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Charging outlet in garage

Charging outlet in garage

I have a 10-30 dryer outlet in my garage, outlet is rated 30 amps the panel box has 50 amp breaker's with number six wire going to the outlet no neutral wire, no room to add neutral wire, I've seen 10-30 adapter but it is recommended to drop amps to 25 amped when charging

Bighorn | 17/11/2016

24 amps--I've used one for 3 years, but I have the Tesla adapter that drop current automatically.

jordanrichard | 17/11/2016

I am not an electrician but if the breaker in indeed rated for 50 amps, you might be able to have an electrician just swap out that 10-30 outlet for the 14-50 and you already have that adapter.

dave.m.mcdonough | 17/11/2016

If you have to ask, then don't do it.

If that was a 30A circuit then it was ran with 10AWG wire and will NOT support 50A. You need to run at least 6AWG.. and yes it's way more expensive, 0% chance you will get lucky and have it already there.

Haggy | 17/11/2016

If you had the neutral wire, it would be easy to swap the breaker and outlet, assuming the wiring isn't an exceptionally long run that would require a heavier gauge. Since that's not the case, you have a few choices. A dryer outlet will add 17 miles of range per hour, and for the average US driver, that will mean a bit over two hours each night to charge. An eight hour charge will give you 136 miles. So if you have a 215 mile battery, you could get down to about 57 miles of range, start charging at 11 pm, and be up to 90% by 7 am. If you don't have time of use rates, charging starting at 9 pm would be more than enough to handle things even if you get down to a range so low that it's risky to go lower.

You could also look into hiring an electrician. Prices for putting in an NEMA 14-50 outlet vary, but one of the big factors is whether you have room for the breakers. If you do, you could add an extra outlet. If you don't, it could be more expensive. But you could reuse the slots for the dryer outlet's breakers, remove that outlet, and run a new cable to a new outlet. It doesn't have to be in the same spot, and the cable could be in an external shielded enclosure.

The advantage of adding an outlet might be minimal though. In two years of owning a Model S, I've almost never charged during the day at home, and with proper planning I never would have needed to have done so. It's more efficient to charge with a 14-50 outlet, but the difference in efficiency might not come close to paying for the installation.

akgolf | 17/11/2016

It cost me $80 to have an outlet installed next to the breaker box. A lot cheaper than I thought.

Frank99 | 17/11/2016

I got an estimate of $700 for an outlet next to the breaker box.
Of course, my breaker box is full (including the dozen 120V circuits serviced by tandem breakers), and I have a breaker servicing an unlicensed and uninspected pool subpanel installed by the previous owner (yeah, that's who did it, that's the ticket...), all of which added a bit to the expense.

Badbot | 17/11/2016

I expect to spend 40 or 50 bucks for outlet, breaker and 2 feet of 6ga. wire.

Frank99 | 17/11/2016

Yeah, I might too. I may just install a tandem breaker for a couple of my 240V circuits, and free up a spot for a new 50A breaker for the EV.

Some day, my breaker box is going to explode. It'll be after a power outage, when all my timer controlled loads (hot water heater, jacuzzi, pool pump, EV charger) reset and turn on at the same time as a couple of non-timer loads (A/C, dryer, range). Thar be Fireworks, b'gosh.

dsvick | 18/11/2016

My neighbor's an electrician, I'm hoping I can get by with materials, beer, and pizza.

andy.connor.e | 18/11/2016

If the breaker is rated for 50 amps, then that breaker can safely supply 50 amps with the right wires and outlet. It would be cheaper to change the wiring out and replace the outlet then to try to install a new breaker. No electrician job is cheap though.

ir | 18/11/2016

+1000 Dave about being careful with DIY high powered electrical work!

In California, the Valley fire killed 4 people and destroyed 1,300 homes. Including the home of the idiot whose illegal and shoddy DIY hot tub wiring started the fire that destroyed his home and now faces charges, lawsuits and jail time.

Compared to the value of your family, home and possessions. It's a no brained to spend a few hundred dollars to get it done right.

dave.m.mcdonough | 19/11/2016

I just looked at home depot's site, 6/3 wire is just under $3/ft, $4/ft for the tougher grade than be buried for a garage run. Not cost prohibitive or anything, and I'm sure you can shop around.

The OP is right that it's no more complicated than any other 220v line, just run the right size wire is all I'm saying. 10/3 at the same place is $1.24/ft, less than half as much money. It's all anyone would buy if running a 30A circuit. I PROMISE you that existing wiring will be undersized.

Rocky_H | 22/11/2016

@jmrsq, You stated that your original setup has this:
50A breaker
6 gauge wire
10-30 outlet

There are already a few kinds of things wrong and not to code with that, so that's why I and others are really skeptical of what you have. You are not allowed to have a 50A breaker on a 30A outlet type. And as others have said, they are doubtful it's really 6 gauge wire.

Since you said there is no neutral, you can't by code put on a 14-30 or 14-50 outlet, which do require the neutral wire. What I would probably recommend is to get a wall connector so you don't have to re-run the wiring. A wall connector will only need the two hot leads for 240V and the ground. Those are already there.

Just make sure you correctly match up on ONE current level for the breaker, wire size, and charging device. If it really is 6 gauge wire in the wall, then yes, you could do it as a 50A circuit. If it's smaller size, the breaker is probably supposed to be a 30A.

PhillyGal | 23/11/2016

Sounds to me like buying the official Tesla adapter for 10-30 is the way to go. Why mess with what you already have?

Unless you frequently make back-to-back long trips, the 10-30 will give you plenty of range over night to handle a full charge.

Bighorn | 23/11/2016

@PG
They don't sell the 10-30 adapter anymore, AFAIK.

jmrsq | 24/11/2016

If Teala doesn't sell the 10-30 adapter (why)
What about an after market one, any recommendations

jefjes | 25/11/2016

Other considerations when adding or changing a circuit is length of the run, visible means of disconnect, total panel load, wire type, conduit size/type, etc.. Maybe hiring someone familiar with local building codes and the NEC is the wise move for most people. Having said that, I installed my own but I've been doing electrical work for many years prior to retiring. I plan on installing an additional circuit when my Model ☰ order is completed as I'll have a 2 BEV garage when it comes.

KP in NPT | 26/11/2016

They do sell it. It came back into the store a few months ago.

http://shop.teslamotors.com/collections/model-s-charging-adapters/produc...

Bighorn | 26/11/2016

@mp
Wrong one--it's a 10-30 outlet, not 14-30.

@jmrsq
They used to sell it. Now you have to make one. There's probably a link in the OMC about it. You could probably buy an aftermarket one as well.

KP in NPT | 26/11/2016

Oops sorry @Bighorn you're right - I missed that. :)

Bighorn | 26/11/2016
Bighorn | 26/11/2016

Here's the easy way, though you need to set the amperage limit in the car:
https://www.evseadapters.com/collections/adapters-for-tesla/products/nem...

johnrowell | 26/11/2016

Hi,
I'm a Model 3 reservation holder and I also work at EVSEadapters.com. We're actually working on a new design for that 10-30 adapter that will be released next year before the Model 3 comes out. It will be able to communicate with the car to automatically set the correct current. So stay tuned!