Owners of new models S and X without referral has 400 free kWh per year, I couldn't find any info regarding Model 3 besides small fee will apply. Will Tesla offer 400 free kWh before fee applies?
It doesn't seem like they will.
Its mentioned in the updates, but they did not make a like... official statement.
I hope it will be but until Tesla or a current owner of a Model 3 reveals something we haven't heard, I fear not.
I highly doubt they will. They would probably have mentioned it already if it was true. And like you said the FAQ mentions the small fee and nothing else.
I read it as Model 3 does not get any free charging... small fee applies starting from kw #1
Tesla charges $0.20/kWh in California and it will be cheaper in most states. This is an $80 value... hopefully no one is losing sleep over this.
12Brent "Tesla charges $0.20/kWh in California and it will be cheaper in most states. This is an $80 value... hopefully no one is losing sleep over this."
No. There just inquiring. Hope that doesn't cause you any loss of sleep.
They said free 400kwh each year. after 400kwh you pay small fee to help build the Super Charger Stations.
The Model S/X get "all supercharging is free" with a referral. The Model 3 gets the fist 400 kWh free and then you pay per kWh after that.
@mcviethieu , @hoffmannjames
Wait, where does / did Tesla say the Model 3 would get 400kWh free supercharging? I don't remember hearing that anywhere.
Is there is link to the free initial 400 KWh per year. I remember it got mentioned but I thought that was related to MX/S and not the Model 3. For M3 I only see the small charge but no freebies.
Elon Musk specifically said the following in a shareholder's meeting in 2016.
"Model 3, from the beginning we said free charging is not included in the Model 3 – free unlimited charging is not included, so, free long distance is, but not free local. It becomes really unwieldy for people to use the gas station approach for electric cars, like, cars should really be charged where you charge your phone, but then you just need to solve the long distance problem which is what the supercharger stations will do."
You can read about it here:
He Said "Free Long Distance" but not "Free Local", which means that you are expected to use your own wall outlet to charge your car whenever possible, but while traveling away from home, Tesla will provide you with some amount of charging for free. At least, that seems to be the most straightforward, obvious way to interpret the phrase "free long distance."
"Free long distance" doesn't mean "free supercharging adapter" because that doesn't in any way decrease the cost of traveling long distance, although it might make it more convenient to charge your car along the way. And, if he wanted to say "free supercharger adapter", then what was stopping him from just saying it if that's specifically what he really meant by "free long distance?" Whenever I read someone stating "Musk never said 'free' and, even if he did, he didn't actually mean 'free': you just have to know how to read between the lines", I have to ask "Why does Elon put those 'lines' there in the first place? Wouldn't it be simpler, and more honest, to just speak unambiguously and clearly about an issue that many, many people really care about?"
And, if you don't care about this issue, then why are you reading this thread, aside from heckling people who honestly do care?
I don't see free anywhere unless you buy a S/X with caveats.
I think free long distance was the original idea but like spaceship steering controls was left out of the final product.
@Carl What Elon thinks does or doesn't look like a "spaceship", to him, is subjective.
"Free" means "free". If you are not going to give someone something "for free", you have no business saying that you will. Because people will count on that, and they have every right to do so. At the very least, Musk has a responsibility to apologize for using the word "free" if he didn't truly mean it. Or for announcing something "free" publically, but then later changing the plan and withdrawing the offer.
Simply pretending it never happened, and hope we all just forget about it, is how a child might handle it, but I'd expect something more from a mature adult and respected leader.
"Simply pretending it never happened, and hope we all just forget about it, is how a child might handle it, but I'd expect something more from a mature adult and respected leader."
Instead of getting all bent out of shape over it why not just wait until there is confirmation one way or the other.
Just because Elon said that about the Model 3 in 2016, doesn't mean it holds any water today. Unless someone has a link to something far more recent than last year, no one knows except those employees that got their cars.
They mention it here:https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-supercharging-program
It states the following: "For Teslas ordered after January 1, 2017, 400 kWh of free Supercharging credits will be included annually so that all owners can continue to enjoy free Supercharging during travel. Beyond that, there will be a small fee to Supercharge which will be charged incrementally and cost less than the price of filling up a comparable gas car."
It makes no specific indication of which model, but also indicates ALL Teslas ordered after January 1st. Model 3 is a Tesla, so one would assume this also applies. I dont know that they would need to make a specific announcement for Model 3 getting 400kWh of free supercharging, given that they have already made an announcement that ALL their cars will get that.
