Are we seeing a viral marketing campaign to announce Audi access to Tesla Superchargers?

Are we seeing a viral marketing campaign to announce Audi access to Tesla Superchargers?

I was agreeing with everyone how monumentally stupid it was for Audi to block the superchargers to promote the eTron.
Then my dream-self convinced me it was just a viral marketing campaign to announce the partnership.

1: It would actually make me like the eTron more. While I would still buy Tesla, I would instantly welcome them into our Family. Full BEV family.
2: Supercharges the eTron range and turns the so-so range into plenty.
3: eTron can sustain a respectable 100kw charge. Enough to be welcomed into the fold and not block charging stalls.

So I woke up and decided that I wanted this dream to actually be true for what it would mean to the BEV community.
I fear Audi is not woke enough to join us. But what if they were?...What if they were?

Note: Yes, apparently now I am dreaming about BEV politics. I have yet to come to terms with that.

TranzNDance | July 20, 2019

If Audi were to pull that kind of stunt at gas stations, then it would be more evident that they were serious about EV. Until then, they're only doing enough to lessen the impact of Tesla on their business.

Earl and Nagin ... | July 20, 2019

I agree that Audi joining the Tesla network would be great. Unfortunately, however, I agree with @FISH that since they invested in Electrify America, this is highly unlikely. Like the rest of the US and EU automakers, they created CCS more to obstruct Tesla and electrification than to support electrification.
Unfortunately, while EA may be building out infrastructure, there is no indication that they'll bother to maintain it as they barely work when installed. As we've seen with the LADWP chargers in Los Angeles, without regular maintenance, chargers won't work very long. We also know that a non-working charger is worse than no charger at all since it can leave you stranded.
I pity those (except @FISH) who may purchase the eTron, just as I pity Bolt owners who struggle to go places in them. | July 20, 2019

Not sure about the eTron being the ultimate EV. It's so much slower than Tesla, much less range, huge grill looks awful, and dealers hate it. Few fast charging stalls too limit travel. Doubt Audi will buy into Tesla Superchargers, as they really don't want to sell many money losing EVs You can be sure no more will be sold that is necessary for ZEV credits. Even Toyota can sell a few hundred Mirai hydrogen cars a year, showing marketing can often fool a few people.

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 20, 2019

FISHEV commented, "They will sell everyone they make..."

Yes. Thing is? They don't really want to make any. They will make far more of the Q7. None of the traditional legacy ICE automobile manufacturers has made a firm commitment to offer any of their fully electric vehicle designs in quantities exceeding even 1% of their annual production.

"After a week of driving, the range at full charge was 240."

Subdued? That's one way to put it. Of course, the EPA uses the same digits to say the combined range of the AUDI etron Quattro is 204 miles, not 240. Maybe you slipped on the keyboard? Meh. Mistakes happen.

BuffaloBillsFan | July 20, 2019

@ReD. +100

raqball | July 20, 2019

I looked at an E-Tron at a local Portland dealer before buying the M3. I did not test drive it but here are my thoughts on it..

I was not a fan of the exterior styling nor the interior,. Compared to the M3 the interior looked cluttered and confusing. I much prefer the M3's exterior styling and the M3's interior.

I realize the E-Tron is not really a direct competitor to the M3 and perhaps better compared to the forthcoming Y but the E-Tron I looked at was in the mid $80K price range. I assume that's substantially more than the Y will cost..

I would not be a buyer of the E-Tron but to each their own...

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 20, 2019

Earl and Nagin: It is unfortunate that Electrify America may be abbreviated as 'EA'. I typically associate that moniker with Electronic Arts, the videogame publisher. And thus, with pure EViL incarnate. As if I need another reason to despise Volkswagen AG.

FISHEV: AUDI U.S. sales through June 2019 are down 5.8% compared to the same period in 2018. AUDI only declined by 0.32% in June 2019, compared to June 2018 (from 19,471 units to 19,409). Meanwhile, Tesla's overall U.S. sales improved by 62.46% compared to the first six months of 2018. And Tesla's June 2019 sales of 25,025 units are a 126.22% improvement over June 2018 in the U.S. It's a good thing there is 'no demand' for Tesla's products, which outsold AUDI last month, otherwise someone might be in trouble.

howard | July 20, 2019

@Earl and Nagin, I pity those who may purchase the eTron, just as I pity Bolt owners who struggle to go places in them.

