Model 3

Starting March 15th, Tesla Forums will become read only. To continue the conversation with the Tesla community visit engage.tesla.com.

Model 3 Performance 2021 Cold issue

Is there way to get some information from Tesla are they going to fix this issue? Or are they even knowing this issue?

YouTuber Tesla Bjorn Nyland made few tests where he is showing that Performance model has issues in cold weather. When SoC is very slow like under 50% Performance has problems provide energy out from battery. Problem goes very bad when SoC is under 20% etc. Finally when limp mode kick in.

This is one reason why I am holding ordering.

Videos
https://youtu.be/FqGR6X5Wfhc
https://youtu.be/C-2r4Y_lUsk

LR is handling this cold weather much better.
https://youtu.be/N2s71w2W9UA
«13456713

Comments

  • Nobody here will know but don’t worry, opinions are on the way.
  • This has been discussed at Nauseum. Read some of the 100s of threads on this Forum. Simply, a cold battery doesnt charge as fast as a warm battery. If you precondition the battery you will not experience the slower charging ramp up while the battery warms up. And of course this would only occur if you were going to a Supercharger after leaving your car in the cold for hours. If you have been driving on a long trip and stop at a supercharger then your battery is already warm. Or just enter the supercharger into the nav as a destination and the car automatically prewarms the battery on your drive there. Most EV owners charge at home, at night, so it is not a issue.

    If you happen to need to supercharge with a cold battery then yes it will take some additional time to charge.
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > This has been discussed at Nauseum. Read some of the 100s of threads on this Forum. Simply, a cold battery doesnt charge as fast as a warm battery. If you precondition the battery you will not experience the slower charging ramp up while the battery warms up. And of course this would only occur if you were going to a Supercharger after leaving your car in the cold for hours. If you have been driving on a long trip and stop at a supercharger then your battery is already warm. Or just enter the supercharger into the nav as a destination and the car automatically prewarms the battery on your drive there. Most EV owners charge at home, at night, so it is not a issue.
    >
    > If you happen to need to supercharge with a cold battery then yes it will take some additional time to charge.

    This is not related charging at all.
    Please read post and check videos.
  • That Bjorn, such a kidder....
  • It is related to charging and a cold battery pack. Everything he talks about is a cold battery pack. He does mention the new battery is more tolerant of a cold battery while supercharging. What he mostly talks about is the reduced power of the performance with a cold battery and less than 20% SOC.

    So Tesla reduces power on a performance when you have a cold battery. Who cares? Do you want to race someone with a cold battery or get to where your going? If you want to race someone preheat the battery.

    It’s there to protect the battery when it’s cold from the enormous amount of power a performance can draw when you mash the go pedal.
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > It is related to charging and a cold battery pack. Everything he talks about is a cold battery pack. He does mention the new battery is more tolerant of a cold battery while supercharging. What he mostly talks about is the reduced power of the performance with a cold battery and less than 20% SOC.
    >
    > So Tesla reduces power on a performance when you have a cold battery. Who cares? Do you want to race someone with a cold battery or get to where your going? If you want to race someone preheat the battery.
    >
    > It’s there to protect the battery when it’s cold from the enormous amount of power a performance can draw when you mash the go pedal.

    Why then LR with LG battery can provide more power out than this Panasonic in cold weather?

    Problem is that heatpump scavenger too much heat from battery which cause that Performance goes to limp mode. Please review those videos. Charging is not issue. Battery temp is issue because system is not keeping it warm to provide energy out.

    If you check those numbers you can see that Performance is lower than ICE or LR.
  • > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > Why then LR with LG battery can provide more power out than this Panasonic in cold weather?

    Because the Long Range is not a Performance. The performance has the ability to draw enormous amounts of current (A lot more than the LR) when you mash on the go pedal. Doing this with a cold battery is bad so the car limits this.

    > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > Problem is that heatpump scavenger too much heat from battery which cause that Performance goes to limp mode.

    Preheat the battery if you want to mash the Go pedal. And in the Video the car reduced power but didnt go into "Limp" mode until the SOC was well below 20%. If your looking for the car to maintain full performance with a cold battery pack and a low SOC you should reconsider getting an EV.