But like its been stated previously, there was in fact no official statement on this, so i would take this with a grain of salt, and add it to your list of "Questions to Ask" for the people at Tesla.
It doesn't put the issue to rest, since the Model 3 press kit specifically states "a small charge" w/o referring to the link you posted. But since the written SC policy was not updated in tandem with the press kit page, I'm starting to think that maybe yes, there will be limited free long distance SC. The balance of confusion has slightly shifted. ;>
IMO - the supercharger charge is barely above the kWh cost and it, therefore, is to cover the electricity provided and will not do much to defray the cost of building & maintaining the supercharger network.
andy, yes it does say that, however and this is Tesla's fault for not updating it , that was written/posted back when they changed the supercharger policy for the MS/MX.
@Andy As far as I know, the Model 3 is "a Tesla".
If Ford had a similar statement on their website "Fords will receive 1 free tank of gas per year for the life of the car." I think most people would reasonably and rightly assume that, when Ford came out with a new model, that model would also be eligible.
There wouldn't be rampant speculation amongst prospective purchasers of the new model, or future models "Well, they did say '1 free tank of gas for Fords', but did they mean THIS SPECIFIC Ford?" "Oh, surely they must have meant only existing Fords!" "No, 'Ford' means all Fords and 'Free' means free..." On and on, all the while Ford employees remain silent on the subject, enjoying their tubs of popcorn.
I am amazed what people are willing to let Tesla get away with. When are they going to be expected to grow up and start acting like a "real" company?
This article specifically says Model S/X. I think Tesla does need to come out at clarify...and I bet they will once some non-employees start receiving Model 3s.
@andy.connor.e makes a good point. But so does @jordanrichard. I think @dsvick has the right approach: just wait and see. Either way it's not a big deal. 400kWh free / year is only at most (in CA) $80 and when compared to the price of a $35,000+ car is insignificant.
Carl Thompson | August 17, 2017
@mcviethieu , @hoffmannjames
I think it is implies because the 400 kWh is part of the pay per use contract.
Actually 400kwh per Tesla works out to about 1,000 miles of driving. I don't know of any car that can go 1,000 miles for $80.
I know that some people will cite what it would cost them in electricity at home to get that many kwh's, but they are looking at it all wrong. The point of the supercharger network is to enable you to travel long distances that you would otherwise have to do in an ICE car. So you should look at how much gas would cost if you drove those same miles. that you got from the SC.
I'll be slightly disappointed if us new M3 owners don't get the 400kwh that was bandied about. Like, 2 out of a 10 on the scale of disappointment. Maybe only a 1.5. =)
For the Model 3, range is 310 miles / 75 kwh = 4.2 miles/kwh. 4.2 *400 kwh = 1675 miles of driving on 400 kwh.
An ICE getting 47 mpg, and paying $2.25 / gallon (about average around here), would pay $80 in gas to go those same 1675 miles. So, it's a bit cheaper to pay for Supercharger usage than to buy gas, but no better than about half the cost.
As jordan says, the numbers are vastly different if I use my home electric rate ($0.06 / kwh vs. $0.20 / kwh), but that's not really a valid option on a long trip.
Well my ICE gets 23-25 MPG and uses premium fuel. Home charging will substantially cheaper, and supercharging will cost less than half. Win-win.
@jordan "I don't know of any car that can go 1,000 miles for $80."
Either your math is way off or you assumed that Tesla would have to be cheaper and jumped to a conclusion. There are plenty of cars out there that can get 1000 miles for $80. Most fuel efficient cars will easily get well over 1000 miles for $80.
40 miles / gallon * ($80 / $2.50/gallon) = 1280 miles using conservative estimates.
I think you may be the one who is looking at it "all wrong"
You guys shouldnt waste energy focusing on the $ cost. Look at it as if you're getting 400/75 = 5.3 free full charges of the long range battery, and 400/50 = 8 free full charges on the standard battery.
Whats important is the mileage. The cost of 5.3 full charges is less than your phone bill. (typically)
The most significant numbers to focus on (IMO) is the total highway miles being given to you. In otherwords, the 4.2mi/kWh, 400x4.2 = 1675 free highway miles. Personally, i would not even use that amount in a full year. Its a small alleviated cost kind of like a free month of utilities. I think its invaluably generous that Tesla would even consider offering their customers something like this.
