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Unexpected sudden braking.

Unexpected sudden braking.

I have had my Model 3 for 2 weeks now and love it but have had a few incidents while driving on the I-10 when using cruise control or autopilot. The set max speed will suddenly drop by 20 or 30 mph and the car will brake heavily slowing down significantly. Luckily despite driving during peak traffic I have not been hit. Another incident happened 8/9/19 when a phantom car suddenly appeared on the display and my Tesla sent out a warning sound then again braked hard. They were no vehicles within 50 yards to the front and nothing in the lanes next to me. Has anyone else experienced anything like these incidents? The interesting part is I only experience the issues on the same stretch of the I-10. I will be calling for support.

SalisburySam | August 11, 2019

Yes, pretty much everyone. Read the many threads here and in other fora about something usually called “phantom braking.” It happens, it is annoying, it is scary for passengers, and it hasn’t been fixed. In fact for me, in firmware 24.4, it has gotten very much worse. My interim remedy when it occurs: immediate bug report (press right steering wheel button and speak “bug report unintended braking” or words to that effect. Then go on your way. On the 3rd occurrence I disconnect the auto-goodies and drive the car.

howard | August 11, 2019

SalisburySam | August 11, 2019
Yes, pretty much everyone.

+1. I don’t use either. Waiting for improvements.

jstat10 | August 11, 2019

I use cruise control (TACC) all the time and I find unexpected rapid braking rarely happens with firmware 2019.24.4, and when it does it is in unusual situations, e.g. construction zones.

I have never had a "phantom car" appear on the screen.

sixstring09 | August 11, 2019

Tesla really needs to fix this behavior.

Red_Falcon | August 11, 2019

Yes. And have I to say the latest update has lessened the occurrences and the degree of panic braking.

Day after receiving 2019.24.4 update, did a 132 mi roundtrip using autopilot 80% of the time and it performed nicely only having 5 slowing down events (not panic braking) when there's no apparent reason it should be slowing down at all.

I too never had a phantom car show up on the screen.

The Tesla Service center guy told me that they're working the issue and that it would be fixed two updates ago - still waiting.

When I use it, i'm always prepared to hit the accelerator and take control...don't want to be rear ended.

AND YES...TESLA GET THIS FIXED. FSD will never be a reality with this issue occurring.

Red_Falcon | August 11, 2019

Yes. And have I to say the latest update has lessened the occurrences and the degree of panic braking.

Day after receiving 2019.24.4 update, did a 132 mi roundtrip using autopilot 80% of the time and it performed nicely only having 5 slowing down events (not panic braking) when there's no apparent reason it should be slowing down at all.

I too never had a phantom car show up on the screen.

The Tesla Service center guy told me that they're working the issue and that it would be fixed two updates ago - still waiting.

When I use it, i'm always prepared to hit the accelerator and take control...don't want to be rear ended.

AND YES...TESLA GET THIS FIXED. FSD will never be a reality with this issue occurring.

FISHEV | August 11, 2019

“When I use it, i'm always prepared to hit the accelerator and take control...don't want to be rear ended.“@Red_Falcon

Which is how the opposite of safety enhancements should work. They should behave consistently and as expected and that’s not the case for adaptive cruise or lane keeping/emergency lane keeping. As you note, hard to full self driving being a reality without the basics of AP working smoothly.

Wattsworth | August 11, 2019

What stretch of I-10?

One thing you can try to reduce the "heavily slowing" is to select chill mode when using TACC or AP. Also, increasing the follow distance allows the car to react sooner with less gusto.

As to "anyone else?" I've never seen the set-speed change and I've never seen a phantom vehicle appear when all is clear around me.

apodbdrs | August 11, 2019

While I have seen other issues in the one year I have had my car, I have never experience phantom breaking or detected a phantom vehicle.

howard | August 11, 2019

Red_Falcon

FSD will never be a reality with this issue occurring.

+1

Bighorn | August 11, 2019

Small minded people must be perpetually sad, as though Tesla would never solve the issue and dooming FSD in perpetuity. GAFC.

jstat10 | August 11, 2019

I expect most of these issues will be resolved when HW3 and associated software is fully implemented. What I see happening is that the software/hardware just isn't fast enough to determine if some things are a false positives in real time, so it brakes.

teslamazing | August 11, 2019

Just be patient until HW3 is implemented. Would y’all rather have the car hit something vs phantom
brake where it is possibly detecting something ? Hmm ....

raqball | August 11, 2019

I have HW3 and have never experienced the phantom braking until I updated to 28.2.. Its happened twice so far but they have been minor instance...