    > @FeelingSpeed said:
    >Battery temp is issue because system is not keeping it warm to provide energy out.

    Agreed, Cold battery is the issue. Do you want range or performance? You cant have both with a cold battery. As he showed in the Video if you want to maintain full performance you need to heat the battery and loose range, otherwise the car will do its best to extend the range.
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > > Why then LR with LG battery can provide more power out than this Panasonic in cold weather?
    >
    > Because the Long Range is not a Performance. The performance has the ability to draw enormous amounts of current (A lot more than the LR) when you mash on the go pedal. Doing this with a cold battery is bad so the car limits this.
    >
    > > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > > Problem is that heatpump scavenger too much heat from battery which cause that Performance goes to limp mode.
    >
    > Preheat the battery if you want to mash the Go pedal. And in the Video the car reduced power but didnt go into "Limp" mode until the SOC was well below 20%. If your looking for the car to maintain full performance with a cold battery pack and a low SOC you should reconsider getting an EV.
    >
    > > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > >Battery temp is issue because system is not keeping it warm to provide energy out.
    >
    > Agreed, Cold battery is the issue. Do you want range or performance? You cant have both with a cold battery. As he showed in the Video if you want to maintain full performance you need to heat the battery and loose range, otherwise the car will do its best to extend the range.

    SoC will go very low when you drive long trips. Then it's better to get low soc because you get faster charging.

    LR can keep performance much better than Performance on low soc. Battery temps are almost same, few 1-2C difference.

    Tesla should thinking add range mode option. This option could give you range but battery is cold. But when option is disabled then system should heat battery and give performance.

    But still main problem is that heatpump scavenger too much heat from battery in LR and Performance.

    When you check older battery in LR and Performance which don't have heatpump battery temps are staying in 30-35C even in cold weather.
  • > @FeelingSpeed said:
    >SoC will go very low when you drive long trips. Then it's better to get low soc because you get faster charging.
    >LR can keep performance much better than Performance on low soc. Battery temps are almost same, few 1-2C difference.

    As your video pointed out the newer Performance supercharges better than the older Performance with a cold battery. And I completely understand the LR doesn't limit a cold battery as much as the Performance because the Performance needs to protect the battery from a person mashing on the go pedal with a cold battery and low SOC. The performance is a lot faster than a LR and draws significantly more current so it needs to protect the battery.



    > @FeelingSpeed said:
    >But still main problem is that heatpump scavenger too much heat from battery in LR and Performance.

    The purpose of the heat pump is to improve range. Warm the battery if you want Performance but you will loose the range gained by the heat pump.



    > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > When you check older battery in LR and Performance which don't have heatpump battery temps are staying in 30-35C even in cold weather.

    Yes because the heat pump gives the car a greater range. You can heat the battery and loose the range gained by the heat pump. I understand it would be great if you kept both the range and the performance in cold weather but that's not possible. Maybe in the future, but right now warming the battery = performance and not warming the battery allows the saved energy to be used for driving.
  • I understand than you point. But there should be option keep performance if customer want it. I understand that too Tesla want to cover battery but Performance should still be faster than LR in cold.
  • > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > I understand than you point. But there should be option keep performance if customer want it.

    As I said, warm the battery. Put a SC as a destination in the nav and the warming will begin. Is your point there should be a button to enable warming in a performance?

    > @FeelingSpeed said:
    I understand that too Tesla want to cover battery but Performance should still be faster than LR in cold.

    I disagree, The battery needs more protection from the massive HP of the performance. But to your original post, nothing is broken, the heat pump has its benefits and drawbacks. You choose to heat or not heat. Range or performance.
  • you can set your car to precondition at or by a certain time. that will warm the battery. you can also turn on cabin heater from your phone and it will also warm the battery a bit. Teslas are very smart vehicles if you know how to use them.
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > Is your point there should be a button to enable warming in a performance?

    And as I rethink my statement isn't that already Track Mode in the performance?
  • “ isn't that already Track Mode in the performance?”

    Which maximizes battery cooling, so not much help here.

    I disagree that the AWD and P are so different in power delivery, especially one with performance boost. They should behave similarly in cold. If there’s an issue with the heat pump scavenging too much heat then that will be addressed with an update.

