Wow, as much as I wish Tesla had not raised prices recently, it's impressive that they have so much demand that they *can* raise prices! Chevy seems to be lowering the price of the Volt in order to stimulate demand.
my sell my wife's prius and get a volt
this is car that goes electric for 35 miles, then you drive around in an underpowered gas car with a 200 lb dead battery, right?
I would love for the Volt to be successful--it would be good for EV momentum and I give GM credit for trying to create a mainstream product instead of positioning EVs as an alien-spawned, tree-hugger niche product (I am looking at you IBM).
I thought they were replacing the Volt with the new Spark?
I am planning on sending GM a thank you note because if they didn't crush the EV1 Elon and the team would never have created this amazing car to change the world in various ways.
This is so funny...
GM has to lower prices because, according to them, a $40,000 price of entry poses a serious obstacle. Huh... yet Tesla is able to sell as many $80,000 Model S vehicles as it can possibly make and is raising prices to help modulate demand so that it doesn't end up with more orders than production capacity.
GM needs more than just a committee to study Tesla. GM needs a brain transplant.
I drive a volt and a model S - I would love to have the superchargers all available and running so that I could ditch the volt... but until the infrastructure is ready, the volt is a great way to go.
It's funny to read how rich people think in this thread... :)
GM now is having Volt batteries made domestially under new contract with LG Chem. Cutting input prices allows lower costs which will lead to more sales. That's about it. If you want to see more Tesla Model S sold, you will support all aspects of EV adoption. Your house-maid, cabana boy and yacht club maintenance men will need EVs and perhaps it will be a used Volt some day.
Another thing is - if you guys don't support Volts, Leafs and so on - then the EV industry may die-off as would infrastructure and sales to support your own choices. The bandwagon is big and it is open. Get on it.
I love my Model S but I am a car enthusiast with a stupid willingness to spend discretionary cash on a fun car. I still believe the Volt is the most practical electric car in the world. A normal person could actually have it as their primary car. Frankly, I am startled by anyone who would own a MS as their only car.
I drive mine over 95% of the time and wouldn't trade it for anything but if I were on any kind of restricted budget the Volt is the first place I would look. For all practical purposes it can be an all electric daily driver for me with the benefit that it can go anywhere anytime when needed.
And don't even talk to me about the added weight of the gas engine and fuel tank. This car is still way lighter than a MS while allowing plenty of battery for the average commuter.
Don't get me wrong. I own a MS (Performance) and just passed my one year anniversary of ownership. I don't own a Volt. It's just that I totally see the value of the Volt. However, the reality is that those who would consider the Volt care a lot about their monthly budget and it needs to make them whole. With a $5k reduction it might get closer.
Here's hoping the Volt gets a jolt with the new pricing.
Tesla has the upper end of the market to itself. GM cutting the Volt's price isn't going to cost Tesla any business.
As is said in earlier posts, the more ev's and/or hybrids on the market, the better for the future of the field.
@ gimp_dad - why are you startled by someone who owns a Model S as their only vehicle? I plan on having it as my only vehicle. Is there something I don't know? LOL
We have an Ampera (European Volt) and the Tesla wil be the second vehicle. The Ampera is a nice car, but we look foreward to owning only full electric vehicles.
The way I see it-- Tesla has saved every future Volt owner 5k. GM knows the future competition will be very serious in their own backyard (with Gen III). Tesla wins by accelerating the adoption of electric vehicles.
@gimp_dad - model S is perfect as the only car... at least for me, does more then I will ever need.
@KevinR - Tesla is not accelerating the adoption of electric vehicles. That's like a boss taking credit for his underlings' work. Tesla is selling high end EVs. The at-home conversion guys have bee building them for 10+ years now. Leaf and Volt were out two years before Model-S sales began in late 2012. Model-S sales would suck without the 2-year lead by the underlings. Model-S is very nice. It is not the reason for the EV adoption rate.
What it may be doing is getting rich guys who want a thrill into a luxury EV with some power. Powerful people want to "feel" powerful with the bigger size, high-tech display and rubber-burning acceleration. Not environmental nor economical. This is where the other companies fell behind. No "muscle car" EV on their sales sheets. Yet. Making Prius beaters was what they did - Leaf, Volt, etc. Tesla bet the farm on "the opposite end of the spectrum" to the BMW M5 and AMG crowd who want something to compensate for their lack of whatever they need to satisfy themselves with vehicle power. Even knowing you have that power sitting idle in the garage satisfies them. Owning things - that's what life is all about, right?
With all due respect, I've never read more nonsense in my life! Do you paint with such broad strokes in all areas where you have an opinion?