The few times it's happened to me it's been a reduction of maybe 5 mph or so. Yesterday was one of them. A car 3 or 4 car lengths ahead and accelerating with noting on either side of me and the car braked. Not a hard brake kink of like a regen brake for a second then realized all was okay and back to normal..

teslamazing | August 11, 2019

Having the hardware doesn’t mean u have the proper software for full implementation of HW3 ..

piducharme | August 11, 2019

The problem occurred a few times in auto pilot mode which once quite brutally and even in cruse control mode. I even suggest that the brake lights come on. I was hit once very lightly and if the brake lights had been functional I would not have been hit. I do not remember seeing fantomes in the screen. I found that the system is very hesitant in curves and also at road junctions. I also think that the computer has reached its limits and I will be very happy to get the new version. The suggestions of TPS August 11 are interesting in the short term. Even if I have to be very vigilant, I find that the autopilot is much more resting on a long journey and consumes less (to re-check)

mts | August 11, 2019

I've had my M3 for 4 months now, and have never experienced the phantom braking described above. What I have seen is braking for explainable reasons: a low underpass just past a hill will appear to be stationary object on the road. Also, on Cape Cod the roads are narrow (think old settler trails converted to highways = 2 lanes with no breakdown areas) and mailboxes will cause the car to slow down. When I say "braking" I really mean "regen braking".

On a different but similar note: when driving at night, the automatic headlights will dim when a reflective roadsign shows up suddenly - the reflected light is interpreted as an oncoming car's headlights.

My '51 Chevy never had these problems, but then again, my M3 is a much better car.

vmulla | August 11, 2019

@mts,
The relatively newer software of the last 4 months is much improved.
Many folks who talk about recent phantom braking suggest phantom braking is now a rare occurrence, but it happens.
Previously reported bugs on this problem are being addressed, I can confirm one spot where phantom braking is no longer happening.

azbrit | August 11, 2019

I drive a lot during the early hours when there are a lot of flying insects. I have cleaned a lot of them off the front of the car. Maybe a build up of insects could be impacting the sensors?

Xerogas | August 12, 2019

@piducharme: "suggest that the brake lights come on. I was hit once very lightly and if the brake lights had been functional I would not have been hit.”
------
That’s not how it works. Brake lights *do* come on when autopilot slows down.

schralp | August 12, 2019

I live in LA and continually experienced the same thing during my ownership over the last 9 months except mine is completely unpredictable and therefore quite dangerous. Many have posted the same. I feel like a fool for having purchased enhanced autopilot and would not lay a penny out for FSD because of this aberrant behavior. As it is, I paid $5k for a feature that works far better on Volvos as far back as 2 years ago. I just returned from Sweden last night where I drove a rental car with adaptive cruise control far more stable and reliable than in my M3. I still like my M3 very much but should have saved the $5k.

gotch | October 13, 2019

Just experienced severe Phantom braking This morning at 110kph. Very unsettling, no.one in sight the first time, a vehicle 100m ahead travelling only slightly slower in the other lane the second time. Same point on separated freeway, but travelling in opposite direction. Cruise control engaged.

howard | October 13, 2019

schralp I paid $5k for a feature that works far better on Volvos as far back as 2 years ago. I just returned from Sweden last night where I drove a rental car with adaptive cruise control far more stable and reliable than in my M3.

My 2019 Volt Adaptive Cruise is far superior to my 2018 Tesla that was twice the cost. It is very disappointing and frustrating. A year later and I honestly think it is probably worse. I would just love to have plain old speed control.

mattieu.nuijten | October 14, 2019

I drive my M3 for three weeks now. I drove Volkswagen and Skoda over the past 10 years with a more safe and reliable Adaptive Cruise Control. Yes “chill mode” and “distance” do help to lessen the problem, also taking more distance from vehicles you just passed helps. But I experience the cruise control mode not as a feature that ease my driving od increases safety. Tesla should do better on this, please improve and update!

afetzer | October 14, 2019

Schralp is absolutely correct. Cruise control in EAP is unsafe and I have reported it to the federal safety board. Since Tesla seems unable to correct the problem maybe we can get them to refund the money we paid for non-funtioninfg features, both EAP and FSD.

lbowroom | October 14, 2019

Welcome to the forum. Thanks for your opinion

howard | October 14, 2019

afetzer | October 14, 2019
Schralp is absolutely correct. Cruise control in EAP is unsafe and I have reported it to the federal safety board. Since Tesla seems unable to correct the problem maybe we can get them to refund the money we paid for non-funtioninfg features, both EAP and FSD.

+1 Unfortunately we all bought into the hype. It is all beta functionality. It is carefully defined as beta functionality. There is nor never will be a refund. We can just wait patiently and then wait so more. Reporting to the TSB is a good idea though. It is probably the only thing that might get Tesla’s attention. At least TACC “adaptive cruise” should work properly as it does on a host of other vehicles. It has nothing to do with HW2 or HW3. Other vehicles have simple dedicated tried and true adaptive cruise systems that have worked for many years. It is the march towards AP & FSD that is the issue. Make the simple stuff work correctly first then move forward. Do what’s best for customers not propping up the stock price.