    These threads appear to be hit jobs. Every time I hear, but Byorn said..... I know where it’s going
  • Whether OP likes it or not, if the vehicle did not protect itself against cold temperatures in the form of reduced battery capacity and performance, then OP would be complaining about battery and/or vehicle damage and how Tesla oversaw this issue with a $$$$ car.

    In layman's terms, you would complain no matter what happened. IMO, you should be thankful that Tesla cares more about protecting your vehicle so that you dont damage it, like how you can start a gasoline car in -10°F and then immediately floor it like you're about to drive a grand prix.
  • > @lbowroom said:
    > Which maximizes battery cooling, so not much help here.

    Is it Just cooling? Or would it warm a cold pack too??? If a P goes to the track with a cold battery and hits Track mode what happens? I don't have a P so I have no clue.



    > @lbowroom said:
    > I disagree that the AWD and P are so different in power delivery, especially one with performance boost. They should behave similarly in cold.

    I agree they could be the same if the LR AWD had boost, but this was not a comparison to a Boosted car. Boosting the car might change the algorithm and the Boosted LR might then have similar cold limit characteristics as a P, I have no idea..... BUT, The P has a 211kw, 283 HP rear motor. The LR has a 188kw, 252 HP rear motor. That is a 23kw difference so there could be a reason to limit the P more than the LR.



    > @lbowroom said:
    >If there’s an issue with the heat pump scavenging too much heat then that will be addressed with an update.

    Its range vs performance. If the heat pump is scavenging energy from the pack, then your getting more range. If Tesla lowers the scavenging then you might get less range. IMHO EV's are all about range.
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > > I understand than you point. But there should be option keep performance if customer want it.
    >
    > As I said, warm the battery. Put a SC as a destination in the nav and the warming will begin. Is your point there should be a button to enable warming in a performance?
    >
    My country there is lot of SC so that won't help me.

    Here another test made in warm weather. Still same problem that power drops.

    https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/5338730/

    So Panasonic battery can't give enough power out.
  • There is not edit button?
    Not so much SC on my country.
  • > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > Here another test made in warm weather. Still same problem that power drops.
    >
    > https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/5338730/
    >
    > So Panasonic battery can't give enough power out.

    So now its "not" a cold battery? So if the battery is not cold are you now saying its just a low SOC that the P limits on? Because if the battery is warm then the heat pump is not part of the equation. This thread is all over the place.

    I still stand by the P demands 23 kw more then the LR so more limits could be normal at a low SOC or a Cold battery. The battery certainly can deliver enough power or it would not obtain the 0-60 rating.
  • This feels like much ado about nothing.
  • > @Bighorn said:
    > This feels like much ado about nothing.

    +1
  • @FeelingSpeed What country are you in?
  • Cold weather is going to adversely affect batteries some how, some way. This is not anything broken. If you are in an area that has colder temps, then you can have degraded performance, no matter what version. Small differences between vehicle versions is not a "problem" to be fixed.

    But thanks for creating a hot button topic 2 days after joining the forums! Keep grinning!
  • > @HAL2001 said:
    > > @FeelingSpeed said:
    > > Here another test made in warm weather. Still same problem that power drops.
    > >
    > > https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/5338730/
    > >
    > > So Panasonic battery can't give enough power out.
    >
    > So now its "not" a cold battery? So if the battery is not cold are you now saying its just a low SOC that the P limits on? Because if the battery is warm then the heat pump is not part of the equation. This thread is all over the place.
    >
    > I still stand by the P demands 23 kw more then the LR so more limits could be normal at a low SOC or a Cold battery. The battery certainly can deliver enough power or it would not obtain the 0-60 rating.
    >

    Hard to say but seems that there is something wrong in software or hardware if battery has higher temperature and still not performance correctly.
  • > @derotam said:
    > Cold weather is going to adversely affect batteries some how, some way. This is not anything broken. If you are in an area that has colder temps, then you can have degraded performance, no matter what version. Small differences between vehicle versions is not a "problem" to be fixed.
    >
    > But thanks for creating a hot button topic 2 days after joining the forums! Keep grinning!
    >
    Cold weather off course affect battery but this is not main problem here. Because older 2018-2019 Performance models can handle situations better and also new 2021 LR model.
Sign In or Register to comment.