I've seen a few posts about the HPWC connector, but since I'll be getting the smaller battery I won't need it. Does anyone have a guess how much it would cost to wire up a 220 connection in my garage?
That's literally a "How long is a piece of wire" question, but to take a stab at it.
The actual NEMA 14-50 receptacle is maybe $15. The electrician is going to be between $100 and $300 depending upon the amount of work they have to do. The rest is wire and conduit. I'd budget for $500 if the plug will be very close to the electrical panel and $1000 if not.
The only other "gotcha" is if your current electrical system needs expanding for the 50 amp breaker. If you need to replace the panel that can be from $500 to $2000.
SolarCity has quoted me $450 for a very short run from the control panel to the 14-50 outlet in the garage.
+jerry3. What he says.
Just did mine (P#2159), and it cost about $600. The electrician needed to run a wire through the garage and drill a hole to put the 14-50 outlet outside. He was here about 3 hours.
Hope this helps.
Just had one installed last week. Extremely easy , short cable run (30 feet).
$400 bucks cash.
I just got a quote from Solar City and local company.
Solar City $750 for 50A $900 for 100A service
Local company $750 for 100A service with 50A plug for now.
$450 -Less than 4 ft wire run- no sub-panel required
Solar City installed
Actual material for me was < $50, but my outlet is literally right below my panel. About an hour's work for the electrician - not sure what the rate is since in this case it's my brother & he's doing it for the promise of a couple rides in the Model S.
Thanks all, my outlet would be 2 feet below my breaker box, so I don't expect it to be too much.
Does anyone have the cost to add a meter to the 220v line used to charge the car?
A local electrician installed my NEMA 14-50 circuit 8/31 for $285. I thought that was very reasonable. Nothing fancy... it was a short cable run from my main 200 Amp power panel to a stud mounted receptacle in the garage. No permitting required. The workman told me they have also done wall mounted HPCs. If you live in the San Diego area and are interested in a referral, drop me an email: firstname.lastname@example.org
I just did mine this afternoon. I ran 40ft of wire and conduit, plus breaker and NEMA 14-50 outlet. Total of less than $200 and about 4 hours work. Fortunately I had space in my panel, and enough feed to the house.Here's the parts list:
#6 wire is $1/ft at Lowes/Home Depot. You'll need four wires - red/black/white and green. If you keep it simple and use #6 for everything it is therefore $4/ft.
PVC conduit is $2/10ft.
NEMA 14-50R outlet plus box: $10
50A breaker: $10
Conduit clips plus screws: $10
The most expensive part is the wire. I don't think you actually need #6 for the neutral and earth, but I played it safe.
BTW - I did a long run so that I could mount the outlet at the side of the garage door. I figured with the 20ft TM charging cable I'd be able to reach the charge port regardless with the car was nose in, reversed in or outside the garage. If I'd mounted the outlet near the breaker I wouldn't be able to charge it outside.
Nick, You do need #6 for the neutral, but the green wire can step one size down to #8. Depending on code, if it's all metal conduit, you may not even need the ground wire since it's grounded throught the conduit. I used 3 #6 and 1 #8, running through 1 inch PVC, and just did mine this week as well. 20 foot run which puts the outlet right by the garage door on the drivers side. That should let me charge eiether in the garage, or outside the garage. I went out and bought one of those 3 dollar garden hose hangers and mounted it chest high right above the NEMA plug. Since the charging cord will only need to extend about 5 feet to the car when it's in the garage, I need a way to keep the cable off the floor and looking tidy. It's my "poor man's" HPC.
I'm just short one thing. A car to plug it into.
FYI - also thinking about getting an extra cord. I'd like to have one plugged into the garage and not have to bend down to plug and unplug the NEMA end. The extra cord can go in the frunk or runk, for charging on the road.
@jbunn - exactly what I did. I used 3/4" PVC conduit, mounted the outlet near the floor and will put a hanger on the wall. I was going to mount the outlet about 5ft off the floor out of the way, then realized I would lose 5ft of the 20ft cable length just getting to the floor! Duh!
