American Made?

American Made?

Correct me if I am wrong.

I know this car is going to be 'assembled' in California, and the battery is manufactured through Panasonic.
What about the other materials. Are they American made? Specifically, I hope this car is not just gathering parts made from all across the world and then it is just assembled in California.

Anyone know otherwise?

Vawlkus | April 8, 2011

Splitting hairs.

The batteries are manufactured in Japan (I believe), but the cells are built into the battery pack down in California.

If you get right down to it, almost NOTHING is made "entirely" in any one country. Parts come from here or there, stuff is fabricated here or there.

ckessel | April 8, 2011

What @Vawlkus said. Nothing of any complexity is really made in one country anymore. The parts are all either best of class, cheapest source, or some combination of both.

msiano17 | April 8, 2011

Very valid point. I just do not want the disappointment the new Camaro gave me.

American Muscle car reborn ---- build in Canada. Really defeats the purpose.

Plus it would be nice to have an American car to be able to compete with the German brands in a ring.

Mittar | April 8, 2011

If you're looking at the Model S because it's an "American Car" you're entirely missing the point.

msiano17 | April 8, 2011

It is by no means a selling point to me. My curiosity is just on where some of the major parts are coming from.

I do stand by the fact that it would be nice to have an American made car that can compete with the German brands.

Ramon123 | April 8, 2011

As I recall, the brakes are Brembo. They are used on Camaros, European high end sedans, etc. Where they're made I cannot determine. Probably several places. Who knows, or cares? As for a
Camaro being "built" in Canada, I believe you mean "assembled"
in Canada. GM uses a ton of Chinese made parts and has for many, many years now. With their UAW labor costs, there is no possible way for them to compete except by buying as many parts as possible
from non-union areas, which means outside the US. At $142K per year for a UAW guy bolting fenders on, there wouldn't be anything they could build that would be even remotely competitive, price wise.

searcher | April 9, 2011

If you want that baby to last and last better hope that a big chunk of the parts come from Germany.Many of Volvo's parts used to come from Germany, but alas who knows now. Any of the Scandanavian counties would be good as they just build stuff simply and to last.

Volker.Berlin | April 9, 2011

Brembo is a traditional Italian company. They have production in Italy, but they also have joint ventures to produce in Poland, India, China, South Africa and Brazil.

searcher | April 10, 2011

Well here we go, another can of worms to open. UAW maybe needs to go to China.Everybody has heard of the concept "pricing yourself out of the market" if we could just get some of the greed out of the system as a whole everything would be better. Profit is fine but don't be stupid and price yourself out of the ballgame. Also don't be stupid and go chasing after peasant wages and inferior products. Both based in "greed" way past normal and trditional profit parameters. Gets into "get rich quick" schemes pretty quick. Bet lot of all these dudes they are the "young guns" in the free enterprise system. Yeah, young cap pistols.

jfeister | April 10, 2011

The concept of product nationality is a relic, especially with something as complex as an automobile. The modern global economy is simply two intertwined. You would have to go to absurd lengths as a car company to ensure every material and component is mined, processed, fabricated, and assembled in the United States.

Look at the big 3 "American" car companies today. Their cars and parts are made and assembled all over the world, while many "foreign" car companies assembly their cars here.

We're all becoming one big happy family. Embrace it. :)

searcher | April 10, 2011

No I am not discussing to the contrary of the globla concept of building cars. Much to the contrary. Just said hope majority of vital parts come from the right countries if you want that baby to last and last. So apparently jfeister you are adressing a former post and not mine, right.

Vawlkus | April 11, 2011

How about this then: I just ordered a Ford Mustang (last ICE car I'll ever own, so I went big :p), and the "all American muscle car is being stalled. Why? Because the paint pigment comes from Japan, and as you may have heard, they're having something of a rough time over there ATM.

searcher | April 11, 2011

Vawlkus, Sorry to be so dense but didn't quite get your drift on the post. Objecting to global aspect of car making or what? The number one all time Classic American Muscle Car is the '65 Pontiac GTO. I owned one {tri power, hot rodded lifters,and four in the floor} color I will call metallic "Shark Blue". I never drove at exceesive top end speeds except on one occasion, just bought it for the looks. Enjoyed it tremendously until it got stolen, stripped, and burned.

