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Mobileye and Tesla partnership discontinued

Mobileye and Tesla partnership discontinued

"Shares of Mobileye MBLY, -10.95% plummeted 19% in pre-market trade Tuesday after the company said its partnership with Tesla Motors TSLA, -1.46% would not continue after its own third quarter. Tesla cars had used Mobileye driver-assistance technology as part of the autopilot feature. Mobileye said it would be shifting to working on fully autonomous vehicle technology and had partnered with BMW and Intel INTC, +0.09% "

Sam_S | 26/07/2016

This is bad news for us current owners of Mobileye AP cars.

I would suspect the next gen is google hardware?

carlk | 26/07/2016

Kind of see it coming. Tesla is moving away from camera based system and will rely more on radar as Elon said a few weeks ago. This thing probably have been brewing for a while inside Tesla now. People have been wondering why we still don't have dual cameras even in latest models. Seems there will never be any needs of more advanced cameras.

Sweetride | 26/07/2016

So what's the next gen solution?

David N | 26/07/2016

So if Mobileye is out of the picture, who is now in the picture?

TeslaTap.com | 26/07/2016

Good question. I may be Tesla will use their own technology or license parts from someone else. More likely they will continue to use Mobileye, but will not remain a partner (where Tesla shares technology with Mobileye). Seeing how Mobileye is shifting to BMW, Tesla may not want to provided all it's technology free to other car makers through Mobileye. It doesn't state that Tesla is abandoning Mobileye.

cfOH | 26/07/2016

It's all a very dynamic situation. Autonomous car tech is going through the same rapid evolution that internal combustion engines did in the late 1800s.

carlk | 26/07/2016

Looks camera's role will be diminished in the future. Tesla will be using Radar in a way similar to how Lidar is being used in the Google system. That's what Elon tweeted a few weeks ago although I believe the work has already been on going for a while. There is no telling whether latest models already have upgraded Radar but either way it sounds like it's more of software than hardware update. Perhaps we will see some improvement in 8.0?

bb0tin | 26/07/2016

@carlk
You said "Tesla is moving away from camera based system and will rely more on radar as Elon said a few weeks ago."
That is not what Elon said at all.

You said "People have been wondering why we still don't have dual cameras even in latest models. Seems there will never be any needs of more advanced cameras." and "Looks camera's role will be diminished in the future."
That is false.
In fact there will be both more cameras and more processing of their imagery, not less.

carlk | 26/07/2016

When Elon mentioned the new algorithm to make radar to do the better job he also said it will be "decoupled from the camara". You don't need any stronger hints than that to know the camera will become irrelevant in his mind. Today's announcement is just that. There is no reason for Tesla to leave Mobileye, the leader and a long time partner, if there is a need for more advanced camera imagine system in the future system.

bb0tin | 26/07/2016

@carlk
You said "You don't need any stronger hints than that to know the camera will become irrelevant in his mind."
You totally misunderstand his comment.
But I sense an opportunity for a bet, so propose a bet that the autonomous system will not have more than one camera and I will most likely accept it.

carlk | 26/07/2016

How about everything you got? I aleady won. Google system uses no camera at all. Camera maybe one approach but it's not the approach. It has becoming clear of its limitation under unfavorably lighting conditions. One needs to do first principle thinking like Elon does.

bb0tin | 26/07/2016

@carlk
You said "How about everything you got?"
I accept that bet but we need to put a dollar mount on it.
How about we make it $NZ1,000,00 which is actually less than what I got.

You said " I aleady won."
How can you win the bet already when Tesla has not released their autonomous system yet?

But since you thought the bet was about Google, then you have already lost.
Google does use cameras as has already been discussed on this forum. You could have simply googled 'google autonomous camera' and seen that you were wrong but since you cannot be bothered
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/189486-how-googles-self-driving-cars-...

You can put my winnings into my paypal account username: bb0tin
Thanks for playing.

hkln | 26/07/2016

Spoke with the Tesla Rep and Sales Manager on the local Tesla Dealer, both can't provide any information on the announcement today and probably didn't even understand the technology on the Autopilot. I didn't think people who purchased Tesla recently should be charged $2500 for the upgrade and it might not be operative after couple of years, and there is no further plan announcement from the company to deal the situation. I am also concerned the model X falcon doors might not be opened from inside out after a collison. How can people or young children to get out from a hydraulic doors after an accident? Not happy and decided to cancel the order on the Model X.

carlk | 27/07/2016

@bb0tin You are right about Google test car although we don't know what the eventual system will be. For Tesla here is what Elon said, "Working on using existing Tesla radar by itself (decoupled from camera) w temporal smoothing to create a coarse point cloud, like lidar". Note he said using existing radar by itself and decoupled from camera.

https://techcrunch.com/2016/07/15/elon-musk-adamantly-standing-by-improv...

@hkln Go ahead tell you "dealer" that your want to cancel your order. If it's not for you then it's just not for you.

SeanB.UT.US | 27/07/2016

That'd be some spiffy radar if it could read road signs. emergency vehicles/personnel and traffic light illumination. You're going to need a camera for some things regardless of how good they can make their radar sense the surroundings. It may be less important in future iterations so they can just in-house the visual processor.

bb0tin | 27/07/2016

@carlk
Are you going to pay up the $NZ1,000,000 and honour the bet?

Ross1 | 27/07/2016

Why not just wait and see if it pops up in your Paypal account? Did you specify a time frame for payment?
Better not to hijack the thread.

carlk | 27/07/2016

@bb0tin

You have not won the bet yet. Just send your money to the escrow account i'm setting up in my Nigerian bank.

