Another example of the leadership of Elon Musk:
Yes he wants to be the adviser not the ass kisser.
Oddly, when theDepartment of Homeland Security under the Obama administration restricted visas and waivers from these seven countries-- which it, not the Trump administration, selected-- the media was utterly silent (just as it was when Iraqi citizens were under a blanket ban for six months on 2011).
@dramsey - This is a much different scale. They are blocking US citizens, Green Card holders, and people of a specific religion.
I would have liked Elon's statement to have been a bit stronger but glad he spoke up at all. Also, kudos to Uber, Lyft, and Airbb.
2016 : "Individuals impacted will still be able to apply for a visa using the regular immigration process at our embassies or consulates."
@Made in CA,
True, they are blocking existing visa and green card holders, and that's stupid. But they aren't blocking people of a particular religion: the vast majority of Muslims in the world are unaffected-- there's no ban on people from Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Malaysia, Turkey, etc. The "banning Muslims" meme is just a tact used by those who hope nobody actually takes the time to read the text of the order, helpfully provided by CNN here:
Also, the order does not block U.S. citizens. Green card holders are not citizens.
Wow can't even imagine how far some could stretch the truth. The one you cited is for Visa Waiver Program which only means a person with dual citizenship having a, say, French passport, which allows him to enter the US without a visa, and a, say, Syria passport, will still needs to get a visa to enter the country. That will put him at the same level as citizens of China, Russia, India, Poland, Mexico and Brazil. Absolutely nothing compares to Trump's ruling.
Some US Citizens were being detained whether that was the intent or not.
The text say preference is being given to "non-majority religions" from these predominantly Muslim countries. The result is that non-Muslims are being given preference. In effect, restricting Muslims.
However, good news this morning is that clarification was given by the White House that Green Card holders should not be included.
I'd say "stretching the truth" would be calling the ruling a "Muslim ban", or suggesting that it applied to American citizens, both assertions that are flooding the web.
Giving preference to members of minority religions persecuted in these countries because of their religion seems reasonable to me. I still don't see how it's "restricting Muslims" given that there are no bans of any kind affecting the vast majority of the Muslim world.
"However, good news this morning is that clarification was given by the White House that Green Card holders should not be included."
On a side note: the last few years I have spent more time than I should have stomping on stupid Obama rumors, mostly posted by friends on Facebook, asserting that he was a "secret Muslim", was about to issue an executive order banning handgun sales, or some other dumb s**t that could have been disproven with 10 seconds' searching on Google.
The thing was, if someone didn't like Obama, they'd uncritically pass along any idiotic rumor, as long as it reflected poorly on him. Stuff like this is frustrating because it makes legitimate criticism less effective.
We're seeing the same thing with Trump: there's lots of legitimate criticism to be made, but a lot of what you're seeing online, even from the MSM, is distorted, inaccurately reported, or simply made up out of whole cloth.
@DRamsey, except the level of dumb, anti-American-Principles imbued by Trump in 9 days eclipses by an order of magnitude anything that Obama did.
And the right's hatred of Obama was UNDENIABLY based on racist principles.
@dramsey - I agree - let's always hope the "truth will out".
This might be better in General.
I hope you understand I was just being nice to say that your are a fact stretcher.
It's amazing how much discussion on the political front has infiltrated this forum and other arenas that are usually reserved for specific topics related to their genre. I'm noticing much of the same in the sports section of the SF Chronicle. Shows what volatile times we are now faced with.
What a shame. The forum is becoming less and less informative and enjoyable.
Move this to the general forum where the rest of the political pollution is.
Moved to General.
Sorry all. I only brought this up because I thought Elon Musk had demonstrated expectational leadership again.
You actually has a valid point. Politics for many, if not most, is just like sports. You choose your team and usually will stick to it no matter what. Religion is the same.
Mr. Musk - keep an objective distance between yourself and Presidents Trump and Bannon. We know you mean well, but in the court of public opinion, Tesla and your shareholders have more to loose than gain from this affiliation.
This is not as simple as you think. Even as someone who strongly opposes Trump I'd still rather see Elon to influence him in a constructive way than not to. Below is what I have posted in another tread.
Here is what Elon said his reason to work with Trump,
"This is something we need to strive for and the more voices of reason that the president hears, the better," Musk said. "Simply attacking him will achieve nothing. Are you aware of a single case where Trump bowed to protests or media attacks? Better that there are open channels of communication."
Elon is obviously much smarter than most of us even in this area. Us who are against Trump and his policies should really be glad that Elon is on his advisory board.
I understand and agree that under normal circumstances, having the ability to influence policies is a great thing. However, I fear a day will come very soon, where the public will draw an overly simplistic hard line between those people and companies that are either on the side of Trump and his values/ideology or not. So at a time where Tesla needs strong sales (cars, solar, and storage), the last thing we want is a boycott.
I do not think so unless if Trump influenced Elon. This will be only an one way street that Elon to influence Trump. Not to mention people in both left and right will buy Tesla cars just like it has always been.
Shorts are of course devastated of what has happened to them because of the close(r) working relationship between Elon and Trump. They had hopes that Trump's policies would mean Tesla to take a huge beating. I hope you are not one who falls to that.
Maybe he wants to differentiate from what happens in Europe. I don't understand a lot of things.
Netherland plea to Trump.
IF you want to know your current rights here in the USofA, you can read NDAA - National Defense Authorization Act.https://en.wikipedia .org/wiki/National_Defense_Authorization_Act
The most controversial provisions to receive wide attention were contained in subsections 1021–1022 of Title X, Subtitle D, entitled "Counter-Terrorism", authorizing the indefinite military detention of persons the government suspects of involvement in terrorism, including U.S. citizens arrested on American soil. Although the White House and Senate sponsors maintain that the Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) already grants presidential authority for indefinite detention, the Act states that Congress "affirms" this authority and makes specific provisions as to the exercise of that authority. The detention provisions of the Act have received critical attention by, among others, the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), the Bill of Rights Defense Committee, and some media sources which are concerned about the scope of the President's authority, including contentions that those whom they claim may be held indefinitely could include U.S. citizens arrested on American soil, including arrests by members of the Armed Forces. The detention powers currently face legal challenge.
lilbean "What a shame. The forum is becoming less and less informative and enjoyable." The voice of reason once again +42
carlk "I do not think so unless if Trump influenced Elon" I agree with 90% of what you say. It does need to be a give and take as they are 2 or the most gifted business men in the world. +21
Your very own link states:
"Individuals impacted will still be able to apply for a visa using the regular immigration process at our embassies or consulates. For those who need a U.S. visa for urgent business, medical, or humanitarian travel to the United States, U.S. embassies and consulates stand ready to provide visa interview appointments on an expedited basis. The new law does not ban travel to the United States, or admission into the United States, and the great majority of Visa Waiver Program travelers will not be affected."
I'm not sure that could be any more clear. Please do not become one of the people that routinely posts evidence contradictory to your own point.
You can also check the page out on wayback machine to confirm it has not been edited to be contrary to anyone's recent actions.
@Carlk You are very much correct about Elon being on the advisory board.
The alt-facters™ have even launched an interesting campaign against Musk being there indicating to me that they are very much worried about the fact that there is a small possibility of someone not filled with their delusions may get close to the president.
xo <3 bigd
Other possible immigration issues:
How can anyone call a stiffing flimflam artist who has been through more bankruptcies thana Wall Street lawyer a gifted businessman?
@Made in CA (January 29, 2017)
<< They are blocking US citizens, Green Card holders, and people of a specific religion. >>
These are all lies. You haven't read it, go do it NOW.