Dan5 | April 11, 2011

It is true that most parts are sourced globally, but you also have to consider where the origin of the parts originate. The aluminum is technically from Jamaica or recycled locally, batteries and electronics are from Japan (The lithium is most likely coming from Chile or Argentina), the interior is probably sourced from the US or Mexico. I think the motor and transmission is from the US. Same for Toyota EV. Body panels and misc components probably from US.

Now if you look at another battery car, steel is from India (most likely recycled), Same sourcing from batteries and electronics (but may be getting stuff from China), Interior from Mexico, motor materials sourced from China (use rare earths in motor).

For and ICE car, steel from India, motor and transmission from Mexico (bought enough crate engines to know). Other parts probably same as Tesla or other battery car.

If I had a choice I would take the Tesla sourcing over other cars any day of the week.

Vawlkus | April 12, 2011

What I was trying to get across was that a car touted as being "all American", still has parts ( the paint in this case) that come from outside the US. The order that I placed for my Mustang is currently on hold while Ford tries to determine if they have enough paint to paint my car the color I want.

Brian H | April 12, 2011

Go with Henry Ford Black.

Volker.Berlin | April 13, 2011

Brian H, they did have black paint back then. But nowadays, probably even the black paint is sourced from some other country. :-P

Straight Shooter | April 13, 2011

As a Canadian, I'm stepping up on the "made in Canada" remark. The UAW had its time and place, and both are long over. We have the same problem up here, but to a much smaller extent. It is called the CAW. Same cancer, but ours is currently in remission.

When the AMERICAN car companies folder into Chapter 11, the UAW and CAW acted like total idiots. The CAW eventually remitted and took big pay cuts and compensation package reductions. We still lost multiple plants, but we were not impacted nearly as much as the UAW.

Ford is closing a plant next month too.

All 3 of my buddies went into automotive engineering. All work for auto parts manufactures and all offer OEM and after market parts. None have plants in North America. They are all in Crotia and China. They were forced to do this as Americans had already lowered production costs to rock bottom by using these two countries.

And now for reality.........

"Buy American" is a phrase invented by politicians in the USA to get themselves votes. When you delve into it, there isn't much revelance at all. Not only that, there isn't any compliance at all. Why, you ask? If Americans had the slightest interest in "Buy American" absolutely every Wal-mart in the country would be empty as 99.9% of the junk in there comes from China!!!! And I'll bet you and your wife have no issue shopping there.

Canadians build cars cheaper than Americans. Period. Cars assembled in Canada have a much higher quality level too. Period. Both of these points are valid for many years. Car makers don't put plants in Canada to be nice to us, they do it because of our price points and our quality.

If your "muscle car" was designed and built in the USA entirely, it would costs 2x-3x as much and the first few generations would break down a lot. Be thankful your "American" car is assembled in Canada with parts from all over the world, mostly China.

The world moving towards being an almost fully integrated society and for the USA to remove itself and be a stand-alone country will takes decades of careful planning. As of right now, the USA is not capable of supplying it owns needs. Not even close.


As a side bar, this applies to many industries too, even something as simple as landscaping. Americans talk about kicking out 10 million Mexicans, but do you really know the impact of this? Say goodbye to your $8/hr cash landscaper and lawn cutter. He is now $15-$25hr. Even the American companies you hire to cut your lawn are most likely using Mexicans and paying them under the table, while the owner sits in the truck reading the news paper. My mom lives in Phoenix and 100% of all landscaping is done by Mexicans. Even my mom uses them, but she never complains about it.

