General

2016 Chevy Volt, Model 3 competitor?

edited November -1 in General
35k minus incentives
80 km
Regular gasoline
5 seats
New aero look

What's your thought on GM's move
«134

Comments

  • edited November -1
    What's your thought on GM's move

    Considering that Tesla's technology has proven to be far superior, and this technology is free for GM to use, and GM still chooses to not use this superior technology, to me, it's clear that GM has no direction, no vision for the future.
  • edited November -1
    If it burns gas, it isn't a competitor.
  • edited November -1
    It is interesting how people and even the media come up with these "Tesla killer/competition" statements, comparing an existing car (Volt) to a non existing car (Model 3). why don't we compare a modern Boeing 787 to a self propelled electric airplane.
  • edited November -1
    CNBC this morning:

    GM to fall short of electric vehicle goal.

    Surprise!
  • edited November -1
    All click-grabbing stories with the word "Tesla" in them are good.

    A couple of previous posts are referring to "Volts" when it seems they meant "Bolts". Remember, the Bolt is the all-electric car and would be the most direct competitor to a Tesla.
  • edited November -1
    GM expects to fall short of 2017 electric vehicles target

    This link says that the goal of 500,000 cars at least partially powered by electricity will not be reached due to increased competition. That is a huge and all-encompassing number to reach in one year! Silly to have made that prediction in the first place

    www.cnbc.com/id/102662082

    This little company makes parts for Tesla and its penny stock went up 10,000% on the rumors that Tesla would buy it.

    There is lots of Tesla mention in this edition of CNBC.
  • edited November -1
    Volts are way cooler than Caprices, but not near as cool as Teslas: Twice as cool as a Spark, but half as cool as a Roadster. Hope they get it right....
  • edited November -1
    Considering many studies show 80% of all daily miles are less than 40 a car like the Volt makes sense. For less than $30K after the $7500 federal tax credit millions of American's could drive 100% electric and still be able to wander.

    Indon't get how some folks think ONLY 100% electric costing $70k to $100k is the ONLY option.

    the Volt is the perfect bridge vehicle until that magic time when folks can buy a truly affordable BEV with super fast charging on every corner. Until then any vehicle than can accomplish some of that should be celebrated.
  • edited November -1
    Does GM make anything worth driving?
    It should have been allowed to fail in 2009.
  • edited November -1
    Elon himself has said that any new EVs would not *really* be the competition. The challenge is still that people just automatically prefer cars with the traditional ICEs. Sure new EVs would be competition for getting those consumers that are already sold on the whole EV concept, but that is still - unfortunately - a tiny minority. Of course GenIII is designed to changed that, but any new EVs or even just better hybrids would be a step towards the overall goal of getting EVs to become mainstream and dominant and so probably instead of being a real competition, they would rather be beneficial. So I wouldn't worry about these announcements, from GM or any other company until EVs are more or less the default choice or at the very least have a significant market slice but we are at least 5-10 years away from that assuming everything goes perfectly smoothly.
  • edited November -1
    Under the heading <I>'I'll believe it when I see it'</I> reside my serious doubts regarding a fully electric vehicle with a 200 mile range arriving from General Motors by 2017. I think it much more likely the Chevrolet Bolt will include a gasoline powered <I>'range extender'</I> like its sibling, the Volt. Only with a larger battery pack and a smaller fuel tank, so that it remains properly gimped.

    <hr width="60%">

    <b>Ratan shah wondered, <I>"Does GM make anything worth driving?"</I></b>

    Surprisingly... Yes. At least, according to reports from <i>Car and Driver, Motor Trend</I>, and <i>Consumer Reports</I> in recent years. Cars from Cadillac and Buick in particular have been singled out as having improved to a point where their handling characteristics have eclipsed the perennial benchmark established by BMW 3-Series. Debates rage over whether they simply copied the <I>'Ultimate Driving Machine'</I> and tweaked the formula along the way... Or whether BMW was caught resting on their laurels... Or if in the course of taming their vehicles four a wider market, BMW built better cars, but worse BMWs.
  • edited November -1
    Regens, people do not automatically prefer ICE cars; they love cars but they have come to hate gas companies.
  • edited November -1
    cmcnestt, most of our (U.S) imported oil comes from Canada. Actually of the top 5 places we get oil from, only 2 are form the middle east (Iraq and Saudi). I believe Iraq is number 5. This is one leading reason I got the Tesla. A vast majority of oil comes form our neighbors up North, yet when something happens 15,000 miles from here, the price of gas goes up instantly.
  • edited November -1
    Anyone that thinks Tesla only competes with electric cars is very short sided. Tesla competes with all cars because it's not enough to be electric you also have to be a great value. If they plan on selling 500k model 3's they're going to have to go head to head with lots of ICE vehicles and show people they're better.

    As for the volt as of right now it's the best electric car for $25k. My wife drives one and she is getting well over 350 miles to the gallon without the range anxiety that the leaf owners have.
  • edited November -1
    Anyone that thinks Tesla only competes with electric cars is very short sided. Tesla competes with all cars because it's not enough to be electric you also have to be a great value. If they plan on selling 500k model 3's they're going to have to go head to head with lots of ICE vehicles and show people they're better.