@SeanB.OR.US

You are right a basic camera likely is still needed to do things like reading road signs and pavement markings but the task of sensing objects and accident avoidance will be done entirely by radar. That's my interpretation of what Elon said. How else could Tesla end relationship with Mobileye? There is no better alternative at this moment if Tesla still needs more advanced camera imaging system for improved AP or fully autonomous system in the future.

bb0tin | 27/07/2016

@carlk
If you claimed you had already won the bet because of google, then logically you have now already lost the bet since you were wrong. I will take your response as meaning that you not honour the bet, and were just shooting your mouth off.

However, I am serious about the bet that Tesla's autonomous system will have more than 1 camera.
Propose a bet on it, and this time I would appreciate it if you would honour it.

PS:
You just said "but the task of sensing objects and accident avoidance will be done entirely by radar."
No it will not, and it is not what Elon said, and a little bit of thought would demonstrate why.

bb0tin | 28/07/2016

@carlk
I haven't received your proposal.

TeslaTap.com | 28/07/2016

@hkln - Likely the wrong thread, but Tesla has never stated it would disconnect the Autopilot in a few years nor can I see any reason they might. Sounds like you got some bum information. As to doors opening in a crash - I'd much rather be in a 5-star crash rated Tesla vehicle than any competitor's crumple kill box loaded with explosive gasoline. Seems like safety is not really your concern. Whatever you're currently driving or plan to drive is less safe than a Tesla on so many levels (unless you're already driving a Model S).

johndoeeyed | 19/10/2016

@carlk
You accepted a bet where you believed that the autonomous system would not have more than 1 camera. You proposed the amount to be everything that I had, and I suggested a lesser amount of $NZ1,000,000 instead. It has been announced today that it has 8 cameras. You lost the bet.
Are you prepared to make good on the bet?

UnshodBob | 19/10/2016

Gee, it looks like @carlk possibly made a bet with a certain @bb0tin, but not @johndoeeyed. Hmmmmm.

brando | 19/10/2016

Tesla's self-driving hardware now has eight cameras, rather than the four in previous simpler autopilot vehicles. This new hardware will provide 360 degree visibility around the car at up to 250 meters of range and also have 12 updated ultrasonic sensors to detect both hard and soft objects and a forward-facing radar that can see through 'heavy rain, fog, dust and even the car ahead.'

The vehicles will be equipped an on-board system powered by Nvidia that achieves '12 trillion operations per second, basically a supercomputer in a car.' This system uses a newly developed ‘neural net for vision, sonar and radar processing software.’

All Tesla cars being produced are now being built with full autonomous hardware capabilities, so will all Model ≡ .

http://www.nfpa.org/news-and-research/fire-statistics-and-reports/fire-s...
Which was 1-2 people burn to death every day.

SamO | 19/10/2016

Any doubt who dumped whom?

johndoeeyed | 19/10/2016

@UnshodBob
As you know, @bb0tin and @johndoeeyed. are one and the same.
You also know why I had to change my id.
Trollllllllllll.

McLary | 20/10/2016

@brando The fire related deaths mean what exactly?

@SamO You are correct, without a doubt. Mobileye definitely dumped Tesla after seeing the ludicrous path that EM was imposing on the company, for autonomous driving.

Ross1 | 20/10/2016

If @bb had lost the bet, would he have paid up $1 million?

:)

johndoeeyed | 20/10/2016

@Ross
It is not me who is losing the bets and not paying up.
As for the $NZ1,000,000, I will settle for $NZ1.

Bighorn | 20/10/2016

@Ross
As you know, New Zealand dollars aren't worth squat.

johndoeeyed | 20/10/2016

@Bighorn
$NZ1 = $AUD0.94
Your posts, on multiple threads, are almost always ignorant, wrong and worthless.

grashelm | 20/10/2016

@bb - you lost. You Lost. You LOST. YOU LOST!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You admitted you lost!!!!!! GET OVER IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

johndoeeyed | 20/10/2016

@grashelm
Not only are you a troll, but you have an inability to grasp reality.
You are wrong.

johndoeeyed | 20/10/2016

PS:
Multiple exclamation points detract from, rather than add to, any falsehood you may care to try and make.
Capital letters likewise.

Dithermaster | 23/10/2016

> Tesla's self-driving hardware now has eight cameras, rather than the four in previous simpler autopilot vehicles.
You mean one right? AP1 used one camera. The only other camera on the car is the backup camera and it's not connected to the computer (just the screen).

In other postings, Tesla had planned to use Mobileye's next-gen system but that fell apart and the jumped right to Tesla Vision. I wonder if that could explain the curious dual-trapezoid seen in some Model X camera housings?

I don't know what Mobileye had to offer in their next-gen system, but the importance of these systems in cars means you want to own your technology, not license it from someone who bad-mouths you in public. Also, when the hardware goes from a single box on the windshield to something that take up a significant percentage of the wiring hardness and on-board computing, you want to own that and not rely on a third party. Admittedly, without knowing all the facts, I'm with Tesla on this one.

brando | 30/10/2016

Dithermaster and my fellow Tesla followers, and owners too.

We often forget to go directly to the source, Tesla web site.
You'll find the 4 to 8 camera upgrade and other information.

https://www.tesla.com/autopilot

Ross1 | 31/10/2016

Ross | October 20, 2016
If @bb had lost the bet, would he have paid up $1 million?

:)

Funny, I lost that post, having such poor search function.
However immediately following that, 2 of my other topics were flagged out of existence.