Vawlkus | April 13, 2011

For the record Straight Shooter, I'm Canadian :p

I just like Mustangs }BD

Straight Shooter | April 13, 2011

No harm Vawlkus, I just want people to see the whole picture, not some false representation of reality.

Now for Mustangs......You are preaching to choir my friend. I absolutely love high end Mustangs too. First car I ever drove as a 16yr old, was my mom's Mustang. I almost ordered one too, but could not get exactly what I wanted for the price I needed. I was going to order a 2010 Mustang Shelby GT-500 Convertible. I wanted even more upgrades, which my local dealer said wern't possible. So I phoned the Shelby Shop that does the customization of the cars right off the Ford line. They set me up with another $28,000USD in options. Better supercharger, tons of steering/handling, better exhaust, brakes, clutch, everything. Basically a Stage 2/3 layout, only much better handling. I had to pay the USD direct to Shelby. No problem there. The issue was that my dealer wanted to slap on a "buyers premium" on top of the $28k USD of another $15kCDN. The deal dropped. I sent letters to Shelby, Ford USA, Ford Canada and Ford Ontario. Only Shelby responded back.

Good thing ultimately, now I'm setup to spend slightly more cash on a much better car. In my case #S-51. I get the 51st Signature in Canada and it will be totally loaded.

searcher | April 13, 2011

@Straight Shooter, Was your post directed to anyone in particulsr. Looked back and seems that everybody is agrrement that the globalization of car making is a reality and didn't see any particular objections unless I am over looking one. My original one said, paraphased "Yeah better make sure all the parts you can get come from Germany or Scandinavia if you want that baby to last, last, last. All though it would be pricey still stick with that concept". I had a Chevy {Nova I think} that was made in Canada and it was a good one allright, come to think of it a lot of my Chvy's through the years probably came from Canada {all excellent} But when I ran into an older twin carb{oil filtered}Volvo, think it was a 144, that had been all over the country but had meticullous records, holes in floor, body about to fall off, and I bondoed that baby up and put some plywood in the floor, that thing ran, ran, and ran with zero mechanical problems, then is when I really learned about quality.Gave 300 dollars for this one in the seventies just to go to work and back and save some gas. Had another one, offered man 150 dollars for he said no but he was cleaning up extra vehicles in his yard due to orders from his wife and he would take 100 dolllars for, gave him 50 dollars then and 50 dollars my next payday. This had to be one of beat riding and driving Volvos ever made, forgot what year and series. Rode all over the country in this car{southeast that is}. Had auto trnsmission and in north Georgia mountains it would just keep reaching down an finding gears, just like a mountain goat. Engine in this one probably still in a 48 Volvo. As I think I sold it for some profit to an enthusist that just wanted the engine. About to forget this is Tesla site and not Volvo. Two things I love to talk about are Volvos and dogs. Think Volvo is owned by a Chinese group now, hope they keep the quality up. Volvo used to have a lot of German parts. Let it alone and some little problems will fix themselves, I know this sounds very incredible but I have had it happen on several occsions, well maybe just went away didn't actually fix it self I guess. But will close as things seem to be getting a liitle deep, hope everybodies feet are up when they read this one,ha.

Vawlkus | April 14, 2011

@Straight shooter
Wish I could wait, but unhappily I new a new ride this year, so I won't be getting my Tesla until a few years down the road.

Straight Shooter | April 14, 2011

@Vawlkus.....Yeah 1st post was in response to "msiano17 | April 8, 2011 - 3:11pm"

I think what most folks don't realize is that American car development focused on what Americans wanted, which was entirely different than what Europeans wanted. Americans wanted very big cars with tons of trunk space, seating and lots of flashy looks. The remainder of cars were focued on the "drag racing" model. That was ultra high horse power cars, mininal creature comforts and these cars were VERY good at going in a straight line. Not alot was done in the handling department. Recent focus has been on econo-buckets with max MPG.

