current hardware - new radar or not -- is, IMO, not ever going to happen, and there will be no driverless taxis on the HW3.1 platform. All I hoped for when I paid for FSD three years ago is L3 on highways so I can drink my coffee, eat my salad, or read my email to and from work or on long trips. I am hoping one day in the near future we see this.
    >

    @Goose66

    Yes, Waymo and Cruise have been doing Level 4 for years and millions of miles. Your understanding of the role of the safety driver is incorrect with respect to Level 4 performance. The presence of the "safety driver" has no effect on the intended and government approved Level 4 driving capability. Here is the reference from SAE J3016 8.2:

    "The level of a driving automation system feature corresponds to the feature’s production design intent. This applies regardless of whether the vehicle on which it is equipped is a production vehicle already deployed in commerce, or a test vehicle that has yet to be deployed. As such, it is incorrect to classify a level 4 design-intended ADS feature equipped on a test vehicle as level 2 simply because on-road testing requires a test driver to supervise the feature while engaged, and to intervene if necessary to maintain safe operation."

    Tesla is not ahead of anyone at this point. Tesla currently does not offer any type of driver assistance feature that is above Level 2. Level 3 might be coming at slow speeds like Honda's Traffic Jam Pilot.

    My desire as yours would be to use Level 3 on the highways, but it is not coming any time soon and most likely not with our generation of Tesla. Highway cruising is going to remain a solid Level 2 for some time to come. Telsa getting rid of the steering wheel nag and going to camera safety detection would be nice.

    I completely agree with your statement "L5 in Teslas with the current hardware - new radar or not -- is, IMO, not ever going to happen, and there will be no driverless taxis on the HW3.1 platform."

    Level 4 if ever achieved will most likely be speed limited in a Tesla just like all the manufacturers who are actually leading the industry in Autonomous driving. To think otherwise is just dreaming or total denial.
  • "will most likely be speed limited in a Tesla"

    Yes, to the legal speed limit.
  • Howard only posts topics that he can spin Tesla in a negative light.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/your-online-secrets/201409/internet-trolls-are-narcissists-psychopaths-and-sadists
  • Yes, Waymo and Cruise have been doing Level 4 for years and millions of miles. Your understanding of the role of the safety driver is incorrect with respect to Level 4 performance. The presence of the "safety driver" has no effect on the intended and government approved Level 4 driving capability. Here is the reference from SAE J3016 8.2:-howie

    1. Government doesn’t approve levels. The levels are based on the design intent. These things aren’t designed and then measured by some government organization to determine how well it did.

    2. Your quote basically destroys the argument you have been trying to make for months.

    “As such, it is incorrect to classify a level 4 design-intended ADS feature equipped on a test vehicle as level 2 simply because on-road testing requires a test driver to supervise the feature while engaged, and to intervene if necessary to maintain safe operation."

    This is exactly what Howard does. He claims that one manufacturer is “at level 2” or 3 because it requires supervision and intervention.

    "The level of a driving automation system feature corresponds to the feature’s production design intent. “

    No amount of watching videos looking for disengagement changes the design intent.

    If the system is designed for level 4, but has a lot of disengagements it doesn’t become a level 2. It’s a level 4 that isn’t yet functioning properly.

    All this talk of will Tesla reach level x by a certain date is stupid. It’s a taxonomy to describe what they are designing, not to measure capability. Read the doc you quoted. This is perfectly clear in the document.
  • The A6 troll clown is going into 'levels meltdown' again! Buckle up! LOL
  • > @jallred said:
    > Yes, Waymo and Cruise have been doing Level 4 for years and millions of miles. Your understanding of the role of the safety driver is incorrect with respect to Level 4 performance. The presence of the "safety driver" has no effect on the intended and government approved Level 4 driving capability. Here is the reference from SAE J3016 8.2:-howie
    >
    > 1. Government doesn’t approve levels. The levels are based on the design intent. These things aren’t designed and then measured by some government organization to determine how well it did.
    >

    Whoopsies:

    The Government does require an application and approval for the use of a Level 4 driving capability for public use. In the case of Waymo and Cruise years and millions of miles have been completed at a government approved Level 4 capability.

    Tesla has only completed 12 miles at a Level 3 capability.

    I know you and all the others just hate to use SAE Levels because it defines just how far behind Tesla is compared to others, but it is Elon who clearly states Level 5 repeatedly and often. Level 5 by year-end 2019, Level 5 by year-end 2020. Elon will probably be repeating this "Level 5" statement in 2040.

    You can drive around all you want in a Telsa with both hands out the window yelling at the lop of your lungs, as I am sure some of you do, look it is driving itself but alas the truth is it is still no more than a driver-assisted Level 2 feature. Maybe Tesla will catch up to Honda and offer Level 3 in heavy traffic limited to 30mph. Wait, that does not align with the fantasy that Tesla is going to magically push out a Level 4/5 update within the next year. or the next year, or the next year........
  • Sheesh. Howie, the troll. Public Service Announcement:
    Howard is a known troll of several years standing who pushes an anti Tesla narrative. Please take his opinions with a grain of salt, avoid any advice he may suggest, and do not let him implant any Fear, Uncertainty, or Doubt about Tesla or your car into your own opinion.
    Note that howie tends to move back and forth. On one month, he'll act like a human being. In the next month, it's Negative, Negative, Negative, all the way.
    For some reason the idea that FSD might actually work drives him, and likely his masters, absolutely bonkers. It's strongly suspected that howie works for a shill farm, paid to disrupt the forums in the interests of slowing Tesla down and/or dissuading people from buying Teslas.
    There's been some recent commentary that the next major release of Tesla software is immanent, so howie's doing his/her/its pre-emptive strike best.
  • > @howard_98305575 said:
    >
    > Whoopsies:
    >
    > The Government does require an application and approval for the use of a Level 4 driving capability for public use.
    >

    Care to provide a source for that? Which government, all of them, local, state, and federal?

    Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about.
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