But to recap, the free 400kWh per year ideally, should NOT need to be verified since they indicated in an update that "All teslas purchased after January 1, 2017" would have this. As Fiddlesticks mentioned previously, there should not be a confusion of which model, because the company indicated ALL Tesla's. Always remain skeptical until proven otherwise.
johnniebuttelwerth, find me a car the size of a MS, with the equal performance, that gets 40 MPG............... Then find one that is the size and performance of even a M3, that gets 40 mpg..........
Also, cars with the performance of an EV/Tesla, require premium gas. I don't know about where you live but here CT, Premium cost $3.00 per gallon.
I agree it is generous of Tesla and a nice perk to have. The $80 is not going to make or break most people, I was just trying to accurately compare it to what a similar perk would be if offered by an ICE just for the heck of it.
@jordan I was only referring to your comment that you didn't know of any cars that could go 1000 miles on $80. I agree, taking performance into account gives you more like 800 miles with your 3.00 / gallon (we are around 1.75-2.25 per gallon here in Ohio with rewards programs offered by our groceries and United Dairy Farmers). The mustang camry and Acura TLX are some comps. But, I'd imagine most people on this forum would prefer a Tesla m3 to any one the said ICE performance cars any day.
Anyways, it would be great if Tesla offered that to us..
"Actually 400kwh per Tesla works out to about 1,000 miles of driving. I don't know of any car that can go 1,000 miles for $80"
I'm not sure what you're trying to say? We're talking about Teslas and not other cars. The 400kWh of free supercharging is $80 worth (in CA) regardless of how far your Tesla can go on that charge. So any Tesla owner that doesn't get the freebee is only out at most $80 / year. Seems a small amount to get worked up about when you likely spent 500-800 times that much for the car itself. Put another way that $80 likely represents less than 0.2% of the cars price.
Out of principal, what would be aggravating is seeing Tesla make an update indicating that "All Teslas" will get it, to find out the Model 3 will not get it (speculation). Obviously the dollar value is practically irrelevant over a 1 year period, but its like going to an open house, to find out that 25% of everything you've seen in the house is an upgrade and doesnt come with it. Disappointing is all.
The 400 kWh would be available from Tesla's superchargers, so the distance an ICE might travel is completely irrelevant. And as many have already said, that's an $80 yearly value. ... helpful, but not a big deal...
And since only Tesla employees have actually ORDERED a Model 3 after Jan 1, 2017 we'll all have to wait and see what their supercharger fee policy says AT THE TIME WE EACH ORDER.
What is the cost of Supercharging for Model 3?
Model 3 comes standard with the hardware necessary to utilize the global Tesla Supercharger Network. A small fee will apply for Supercharging—which is only a fraction of the cost of gas.
Everyone should expect there is no free allowance and be pleasantly surprised if there is.
I hope CHAdeMO adapter will work without any supplement payment. Was not the case with S60 without free supercharging enabled.
@krissu I imagine it will since supercharging will be standard on all Model 3's.
You'll need to pay whatever the company providing CHAdeMO service charges. Tesla is not involved with providing CHAdeMO service; they merely sell/provide the adapters.
Nevermind, I see that was a separate issue.
Soon we have first affordable long range car capable accepting CHAdeMO standard. It peaks at 62.5 kW, I wonder if such stations exists and
how much Tesla adapter max rate is? Mine did max 47 kW with station rated at 50 kW
47/48 kW is the most I've gotten. Max rate should be written on your adapter.
Tesla announced no more free supercharging after 1 Jan 2017 for ALL models. Then they changed it to 400kWh annually on ALL models. You can assume Model 3 would have been included. But they changed it again, stating ALL Model S/X get free charging for life (with a referral). Ever since this change there's been no mention (from Tesla) of the 400kWh annual allotment. Alas, we must wait and see I guess.
CHAdeMO adapter shows 125A max, means 50 kW. No advantage for Tesla with CHAdeMO stations over 50 kW. For now at least.
"($0.06 / kwh vs. $0.20 / kwh)"
Where do you live such that your local electric rate is 6 cents, but the supercharger rate is 20? Supercharger in my state is 20 cents, but I (used to) pay 16 cents from the electric company.
Thank you kindly.
Here it's about 8 cents a kWh, from 10 pm to 8 am.
Thank you kindly
Dont utility companies charge you for usage and delivery of the energy?