This is a misconception. Most of us charge our Volts, Bolts, and Teslas at the office and home. I would guess 90% of e-Tron charging will be at home or the office as well. Just like early S owners did before the SC network was established.

@, and dealers hate it.

Curious how you know how Audi dealers across the country feel about anything?

@ReD eXiLe ms us, They don't really want to make any.

Another interesting blanket comment. Are you part of Audi management? Regardless of whether you think they want to make an EV or not, EVs will be the dominate sale in the next 10 years by all brands.

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 20, 2019

howard chastised then concluded, "Another interesting blanket comment. ...EVs will be the dominate sale in the next 10 years by all brands."

Followed by your own 'blanket statement'. Please, do direct me to any quote from any 'part of AUDI management' that states their firm intent to exceed 1% of their annual production as long range fully electric vehicles at any point within 'the next 10 years'. Go ahead, I'll wait. I'd love to read it.

AUDI sold 2,224,156 vehicles to U.S. customers last year. Apparently they are capable of finding customers rather easily. People who really admire their products and take them home at the prices they command. So, how many of their fully electric vehicles have they committed to building in excess of 22,000 examples of for release in the U.S. market each year, for the next decade? A total production run exceeding a minimum of 220,000 units in that timeframe? Will there be that many AUDI etron Quattro vehicles on the road, 'dominating' the automobile industry, by July 2029?

For that matter, Volkswagen AG, over multiple brands and divisions, sold just shy of 11,000,000 vehicles worldwide. 1% of that is a relatively piteous quantity, hardly worth consideration for such a large company.. That would be 'only' 110,000 units, easy. Right? Will Volkswagen be offering that many long range fully electric vehicles as 'competition' for Tesla or anyone else THIS year? NEXT year? EVER? Volkswagen announced in 2014 their intent to become the largest automobile manufacturer in the world by 2018. Congratulations, they made it. So why no bold statement refarding specifuc attained quantities of manufactured snd sold electric vehicles over 'the next 10 years'...? Hmmm... Maybe, they don't want to.

jjgunn | July 20, 2019

Traditional car makers don't want to manufacture EV because the profit isn't as great as Gas mobile.

Blanket statement or truth?

Bighorn | July 20, 2019

Does the term "kicking and screaming" mean anything to you? Conversion to EV is an existential threat to the viability of legacy automakers.

jjgunn | July 20, 2019 | July 20, 2019

@howard - Curious how you know how Audi dealers across the country feel about anything?

Because studies reports show most dealers are clueless about EVs and when offering an EV, try to redirect customers to an ICE in there lineup.

One nugget from:
"The study goes on to report that dealers appeared to ultimately be dismissive of electric cars or even completely avoided talking about them entirely. When the dealer did talk about EVs to the customer, the information given regarding vehicle specifications was often wrong or geared toward swaying the consumer into purchasing a fossil fuel powered vehicles."

Plenty of articles. Here's another:

Atom12 | July 20, 2019

jjgunn: "Here's a "fun" article...."

ARGHHH! It's an Anton link.

Don't do that. | July 20, 2019

@howard - I wish it wasn't true, but legacy ICE manufactures do seem to be for the most part on the road to bankruptcy. Glad Audi is attempting to make an EV. Perhaps in 2-3 years Audi version 2.0 will be more competitive with Tesla's 2012 offerings and they will make more than a token effort in volumes.

Still waiting to see anything competitive with the Model 3 in price or performance. Sales volumes say it all.

jjgunn | July 20, 2019

Why is it so difficult for some people to see what's happening??

Just spoke to a Gastroenterologist today at the SuperCharger. Just bought a Model S & he wished he bought the X instead.

His wife is driving a Mercedes & once lease is up going to get the X.

This is happening & the power of the people will make it happen

Until one or a few of the legacy companies start focusing on competing with Tesla meaning actually building & trying to sell the vehicle, Tesla is the only game in town.

I sincerely hope we do see some competition because a Monopoly isn't good for anyone except Tesla.

apodbdrs | July 20, 2019

Dealerships make their money on service and maintenance, their profit on car sales is very minimal. In cases only a couple of hundred dollars on each car. EVs will certainly kill them since there very little to EV maintenance. This is a brand new ball game, similar to the horse and buggy days and the first gas driven vehicles. No more great need for horse shoeing, hay, etc.