SalisburySam | October 15, 2019

I would like to see a non-traffic-aware option for TACC. Let me use full TACC where I’m certain its odd behaviors would not be a safety nor comfort issue, and plain-old-set-speed-keeping cruise control elsewhere. Keep improving the TA stuff but help us by offering something other than TA or nothing.

82bert | October 15, 2019

No phantom braking still since V10.

howard | October 15, 2019

82bert, another magical car. No it is worse on mine. Keep trying! Let’s see it was the gang, fanboys, fanatics and now it the magic Tesla car club. Good grief the nonsense keeps rolling out.

WEST TEX EV | October 15, 2019

Please send link to dash am footage. Also report to TESLA. Share footage with them. If a regular occurrence RECORD ALL on Dashcam and chat with TESLA!! Thx

howard | October 15, 2019

SalisburySam | October 15, 2019
I would like to see a non-traffic-aware option for TACC

+1 this has been asked for repeatedly by a number of folks. Sorry but some of us just apparently have non magic versions.

Joshan | October 15, 2019

or basic understanding of technology.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

Howard, stop the snarky magic car talk please

I bought my car without EAP in 2018, therefore it had "dumb" cruise with one tap down. I did buy AP and am pleased with the performance, its keeps me centered in the lane and ensures I don't hit any cars. Perfectly, no. Adequately, yes.

Joshan | October 15, 2019

howard loves to tell everyone how he never uses AP, but at the same time acts like an expert on it.... its comical the double talk.

FISHEV | October 15, 2019

"Sorry but some of us just apparently have non magic versions."@howard

No kidding. I wonder it really is a wide disparity in actual car performance. Tesla is always changing on the fly and maybe they've been swapping out components, not doing the recalls they should especially for safety equipment, just making changes in cars going forward. Sometime the changes help, sometimes they don't or even make them worse.

I have a fairly recent Model 3, May 2019, which has issues with BSI, Lane Keeping, adaptive cruise, may have newer components that are actually worse than the older cars as it seems like those who have older cars don't have issues though it may be they just developed better "EV glasses" (kind of like beer glasses in effect with Tesla fandom the drug of choice to create them vs. beer). Of course their psychology of creating bizarre conspiracy theories to defend car malfunctions tends to make one think it's definitely the EV glasses.

Until Tesla frees up AP from the issues with FSD, we'll continue to have poor functionality with AP of which the random braking is arguably the most dangerous since it has the car doing hard stops when no driver is expecting them, not the Tesla driver or the other drivers around the Tesla.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

Keep that yarn spinning...

Joshan | October 15, 2019

funny how the ones with "magic cars" and the people with all the issues can be counted on one hand for the most part. Maybe the issue is not the car?

Joshan | October 15, 2019

edit...

funny how the ones with "magic cars" is most everyone who owns one and the people with all the issues can be counted on one hand for the most part. Maybe the issue is not the car?

FISHEV | October 15, 2019

"people with all the issues can be counted on one hand for the most part."Joshan

Per this thread, most have the problems, few special people do not. Those same "specials" have been reprimanded by Tesla with their leader suspended for week for deleting other owners posts and comments and others getting email "ceases and desist" messages. Tesla stopped the message deletion but can't fix the post deletion until the new forum software implementation, all due to bad behavior of the delete gang. So even Tesla, which benefits from the deletion of owner problem posts, has called you out. End of that story.

Be nice if the "chosen ones" would just not comment on other owners threads and let the adults discuss the issues. That you and others insist on commenting when you have nothing to add but "Leave Tesla Alone" and "My Car is Perfect" comments demonstrates you don't even believe what you say, otherwise you'd walk on by.

The delete gang has been put in a box and soon that box is going to be tossed in the dumpster with new forum software with the sole purpose is to put an end to the delete gang's antics, your antics.

And now back to issue the owner posted about, an issue many owners have posted about, an issue all Model3 owners have with Tesla's adaptive cruise, random braking.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

Data wise, with all this hype put forth, I haven't seen a single reported accident on this forum involving sudden braking or changing lanes into another car....

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

fish, appears you delete your own posts when the heat from the spotlight on you gets too accurate.

FISHEV | October 15, 2019

"appears you delete your own posts"@lbowroom

Tesla found different and booted your leader out for a week and sent you all warning emails. Enough said.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

So both those can't be true?

Joshan | October 15, 2019

warning emails? uh ya... more lies just like everything you post.

FISHEV | October 15, 2019

Phantom braking is a real problem as we see.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

and I always thought I was the leader....

Joshan | October 15, 2019

that affects you and your shadow accounts.

lbowroom | October 15, 2019

Trolling and astroturfing is a real problem as we see

FISHEV | October 15, 2019

"Trolling and astroturfing is a real problem as we see"@lbowroom

So do as Tesla requested of you and your leader, stop doing it.

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