Cost me $100 parts included by a licensed electrician (NEMA 14-50)
Wow seems like everyone has surplus AMPS available. I have a couple of 110v 15AMP outlets in the garage but I want two 220v 100amp outlets in the garage. (61 miles of charging per hour)This requires 200 amps surplus on my existing feed, which is a 200 amp feed for the entire house. So I am installing a second "time of use billing" meter dedicated to the car. I will charge the car at off timess and drop the cost significantly. I am at $5k, to bring the service in from the street, install the second meter, install the second breaker box, install the outlets, install the Tesla Charger and repair the exterior where the second meter will sit. I do get a $2k rebate from the DWP towards the cost.
Realisticly, how many times are you going to need to charge that fast?
I'm having the outlet installed in an outside spot with a weatherproof outlet box and 130 feet run from the panel. The electrician needs to run the wire under the house, into the garage and then around to the opposite side of the garage. Cost around $1500.
rtesta, $5k to save on time of day charging? I doubt you will live long enough for that to pay back. You will only save the difference between normal charge rates and time of day rates. Even at $0.20 differential that will take a lot of charging to recover $5k.
I know someone who had a dedicated meter installed and about 50 feet of conduit inside the garage to his charging station (for a Volt) for $1500. I think rtesta's $5k is a result of all the other work being done.
My net cost on the second meter is $3k. The DWP provides a $2K rebate for the second meter install. It includes a second circuit breaker panel and wiring for two cars in the garage. This isn't about ROI as much as it is making sure the electric decision can't come back to bite me. I drive to Santa Barbara almost every week (180 miles round trip). I want to make sure if anything happens I always have a fully charged car. I can fully recharge in three hours, using a 15amp circuit that would take me 10 hours if I get all 15 amps?
I am meeting with a Solar City rep at my house tonight to go over installation of a 14-50 NEMA outlet outside my garage. The estimate for installation, including a 50' run from my electric box to the installation location, is $900. I admire @nickjhowe and others who are doing it themselves, but I lack the time, skill and confidence to pull it off!
@NJS1207 - I thought long and hard before doing it; If I hadn't had plenty of empty space on the panel I wouldn't have attempted it. Now you know what the retail parts cost is (<$200 for the wire, $50 for all other parts) and that it should only take 3 hours (the longest part was putting up the conduit single handed) you can judge whether $900 is reasonable, or whether to get someone else to quote.
I paid about $350 to get mine installed. It's right under the panel and now I wish it was higher up, I'm worried about hitting it with the car door since it's not recessed into the wall..
I also have the Roadster HPC and I was surprised that when using the HPC adapter I could only get 40 amps, the same as the NEMA 14-50. I would have thought the HPC would charge the Model S faster than the 220 outlet.
This is the first time I've heard that using the HPC adapter only gets 40A. That seems more like a bug (or design flaw) to me.
It can't be 40A. To charge at 62miles per hour you need 20kW. At 240V you need 83A to product 20kW. Factor in inverter losses and you are getting up towards 100A.
Nah the NEMA 14-50 is a 50 amp plug, but the single charger in the car pulls 40 amps. So in regard to Adam's post, eiether the Roadster HPC only puts out 40 amps by design, or the S in question has a single charger. Really, no point in purchasing a sepearate adapter for the roadster HPC. Cheaper to just add a Nema 14-50 plug off right below the roadster HPC on the same circut and use one or the other (but not both at the same time). Save a lot more money than the adapter.
NEMA 14-50 gets 40A. The HPC for the Roadster gets 70A, maybe higher with the ones for the Model S. There are at least 20 70A chargers along the West Coast for Roadsters. This is on the Tesla Highway google map.
I just talked to an electrician to request a quote to add a NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage.
I have an older home (built 1932) and the service to the home is only 100A per leg (dual leg service gives me 200A of 120V or 100A of 240V or any combination between). He asked me about my large appliances. I told him I have: A/C, Electric dual ovens, Electric clothes dryer, Electric water heater upstairs even though downstairs water heater is gas, a Jacuzzi tub in master bat, and a hot tube in the back yard.
He told me that I need 200Amp service regardless of adding the NEMA 14-50 for the Model S.
So, I'll need to contact my power company (PG&E) and have them string heavier wire to my house, upgrade my main panel, upgrade my subpanel in the detached garage run new 125A conduit from the main panel to the garage (about 100 ft), then I can add the NEMA 14-50.