Bighorn | July 20, 2019
howard | July 20, 2019

The same was said of early Tesla. Tesla was pioneering the EV movement where there was no road map, history or experience. There is a lot of brilliant people running very large and well-established ICE companies. There is more history and experience now with plenty of time to make the transition. Sure some might not make it but I think most will. Tesla will not be filling the gap of millions of annual vehicles manufactured. Time will tell. Tesla still has it's own long term hurdles as well. Sorry, I forgot, scratch that last statement.

82bert | July 20, 2019

@howard. As bighorn linked, it’s not that every legacy automaker will go bankrupt, but it’s a near certainty at least a few will and be forced to further consolidate.

Many of them are sort of in a catch 22 now. If they release a bunch of well made EVs, then it directly competes with and eats into the sale of the ICE vehicles. This in turn further disrupts their bottom line and survivability. But at the same time, the longer they wait to manufacture and master EV tech, the further behind they fall. Essentially they’re dead in the water as they paddle away trying to stay afloat, but never really going anywhere.

howard | July 20, 2019

I think the ICE dealers may be the ones really on the hook. They are going to lose a big portion of their reoccurring service revenue, but this will also take a long time with existing ice models still being driven by the masses. The sales model is changing and service could all move to mobile for EV. Interesting times are ahead.

Bighorn | July 20, 2019

Ford and VW—two legacy juggernauts would not be partnering in Tesla’s absence, I don’t think.

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019

Ford much be really desperate.

jjgunn | July 20, 2019

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019
Ford much (must?) be really desperate.
They're terrified of Tesla releasing that pickup which is why they've partnered with Rivian

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 20, 2019

jjgunn: Remember, Anton Wahlman be da debil. He's been wrong for over a decade now regarding Tesla and just keeps at it. He's worse than HIM666 by a landslide. I guess TheStreet was tired of only being wrong due to articles posted by Jim Cramer. If they've taken on Anton Wahlman, they probably have features from Edward Neidermeier, Jim Chanos, Bob Lutz, and Cory Johnson too. Into the abyss with them all.

howard: Awww, poowuh baby! All those mean old Tesla Enthusiasts ganging up on you with facts and reasoned responses. It must be SO hard to deal with in the midst of your insepid FUDsterism. Now, you have to resort to attributing false statements gleaned from your own puny imagination to put forth some ridiculous narrative where contrary statements are not welcome. Such a shame.

Once again, for the record? Tesla has a Mission to complete. They know full well they cannot do it alone. They need all the help they can get. Including that from competitors who are willing to KILL ICE forever. Those who are unwilling? Because of 'risk', or quarterly financials, the bottom line, or their stock price? [FLOG] 'em and forget 'em. There's WORK to be done. No time for distractions, delays, or deferments.

It is OK to take contrary positions. That allows for full, open, complete discussion. Your position must be defended from a point of fact, fortified by truth, issued with reason, and wrapped in virtue. When you start with assumption, proceed to presumption, offer supposition en lieu of evidence, rumor in place of fact, and opinion as a stand-in for truth, expect to be rightly pummeled.

gballant4570 | July 20, 2019

I for one predict that not many of the legacy car companies survive. Check on their situation in 5 years - many will be sinking. You don't actually have to wait that long - the sinking has already started. 2016 will be the ICE high water mark. In 10 years there won't be that many left.

gballant4570 | July 20, 2019

I should add that I hope these companies design, build, market and sell millions of desirable and compelling EV's with both heart and soul. The Mission cannot be successfully completed by Tesla, or even Tesla plus three additional real EV companies. The Mission needs all hands on deck.
Judging by the legacy car company's entrants into the EV landscape, I don't see much indication my hopes swill be realized. It will take new companies I'm afraid.

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019

@jjgunn Yet Ford will never ever give up on the cash cow the F150. The half hearted partnerships are just a show. I have been a Furd guy for many years and they show no signs of being all in on Electric. The compliance effort will be strung out for as long as possible, same goes for all legacy mfrs.