    As for the volt as of right now it's the best electric car for $25k. My wife drives one and she is getting well over 350 miles to the gallon without the range anxiety that the leaf owners have.
  • edited November -1
    The key to mass adoption is range, recharge and price.

    Range: The car has to have at least 200 mile range or forget about ever taking it on a road trip.

    Recharge: People are not willing to wait more than 30 minutes to recharge except at home or work.

    Price: Outside of a small minority most people aren't willing to pay more to be green. Those that are probably already have an EV or hybrid.

    If Tesla meets its goals of 200+ miles a charge, super charger capable and under $30k with tax incentives. They will have a real winner.
  • edited November -1
    A Volt is no more an electric car than the Tesla is a hybrid!
  • edited November -1
    sde;
    short-sighted

    Tesla is not even competing yet. That will come when its sales are limited by choices others offer.
  • edited November -1
    <quote>A Volt is no more an electric car than the Tesla is a hybrid!</quote>

    Why do you say that? Most Volt users drive most of their miles all-electric. That means most of the time it may as well be considered an electric car, regardless of EV orthodoxy.

    The Volt is the only car I would say that about. The non-plugin hybrids are still ICE vehicles -- they get all of their energy from gasoline. The other plugin hybrids have too small an all-electric range to get most of their miles that way. The Volt is the only PHEV (EREV if you prefer) that gets most of its miles from electricity.
  • edited November -1
    tailpipe. look for the tailpipe.
  • edited November -1
    <i>tailpipe. look for the tailpipe.</i>

    That tells whether that vehicle can ever operate non-electrically. It says nothing at all about how much of the time the vehicle <i>does</i> operate electrically.

    Let's not get hung up on the all-electric-all-the-time religion. I realize that is the ideal, but people who operate <i>almost</i> all of the time electrically are not doing so badly. That, by the way, applies to anyone who has a Tesla that is not their <i>only</i> car. To the extent the other car gets used they are also operating electrically only part of the time -- something I have seen a number of those posting in this forum say is still reality for them.
  • edited November -1
    Well, yes...most Volt owners DO spend relatively little on gasoline and drive mostly electric. However, they are limited to 35+ miles at a go for previous/current models, and up to 50 miles with the 2016. Park and charge for several hours like at work, and yes, a Volt 'could' cover 80 to 100 miles a day using no gasoline.

    Whereas a Tesla Model 3 for about the same price, would be able to travel 200 miles a day--and plugged in at 240 at work in the same scenario as the Volt--about 400 miles a day. Or just 30 minutes at a Supercharger to add another 100+ miles.

    So no, a 2016 Volt is not any sort of competition for existing Teslas unless mileage is limited to 50 X 2 = 100 miles per day. With the Model 3--if available with the promised parameters of range and price--then the 2016+ Volt is no competition at all. AsWell, I very much doubt that the Bolt will be a fully competent competitor to a Model 3.
  • edited November -1
    A Voltish hybrid is second-class in each of its modes.
  • edited November -1
    It is do or die for Tesla and so it is an elimination game they must win. As such I expect the 3 to be a better car than the Bolt.

    The corporate espionage will be fierce! Can't be taken by surprise.
  • edited November -1
    I currently drive a Ford C-Max Energi. Before that I had an Escape Hybrid. I've been watching the EV scene since I was a teen in the '70s when people were converting small cars to EV using lead acid batteries and surplus jet engine starter motors.

    My grandfather had an Autoette http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoette, powered by 4 6V deep cycle LA batteries. I restored it and got it licensed in CA. Went about 15 miles at 15 mph :)

    And I have a reservation for an X.

    All of that is preamble to this: Tesla S, X, and 3 are in competition with EV, Hybrid, Fuel Cell, and ICE cars in their respective categories. It doesn't matter if they have a tailpipe or a really long cord.

    At the same time, it is not a winner-take-all competition. Even if Tesla is selling its goal of 500K Model 3s in 2020, that will be a small percentage of the total auto market.

    Tesla's real goal is to me a mover, innovator, and catalyst to bring about an electric power economy. I think the real innovation is the Supercharger Network. We pay for that network as part of the price we pay for Tesla cars. Tesla has said that any company that wants to make their batteries compatible with Superchargers may do so--and also make a per-vehicle payment to Tesla for access. Compatible battery systems don't even need to be able to charge at 120MW to be workable. The chargers can be smart enough to charge at the rate applicable to each vehicle.

    As some point, Tesla can even allow charging via payment for those manufacturers that don't want to pay per vehicle.

    Tesla's cars have to be great <b>cars</b> to get enough of them on the road to make the rest of the infrastructure play profitable. But they don't need to be the only game in town.

    As the market matures and people start to move away from ICE because they see the EVs are just better cars, Tesla will be a premier marque. It won't be the only game in town. But they are also setting themselves up to the next Standard Oil/Exxon/Shell of the EV energy market.
Sign In or Register to comment.