He said it's not gonna be cheap. I'm hoping it's less than $5K.
I'm having Solar City come out next week to quote this as well. But from this thread, it appears that Solar City is more expensive than a local electrician.
As in the post above, I am also in an older home and just finished talking with my electrician. Fortunately, I don't have as many issues. The new outlet will be in a different bay from the NEMA 14-50 I use for my roadster (which is about 6 feet from my breaker box and cost about $300 three years ago). They are "slimming down" some of the existing breakers to make room for the new breaker. The new outlet will require about 40 feet of conduit and associated wire. Also, since there isn't access to better space, the conduit will run across the ceiling and have to be punched through 2 sheet rock walls.
Total cost $692.
@dahtye: Stock up on candles. I went through this dance a few years ago when we added A/C to our home with a 60A service. They pulled our meter when the upgrade process began, and we didn't get it back until both PG&E and the city agreed the upgrade went as expected. It required a 3-way inspection with my electrician, PG&E, and the city. Either PG&E or the city (I forget which) failed to show up for the first such meeting, so our power outage was extended a few days while a new inspection got set up.
In my case, the power feed to the house is buried, so they had to inspect the trench before we were allowed to back-fill. If your feed is from a pole, then it may be a bit easier for you. Good luck!
The electrician said they can do the work before contacting PG&E (our electricity provider in our area). He said it will take about 3.5 days to do the work. Then I contact PG&E and wait until they can string heavier cable from the pole (no digging, I'm assuming here, but they may need to check on the transformer at the pole to make sure there's enough juice available).
I did get the quote for all the work I described a few posts ago....
I'm having Solar City come out to quote as well.
Part of the issue in my install is they need to put down a new underhouse and underground conduit that will accomodate the new 125A breaker box in the detached garage. So, heavy labor is involved and labor rates in the SF bay area are quite high.
The positive of all this is that they can start the job since they are available - before it starts raining.
Electrician just left. It seems we have three-phase 150amp feed. Unfortunately, from the main shut off in the garage it goes up to the 4th floor where the main panel is. There is a heater in the garage with a 20amp 208v feed, which I intend to tap into. More than 20amps is going to cost me north of $2k to put in a sub panel off the main feed (and I rent). Electrician wasn't very keen on the idea of putting a 14-50 on a 20amp feed, but I don't think Tesla has any other adapters available yet. I assume I can just put in a 14-50 and the Model S will only take what's available, not trip the breaker.
@dahtye - a year ago I had electrical work done, adding circuits in the house and preparing for EVs. We replaced the main panel (which was already 200A but too small), added a 100A subpanel in the garage, and ran ~100ft of #0 wire to the garage. I supplied the subpanel in the garage and did some of the work myself and it came to just under $5k, but that did include about $750 for the extra circuits in the house. So, just going by that I would say the estimate isn't totally crazy.
@MandL - you will have to make sure that you can program the Model S to only draw 16A (unless the breaker for that heater line is rated for continuous duty, you have to derate by 25%) -- it might just assume that if you gave it a 14-50 it can draw 50A. I know you are supposed to be able to do it with the HPWC, but I don't know about the others.
@MandL "Electrician wasn't very keen on the idea of putting a 14-50 on a 20amp feed..."
You can always have your electrician put in a suitable outlet (probably NEMA 6-20), and then make you a 6-20 to 14-50 adapter cable. The connectors and a short length of cable won't cost very much, and since it isn't part of the house wiring, you don't have to show it to the inspector. It would be perfectly safe to use, since the whole line will be limited to 20A (16A continuous), you just have to use it with that current limitation in mind or you'll trip the breaker.
If Tesla doesn't come out with a full range of adapters quickly, or if they are way overpriced, I'll probably make up a full-range of adapters myself so I'm ready for any charging situation.
see if you can get your landlord to buy into/pay for the renos, on the basis it makes the place more rentable (in particular to high-roller EV-lovers, etc.) I was successful in getting substantial appliance upgrade where I live (rent) based on such considerations! (And by subtly hinting I'd relocate to somewhere better equipped otherwise; landlords HATE to lose long-term (5 yrs. in my case) renters; turnover is brutal financially for them.)