Model S is only for rich guys who want a thrill because "powerful people want to 'feel' powerful"? Only someone with a deeply seated inferiority complex would say something like that - or someone who has something against people they perceive to be "rich" or "powerful". I am neither, for your information. I am a middle class real estate agent living in suburbia who is trying to make a living. I am buying a Model S not because I am rich, powerful, or want to feel powerful through my personal possessions. I am buying this car because my Prius has over 120,000 miles, swore my next car would be a pure EV, and I choose to vote with my dollars by rewarding the company who has done the best job to create the all around best EV. I have also published my HPWC on plugshare.com for all other Model S owners to use when they are nearby and need to top off. But I suppose generosity and sense of community is nowhere on your list of traits ascribed to Model S owners, just being "rich and powerful". What a load!
Also, you say that "Tesla is selling high end EVs" yet "Tesla is not accelerating the adoption of electric vehicles." Can you please repeat that, because I really want to take the time to admire the flawed logic in your thinking. Selling any EV accelerates the adoption of EVs by virtue of getting more of them out on the road. You are dismissing Tesla's contribution because you feel it is a vehicle for the "rich" and "powerful" (a very misinformed assertion) and you have something against anything that is viewed in a positive light by anyone who may be remotely associated with being "rich" and "powerful" according to your criteria. Ok, I get it now.
But the Leaf and Volt should get all of the credit for the higher EV adoption rate because, why? GM can't move enough Volts so it has to drop the price by $5,000 to stimulate demand of a $40,000 vehicle when Tesla has no trouble moving an $80,000 vehicle. By the end of this year there will be as many Model S on the road in the US as there are Leafs. If you watch the news, Model S just commanded 8% of the US luxury auto market. I guess that isn't doing anything to help the EV adoption rate either, eh, because it refers to "luxury"?
Seriously, I try to not be confrontational here but the arrogance expressed in your post just set me off!
The reason I'm startled by people who would own only an EV (even an EV that is IMO the best car ever built on this earth) is that there is tremendous driving flexibility in the US that is being left on the table as of today with an EV household.
I truly value the flexibility of being able to hop into my car with zero planning and go from pretty much anywhere to pretty much anywhere else. It surprises me when I find someone who can afford a car in the price range of a MS but who can fully live their life without the above mentioned flexibility.
I was born in the 60's and have been on road trips all over the US and beyond. During those family road trips it was not uncommon to instantaneously decide to drive off in completely unplanned directions to see or do something interesting. This is just one of the great things about the US road infrastructure that has been built over the last 100 years.
None of this is required for life (usually) but, personally, I have no desire to leave all that capability and flexibility on the table. And, I don't need to.
That said, I certainly know people who don't care about the above even though I don't fully get it. :-)
@Amped - the issue is too many Tesla-fans are saying Tesla-alone is causing EV adoption to occur. While we have had 2+ years of crappy political footballing going on with Congress, GM-haters, Volt "fires", leaf battery trouble in Phoenix, etc. I like Tesla and indeed think it is a good vehicle. I would buy a cheaper 40kWh model (would fit my needs of 90% of my driving and 100% of my wife's) at say $43K-45K. But the things said in context of Tesla and by the "Volt bashers" in forums like this have no context if they never rode in one nor even know how the thing works. it has flaws and is about a 0.9 beta model and is getting better with every firmware release. Get rid of the vampire energy drain and I'll raise my views a touch more.
Could not disagree with you more.
I have driven & rode in a Volt many times. Wish they had gone with more battery & no ICE. The Volt & Leaf play the game of having to pay more and accept less if you want to drive electric.
I converted my previous hybrid to a plug in hybrid. The local dealership insisted that I was damaging their car (WTF!?)... Ultimately, I did have to tinker with the vehicle way too much and was still burning gas.
I do not consider myself wealthy.
When I ordered my car, 18 months before delivery, I bought stock to offset the purchase price. As it stands right now I "paid" 20k for my SP.
Tesla has moved the electric vehicle from an eccentric pursuit to a mainstream consumer product in an amazingly short period of time.
GM sold the Volt with the line "It's more car than electric"
Tesla has made it "More car and electric"
I think the crucial difference MS brings to the table and market is the sheer joy of driving. None of the other contenders can touch it.
To expand a bit:
As for the groundwork by the hobby/DIY EV makers, at no point has it ever looked like they would impact public opinion or inspire enthusiasm. To say that TM has done so in spades is to observe the obvious. And that's why it is single-handedly doing what has never been achieved before.
I support EVs, but a Volt is not an EV. Perhaps they will consider offering an EV version of the Volt that has double the battery and range, but no gas engine.