Europeans wanted smaller cars with higher top end speeds and handled flawlessly. They still demand this to this day. There is a reason why you can take a BMW or a Porsche or a Mercedes Benz into an interstate cloverleaf at 60miles with no concern. They been honing that handling requirement for decades. I've driven Mustangs and I owned a 1971 Chev Impala Conv for many many years. Neither of these cars handeld well in high speed corners.

Now before you folks jump on me for my small market segment, I have been computer consulting contracting in the USA for over 10yrs (2000-2010) and I rented a car every week from Thrify Car Rentals acheiving the highest possible level of Blue Chip status. I drove primarily Ford and Chrysler products, but a huge chunk of their lines, includes some trucks and SUVs. Think of it as about 450 test drives that lasted 3 days each. I know their cars VERY VERY well.

No surprise, some cars blow chunks, some were awesome. Some were great deals considering the sub $15k purchase price. Each car is marketed towards an exact segment of population. You need to buy the exact car that fits your lifestyle for the next 10yrs. That may be a $13k Ford Focus or a $90k Lincoln Navigator or a $60k 300 SRT8.

For me, that car is a 2012 Telsa Model S Signature, loaded to the hilt.

Lush1 | April 15, 2011

Tesla: dreamed, conceived, funded and assembled in America. When was the last time that happened? And when have American automobile design and manufacturing taken such a bold leap forward? You would probably have to go back to Henry Ford and Model T assembly line production for an answer. Parts for everything come from all over the planet. That's the way of the world. Even Harley Davidson can't say "Made in America" any more because less than 50% of the parts are made here. Tesla is about as American as anything can be, and it doesn't suck or lag behind Asian or European counterparts (which don't actually exist yet). Find another example of that today. To be fair, I drive a Mercedes currently. I have owned many foreign and domestic cars in my life. I buy what suits my needs and my wallet. Still, as an American, it's nice to see America leading the EV world. I don't expect it to last. If Tesla is a hit, the world will soon be flooded with copies. At least they will be copies of great cars that don't use petroleum fuel.

Tiebreaker | April 15, 2011

@Lush1, I agree with you here. Moreover, expect it to last: copies don't lead, originality and boldness do.. As long as Tesla doesn't fall in the Detroit complacency...

searcher | April 15, 2011

Don't know if this would be most appropiate thread for this post. Given that cars among probably lot of other things are made in a global concept now. How does the meeting between Russia, China,and some other country this past weekend, discussing policies that would eliminate US currency being the world standard currency or something like this. Really not up on this currency stuff. But seems that some think this could lead to devaluation of american currency{not good for the USA, I understand}. Well in light of all this should not USA rethink who it does business with all together and trade with countries we can trust. Pay off our bill to China as quickly as possible and rethink this whole thing. We can't buy firends as is obvious. We tried to help China in WWII and since then we have fought two wars with them indirectly and some think North Korea is still their "Pitbull" off the leash. And of course Russia was involved with on China's part in the two wars mentioned. So should we just pay them off and deal with different countries or are we to far in debt to them to ever pay them off. Like some of what "The Donald " is saying. He's ready to take names on some and regarner some respect and fair dealing. Hope he runs just to get his messege out. Sure stuff would cost more but we as USA wouldn't be financing people that may wind up doing us harm or have we just let it go to far already? Not trying to make a particular point but would like to hear some of this stuff discussed more by some more into international trade and economic types. Some are saying the USA currency will be devalued this year. Talk about the implications of this to.

searcher | April 15, 2011

In addition I hope Russia and China fully realize that we probably can't fight a conventional war with them due to their sheer size and would probably be forced to go nuclear from the "gitgo" and surely they realize the catastrophic effects to the whole world from this.