I have been assuming the 110v outlet would be fine for me anyway, since my normal daily driving is under 50 miles and there is a SEMAcharge station at work. So upgrading to 208v/20a should be plenty.
There already is a full range of adapters on the market check amazon or walmart. RVs have been around for a very long time. Somewhere in this forum I posted a link to several of the adapters. You can use combinations of adapters to get just about anything you want.
It is also extremely easy to make them yourself with a visit to the hardware store.
From the TM Owners Quick Guide:
The charge current sets automatically to the maximum current available from the attached charging cable, unless it has been previously reduced to a lower level. If needed, you can change the current by touching the up/down arrows. You may want to reduce the current in situations where you’re concerned about overloading a domestic wiring circuit shared by other equipment. When you change the current, Model S remembers. So if you subsequently charge at a different location, you may need to re-adjust. Keep in mind that reducing the current increases charging time."
You should be fine. If for some reason Model S doesn't automatically adjust to the maximum current available on the circuit, you can dial it back manually from the touch screen.
Just had a 14-50 installed (plus and additional outlet to backfeed a generator) all together $699.00.
I should mention that in my original quote of $7500, they had a foot note that said if I want an additional NEMA 14-50 outlet close to my subpanel (on the outside wall, about 4 feet from the subpanel), weather protected, the cost would be an additional $250. So, I take this as the "incremental" cost to add this which includes labor and materials since they are already out doing the other work. If I had asked for just this one outlet, I'd expect the charge to be a bit higher.
The electrician requote only the upgrade to 200Amp panel and added NEMA 14-50 outlet (within 2 feet of the new panel) at $3,900. I think this is still a tad high, so am still pursuing a quote from another installer. But the electrician seemed like they need the work, so I think they are willing to negotiate if it comes down to that.
Hello. I am opting for the NEMA 14-50 outlet. I have 150amp service and plenty of space my panel. I have about a 40ft run through an unfinished basement to an adjacent garage. Since Solar City isn't in my area (Columbus, OH), Mr. Electric came out and quoted me a little over $800 and would be using 8 guage wire with conduit. I decided to call a couple other area electricians. The other two that I contacted haven't come out yet, but each quoted me about $250 over the phone and that is with 6 gauge wire. Should I be worried that they are both quoting that much cheaper than Mr. Electric?
Ask Mr. Electric. "What will my extra $550 buy me?"
A 40ft run totals about $200 in parts (retail) - the biggest cost is wire. $250 sounds either (a) excellent value or (b) lowballing.
mikeadams -- Should I be worried that they are both quoting that much cheaper than Mr. Electric?
Not really. Mr. Electric has a large overhead of trucks, employees, and office staff to pay. The local electricians are generally just individuals and a job like this is just an "extra" to them. If they have their masters license there should be no difference in the quality of work that they do.
Of course, with Mr. Electric, Solar City, etc. you can be 100% sure that everything will be done correctly and that no shortcuts will be taken. However, for something that is simple like installing a 14-50 on a panel that has plenty of room, the only foobars possible are using the wrong size wire (too light) or wiring up to the wrong pins. It's very unlikely that either of these will happen and you can check the wire size during the install because the size is printed on the wires.
If you have to replace the service panel or do other major work, there are more opportunities for failure.
MandL, I would be very concerned about an electrician who would even consider putting a 50 amp outlet on a 20 amp feed. This is most likely against code. Please consider the other options that have been made such as making your own adaptor. The charge cable Tesla uses can only make an assumption about amperage based upon the connector that is used and as such will assume a 40 amp maximum from what it believes to be a NEMA 14-50 connector. As others have stated you can set the Model S to draw a lower value if you want to do that.
Just had my NEMA 14-50 installed today (outside, next to driveway). Cost $650 (was not itemized, but given that my 200A panel is as far away from the driveway as possible, the wire was probably not cheap)!
I was quoted $450 for a NEMA 14-50 outlet that is close to (within about 2 meters) to my electric panel (as long as there are no panel upgrades needed). Seems like this could be done for lower cost, but the eletrician needs to put food on his table.