Wider and faster adoption of EVs should quicken the decline of battery coast. That's one good reason for supporting wider adoption.
FWI, I only own my S85 and it is my daily driver (no 2nd/backup vehicle). Also, please correct me, but certainly in the state of CA there is a need by automakers to have all-electric or similar very low emission vehicles to meet the rules, and that they often/usually sell these vehicles at a true $$ loss (since they essentially make it back by selling a big pickup truck or the like). Chevy likely lowered the price on the Volt to meet the recent price cut on the Leaf.
An article on The Street (forgive me) suggests that this cost reduction is simply reducing the list price to reflect the realized price for Volts that have been achieving for some time now.
Yes there are those (on this forum) who think Tesla owners sit around eating Bon Bons and saying things like "Let them eat Volts"
Tough being on the outside looking in.
What puzzles me is the following... take for example the BMW I3 - the range extender weighs 330 lbs, replace that weight with a battery you can add 26kWh - so with 22kWh on board plus 26 kWh that is 48 kWh and should be good for 180-200 miles. Probably similar numbers are true for the Volt - why nobody going that way?
Note that this is not actually a price drop -- all they are doing is folding the existing $5k instant rebate into the base price of the vehicle so it looks better in MSRP comparisons (you might save some on sales tax though).
While I do not believe that Tesla invented the EV revolution I believe they moved it a quantum step forward. This is because it was made with the 'attempt' to not compromise (appearance, range and power) and it has received such high praise from Consumer Reports and several of the Motor Magazines.
I hope that the introduction of the Tesla and the good buzz created by even the projection of a more affordable Gen III will bring additional competition to the EV industry.
Maybe in 5-10 years I will trade in my S on a better made and longer range product from Chevy, Ford or a European or Japanese car maker. Doubtful, but I will try to keep an open mind and hope in my lifetime we will see at least 50% of all new vehicles produced run on electricity.
As I stated in an earlier post. GM has offered the Chevy Spark now, an all electric vehicle with more than double the 37 mile range! I have 2 friends that own them. They come loaded with a 3.3Amp charger and the December version will be able to DC Fast Charge. The current model is limited to 208V by 30A charging, but my friends did not want to wait until December for the possibility of DC Fast Charging.
The Volt has it's place. In the pure EV realm, EVs are still limited. Tesla is working on it, but it will take a few years before the supercharger network is in place making Tesla EVs match the capability of ICE powered cars.
The place for the Volt is in providing a path into electrification without sacrificing long range capability. Personally, I need the long range capability weekly for my job. I have to be able to make a 2 day 260 mile round trip fairly regularly, with no charging options at the half way point. An 85 kWh Model S can _almost_ do that, but not quite. Certainly not with the vampire drain over night. And probably not in winter. The Superchargers will need to be in place before this trip will work (or Tesla will have to offer a bigger battery).
I'm not the typical case, but I do serve as an example. At least for the next couple of years, the Volt is the most electrified vehicle there is that will work for me.
The carrying around dead weight arguments against the Volt are weak. What if I put my Volt in a mode where it draws evenly from the battery and the gas tank. Then there is no dead weight? But nothing really changed. What about all those cars out there that are running on half empty gas tanks or EVs on half drained batteries? Aren't they carrying dead weight? What if you only drive your Model S maybe 40 miles per day and charge every night. Isn't the extra battery capacity dead weight? The dead weight is only an issue if it is almost never used and, more importantly, not desired. Most Volt owners get good use out of both the engine and the battery and are happy to have both. If you want to argue about unnecessary weight, I could easily argue that the Model S should have been a smaller car.
We just got back from our first "road trip" in our Volt. It will be the only time we drive the Volt to the mountains of Colorado. (The Supercharger will be up and running in Silverthorne CO soon.)
We drove 425 miles on 9.5 gallons of gas for the trip. The Volt has plenty of power for the big mountain passes here in Colorado.
It amuses me of all of the misinformation on this forum about the Volt. I drive the Volt around town 93% electric. We have driven the Volt 6,500 miles (before this trip), burning only 11.5 gallons of gas.
The Volt is a Awesome little EREV (Extended range electric vehicle). It is NOT a hybrid. When you pull the spark plugs from a hybrid, it will not move one inch. When you pull the plugs from the Volt, you will be able to drive it around 50 miles before the engine will not start to run the GENERATOR.
I get 50 miles per electric charge in my Volt. 75% of Americans drive 40 miles or less per day. Driving this much, you will never burn any gas anyway.
Both the Tesla Model S and The Chevy Volt are awesome in their own way. My seats in the tiny little Volt are very comfortable. I can not say the same about our Model S's.