searcher | April 17, 2011

While I am in this vein of thought, why do people in America want to do business with a country that are starting to crack down on the churches again. It is happenning America. Bet Sam Walton wouldn't stand for this. Understand this family has become somewhat dysfunctional anyway and some of the young guns{cap pistols} running it may be just interested in lining their individual pockets. Bet ole Sam would have some harsh words for the Chinese cracking down on the christian churches in China. Likely words would not be all. Remember when he started his focus was on MADE IN THE USA. Don't know if Sam was a christian or not but do know he would not put up with this crap the Chinese are doing to the Christian Chinese Church. Wake up America, do we want to do business with such a country. China is full of wonderful people but there seems to be some bad apples running some things to.

searcher | April 19, 2011

Having said all I have said it sounds like I hate China but quite to the contrary as I know they are a good hard working ethical people. Would it not be wonderful to see this country go in a more democratic way. I know the people have the power there are so many of them. I know they are capable of producing quality parts and products provided the manufacturer gives them the right materials to start with. Everybody knows it is better to trade than fight. I know we have plenty of products they would like and need. They just need to allow the Chinese masses to keep a larger share of the pie instead of the government taking such a hefty cut. Need to let the people decide on their own what faith they want to pursue without government interference. Let them raise their standard of living so they can buy more of our stuff. People to people is not the problem as we could be of great benefit to one another and the world. But to see such a vast amount of wonderful people be manipulated into taking substandard wages thus throwing off the world economics and political balances is not a good thing. They seem to be somewhat under thumb by so any forces acting in concert
that it is going to throw a lot of stuff out of kilter. Just try to imagine if unions tried to move into China, their would probably be widespred blood shed and the common people know it. So sad they are being soo exploited and actually I guess a lot of them think they have it better than ever due to trade with the rest of the world. But sadly it all boils down to whay somebody posted earlier. "When all the working peoples wages are six dollars an hour then you are globalized". This aint american baby and their are some big players in the background we don't even know about but considering that most people are not stupid this game is going to catch up with the big players one day and a lot of the crap will have to change. As said before think feudalism is part of the human genetic makeup when it is allowed to exercise itself. But we all know this genetic defect has been dealt with in a wonderful way in past and I hope it will be again when it raises it's ugly head as it is constantly trying to do. So to all the wonderful hardworking Chinese common people if I may pull an old phase out of the past "Power to the people" and not to the manipulators, intimidators, and feudalists.

searcher | April 19, 2011

If I maybe allowed to continue on my soapbox the fact that that real economic power is and should be in the hands of the working people. Evidence of this is that all the big car makers are rushing to all EV for the lower income working classes. AS is Tesl'a goal to in five years or so because thy know tahat is where their sucess will eventually be. Just keep some discretionary spending in the working peples pockets and world economics will take care of itself. This is where democracy and free enterprise comes to center stage folks.

Vawlkus | April 20, 2011

This is not your rambling thread searcher. Flagged as spam

searcher | April 20, 2011

@Vawlkus, Do as you like with what I expressed. To me not one line of it was irrelevant to the american or chinese people as a whole or to the world as a whole but simply "my truth to power". Of course you have the option to have your own truth. I know I would respect your convictions whether I thought they were right or wrong. Not to say I would not "agree to disagree" but would not be so rudely dismissive. Well maybe rude but definitely not dismissive. But I still "betcha" a ton of americans would agree with every line I wrote, you gonna dismiss them as spam to. Well go right ahead.

searcher | April 20, 2011

@Vawlkus@ Incedently "Spam" the canned variety has gotten to be an expensive item in my country now. Two plus bucks per can. What is it where you live. Bet it's more. So you think all this is not tied to the manipulators, etc. mentioned in my spam. Wake up dude.

Vawlkus | April 21, 2011

It IS irrelevant to the topic in this thread searcher. You have your thread to meander in, this is not that topic.

searcher | April 23, 2011

@Vawlkus, Your'e right. My bad. Too much soapbox for too long. Should have been on the "obloviating" thread,ha. I did preface with the thought I wasn't sure this was right place for this discussion and obviously it wan't. Please excuse "smart alecky" comments from me to you. I like your posts. Keep them coming. Sincerely, searcher