BMW has been beating the "TESLA so smart" drum recently so out of all the choices I hope BMW gets serious. The skinny wheel i3 is a joke disaster and the i8 only gets about 27miles electric range. It is not looking good and no one has a TESLA competitor on the street yet they are all compliance cars that are not supported by an infrastructure devoted to BEV (go to an Audi service shop and try to find the regional BEV guy, good luck).

calvin940 | July 20, 2019

@Bighorn is always right

calvin940 | July 20, 2019

There aren't any real EV options outside of Tesla but that will change and has to.change.. One car maker can't service the population and isn't expected too, it the legacy car makers have yet to introduce a true competitor, only tick boxes.

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019

VW has been running the same stale, penalty box, electrify america commercial for two years now (the one and only piece). The commercial shows a chevy volt next to a subaru and they have not put a dime more into it. In the meantime they refresh their, cough cough, gas car commercials every couple weeks.

The lack of effort is completely obvious.

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019

......shows a chevy bolt.........

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019

What the hell is your point?
I never said VW was electrify America.

VW is not serious about promoting EV was my point, there is no effort from Audi VW to seriously promote BEV.

Magic 8 Ball | July 20, 2019


Try to track down the regional etron guy when you need a firmware push, what a joke.

calvin940 | July 20, 2019

"Audi e=Tron is super EV, competitive with Model X."

Ya so competitive they have to block Tesla superchargers to even be noticed. Great ploy to align themselves with the rednecks that block chargers. Idiotic, not to mention offensive.

Nice work *again* Audi.

TranzNDance | July 20, 2019

It's super and competitive like when a kid does enough to get a participation trophy.

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 21, 2019

gballant4570 contributed, "I for one predict that not many of the legacy car companies survive."

Correct. Six months through 2019 and Tesla has outsold 15 entire brands among traditional legacy ICE automobile manufacturers. I wonder, when will Autoline, Bloomberg, CNBC, LAT, Motley Fool, NYT, Reuters, TheStreet, WSJ, et al take notice? Then start to question how long those companies have to last, whether investors are throwing good money after bad, if these companies have a reason to exist in the modern world, and more. Especially considering the similar queries they have lodged multiple times over the past decade in regard to Tesla in decidedly condescending tones.

Tesla sold about 197,517 vehicles in the U.S. during 2018. That is 1.13% of the 17,418,286 new vehicles sold in the U.S. last year. Last month, Tesla sold 5.73% of all vehicles sold in the U.S. I remember how five years ago both Elon Musk and JB Straubel marveled at the possibility their sales might someday climb to be 'next to the decimal point' in overall percentage.

Some may feel that is not all impressive, not in any way substantive. OK. To put it another way, so far during 2019 Tesla has outsold all these companies in the U.S....

83,900 ___ Tesla 100%
75,735 ___ Cadillac 90.26%
73,767 ___ Acura 87.82%
71,100 ___ Mitsubishi 84.74%
64,422 ___ Chrysler 76.78%
63,058 ___ Infiniti 75.15%
50,815 ___ Lincoln 60.56%
50,120 ___ Volvo 59.73%
46,123 ___ Land Rover 54.97%
30,257 ___ Porsche 36.06%
17,583 ___ Mini 20.95%
16,282 ___ Jaguar 19.40%
10,008 ___ Genesis 11.92%
_9,037 ___ Alfa Romeo 10.77%
_5,103 ___ Fiat 6.08%
___475 ___ Smart 0.56%

Also, Tesla outsold all those same 15 traditional legacy ICE automobile manufacturers through all of 2018. Which means Tesla has indeed been ahead of them all consecutively and cumulatively for 18 months, six quarters straight in the U.S. Iwould guess each of those brands will go out of business as Tesla gains U.S. market share, if they do not offer viable (that means something measurably better than AUDI etron Quattro) fully electric options... SOON.

Of course, it has already been announced that smart is a lame duck brand in the U.S. It will be switching to fully electric in Europe and those cars are not destined for our shores. Interesting. Could it be that 'independent franchised dealerships' in the U.S. would prefer to offer the worst selling ICE in the nation rather than a line of 100% electric vehicles? Hmmm...

Not everything is rosy for Tesla when examining sales numbers in depth. When looking at them as a brand, sure the Tesla brand beats out 15 other marques in the U.S. so far this year and all of last year. However, when measured as a corporate automotive entity as a complete unit, Tesla's sales numbers are a bit further behind. Thus, 'only' ahead of two automobile manufacturers YTD through June 2019. They are Jaguar/Land Rover (62,405 units) and Volvo (50,120), while Tesla sits at 83,900 units sold to U.S. customers thus far. Apparently the other 12 that Tesla has outsold this yearare part of larger conglomerates and can hide their shame beneath a corporate umbrella.

So, smart resides under the wing of Daimler. Fiat, Alfa Romeo, and Chrysler combine with others to be under the auspices of FCA. Genesis is part of the Hyundai Kia Auto Group. Mini belongs to BMW Group. Porsche is a function of Volkswagen Group. Lincoln is a division of Ford Motor Co. Infiniti and Mitsubishi are under Nissan Motor Co. Acura is a division of Honda Motor Company. And Cadillac is a surviving brand under General Motors.

Looking at it this way, Tesla's sales achievements can be diminished, ignored, minimized, trivialized... But I'm sure it stings Detroit that Tesla remains ahead of Cadillac, Chrysler, and Lincoln 'American Luxury' divisions and is gaining on Buick. It may not haopen, but I hope Tesla is able to surpass the combined U.S. sales of Buick and Cadillac this year. That would certainly open the eyes of their detractors if Tesla were to exceed sales for two divisions of GM in a single calendar year. Let's see who Wall $treet considers 'overvalued' when that happens.

howard | July 21, 2019

ReD eXiLe ms us, Impressive. Do you work for a Tesla or is this just a passion for you? Lots of good stats always presented. Thanks

Earl and Nagin ... | July 21, 2019

"And that is good for EV adoption in US." - No, only good, reliable charging infrastructure is good.

A non-working charger is worse than no charger at all.

No charger leaves you at home wishing you were at your destination or makes you find an alternate method of transportation while you are still home with familiar resources.
A non-working charger leaves you in some unfamiliar place trying to find an alternate method of transportation while you are in an unfamiliar place and most-likely, late to get where you are trying to go.
Thus far, EA's reliability track record is quite bad. Also, from past experience, reliability does not improve with age without additional funding. Will they maintain their already bad charging network?

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 21, 2019

FISHEV: I read that as, "AUDI is teeming with..." and got a mental image of Volkswagen Engineers crawling all over the place like insects...

If anyone wants 'perspective', I provided that earlier. Please don't do the bogus principle that Tesla's achievements 'don't matter' in the grand scheme of things. I once had a Branch Manager that lambasted a coworker for being 'only' 99.7% efficient at her job. Upon further examination, it turned out she was actually 99.9% efficient, and he had read the data incorrectly. Trust that in the automobile industry someone somewhere is being chewed out for Tesla going from ZERO PERCENT market share to 1.13% U.S. market share in less than eleven years, and for those 15 brands being anywhere from 9.74% to 99.4% behind in attaining that goal, some with decades of a head start. If/when Tesla reaches 12% U.S. market share, especially if the U.S. market share contracts to 12,000,000 units per year or less, I predict General Motors will go out of business again.

howard: I do NOT work for Tesla. I definitely am passionate about proving FUDsters' theories completely wrong. It's fun!

Tell me, what is your explanation for Jaguar, Genesis, Alfa Romeo, Fiat, and smart receiving NO CRITICISM of their business practies or general strategy from the talking heads on Autoline, Bloomberg, or CNBC despite being outsold by at least 5:1 by Tesla, whom they have declared DOOMED on a weekly basis for the past decade? Would Tesla suddenly become profitable if they offered a mix of ICE cars and hybrids alongside their fully electric cars? Would Tesla's sales grow by leaps and bounds if they paid for advertising? Would Tesla's cars become more affordable and more readily accessible if offered by 'independent franchised dealerships'? Would you prefer Tesla were more traditional, predictable, and conservative?

Joshan | July 21, 2019

@FishEV And Vancouver SC has several dicey chargers that sort of work 30kWh to 0kWh to 30kWh. Tesla knows and has work ticket out on it.

How do you know what Tesla is doing in Canada and what work orders they have?

Bighorn | July 21, 2019

FISHEV aka EaglesPDX--PDX is the airport code for Portland. Vancouver is a city across the border/river from Portland in Washington. Easily confused with British Columbia.

raqball | July 21, 2019

The Vancouver, WA supercharger is dicey... I get 100 about half the time but often when I go I am maxing out at 30-40.. I was there last week and there was only one other charging and I was at 30. Move to a different stall, same. Moved to a 3rd stall, same...

It's hit and miss at that one...

raqball | July 21, 2019

For the doubters here is a screenshot of my charging on that day.. Tired 3 different stalls and finally gave up and left after getting some juice...

Earl and Nagin ... | July 21, 2019

One or two ports at Tesla SCs are sometimes down; something not surprising, given their constant usage. Even one of the V3 one at the Tesla Design Center was down when I needed to charge there last week. However, they usually have 6 or more chargers at each facility so I haven't heard of anyone being stranded. Early on, there were some outages but Tesla provided tow service to the next Supercharger for folks who needed them. Tesla has electricians constantly traveling around, testing and repairing them so issues are found and solved quite quickly.
There's actually a new EA station in my home town, the first fast charger for miles around. Let's all hope that EA does more than just celebrate the rollout and actually sustains their network. I guess the EVgo network (punishment to NRG) isn't too bad but I haven't actually paid too much attention to it recently. Its too early to tell whether EA will be another unreliable Blink/Chargepoint or fairly reliable like EVgo.

bj | July 21, 2019

@FISHEV - “This will be great for EV adoption in US as we have e-Tron and EQC on the luxury end and Kona and Kia on the standard car end, all selling out.”

It’s not hard to sell out when a manufacturer is only making 20k to 30k per year. Tesla is currently making between 300k and 400k BEVs per year.

Wake me when another manufacturer comes close to Tesla’s annual BEV volumes. At the moment, Tesla is doing 10x what everyone else is doing.

bj | July 21, 2019

@FISHEV - yep, but they should do more, because they keep on telling us how they will (eventually) do more, how they will easily beat Tesla once they “try”, then repeatedly fail to do so, kicking the can down the road another couple of years with their “concepts”. They’ve been doing this for about 5 years now.

And then people like you try to create false equivalence by stating they will sell everything they make, and conveniently omit that everything they make is 10% of what Tesla is churning out.

So the logical conclusion from observing the behaviour of conventional auto is - their heart’s not really in it. Like I said, wake me when another traditional auto manufacturer is producing BEVs at close to Tesla’s rate.

Firaz.ashraf | July 21, 2019

Leave the fish alone. Someone needs to buy non-tesla EVs to realize how much better Teslas are. But it all feeds the ecosystem and will create a market of very cheap first EVs for people who are likely going to use it to bridge to Teslas. I did the same with a used Leaf for a few years as I am sure others will as well

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 21, 2019

FISHEV put forth, "Audi e-Tron is going to sell a lot of cars for Audi."


Your definition of the term 'a lot' leaves something to be desired. I would suggest that a consistent 'less than 1% of U.S.-bound production' does not qualify as 'a lot' at all. Lemme know when AUDI sends more than 22,000 long range fully electric vehicles to U.S. shores, mmm'kay? Then, let me know when any of those outsell any Tesla product here. That might be enough to actually impress me. I especially would like to know when AUDI will choose to STOP sending ICE vehicles to the U.S.

'Luxury' is of no consequence whatsoever. The Mercedes-Benz EQC and AUDI etron Quattro both seem like very nice station wagons. Volkswagen is not allowed to brand Electrify America as their property or project. Early on, they tried to do it anyway. Seems they have been rebuffed from that tack. The one commercial they aired did sneak one Volkswagen e-GOLF into the pack of passing vehicles, which mysteriously included no Tesla products, near the end.

ReD eXiLe ms us | July 21, 2019

FISHEV blathered mindlessly, "If e-Tron, Kona and NIro are selling 30,000 cars a year that’s 90,000 EV’s a year, great stuff."

Sure. But they don't. So it isn't. Not so 'great' at all. AUDI, Kia, Hyundai, and Mercedes-Benz all manufacture and sell on the order of millions of ICE vehicles each year. Their overall production capacity is often hailed as a strength. When will that advantage be advanced for fully electric vehicles, so as to satisfy all those waiting lists I keep hearing about?