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$29 K Upgrade or buy a Prius: Upgrade fails @ 400 mile range & Roadster charging @ Super Charger Station

$29 K Upgrade or buy a Prius: Upgrade fails @ 400 mile range & Roadster charging @ Super Charger Station

With all the hype about supercharging stations being installed nation wide for the Model S, there are no plans to include a charging outlet( HP 70A or Nema 14-50A ) for the Tesla Roadster owners at the supercharging stations.
In Texas I understand there will be supercharging stations installed between Austin,Dallas and Houston for the Model S.
I presently will have to rely on the Level 2 or Level 1 stations installed by Blinks,Chargepoint and others, which will make any travel experience unpredictable.

Elon and Tesla should continue to support the Roadster owners who supported Tesla from the beginning.

At the present all the attention is on the Model S.

In the beginnig Tesla installed chargers along the west coast for Roasters with the promise of more to come, that has now taken a back seat to the Model S rollout

The cost to include charging outlets for Roadsters at the supercharging stations nationwide would be a minimal amount to Tesla but a huge statement as to Tesla's intention to support its customer base and the charging needs of all the Tesla owner family members.

R.Thompson

Brian H | 7 juin 2013

Hear, hear!

zero K | 7 juin 2013

Well said. Installing charge ability for roadsters at Tesla Supercharging stations should have been planned in from the start. Its a relatively cheap PR bonus indicating that Tesla has not forgotten the early adopters who helped make the Model S possible. I'd also accept a Roadster upgrade that allows DC charging as an acceptable substitute!

Brian H | 7 juin 2013

Rewiring the car with heavy cables? Um, ...

dna4life | 7 juin 2013

Amen to that!

NapaValleyMike | 8 juin 2013

Can't the Roadster simply be charged with an adapter at the new charging stations?

Brian H | 8 juin 2013

Napa;
No. The DC power would have to be inverted (turned to AC) and cut down in voltage by a factor of 8. That's the "hottest" the Roadster can handle.

bernie_beaudoin02878 | 9 juin 2013

Mr. Musk,

What's wrong with this picture? As a Roadster owner, I want to show the world that my Roadster can go anywhere, anytime. If the SuperCharger network is 'off limits' to my Roadster, it's hard to explain to potential buyers just how viable owning a Tesla vehicle is.... There must be a simple solution that will cater to the Roadster owners who want to charge up at a Supercharger site.

Don't leave us out of the picture... Roadster owners love their cars...... I am buying a model S, but I do want to take my Roadster on the same trips I can take the model S on....

What about an upgrade battery/ charging system that is compatible with the supercharges?

Bernie,

Roadster #769, Sydney, Australia.......

richardean412 | 9 juin 2013

UR R correct, Bernie, in expecting Tesla to step up to the plate on the promise made in the beginning to Roadster buyers of being able to drive the USA, unrestricted by the needs of re-charging the batteries, in order entice us into buying a Roadster. Tesla and Mr. Elon Musk should plan ahead with charging systems which include the Roadster.

After the Model S and Model X, Tesla will once again build the Roadster as part of the overall Tesla brand.

The Tesla owners of the future will guage Elon and Tesla's commitment to all the drivers of Tesla vehicles, who wish to explore the highways of the world just as he explores OUTER SPACE with SPACE X.

Do not LIMIT our Ability & Driving Range as we explore our world !

In the beginning when there was only the Roadster, Tesla explained to the media how there would be no limits to traveling the country.
Tesla began introducing charging stations along the highways of California, west coast, and instilled in the mind of future owners the coming of other charging stations for the Roadster owners around the US to travel without limits.

This was all before the Model S became Reality !

What will happen when the Model X rolls out ?

The Model S already has perks not offered to the Roadster owners,
Ex., No longer needs to maintain annual service and a free No-Fault life time warranty on Tesla Battery Pack.

Elon Musk,Tesla engineers and managers need to make good on at least the origional Promise & Idea of a Tesla Roadster owner being able to drive across the country on a Battery Powered Tesla Roadster without the worry of ones next charging station availability.

R. Thompson # 1125

Brian H | 9 juin 2013

Adjunct HPCs would be as good as it gets. Battery replacement isn't enough. Wiring and electronics would have to be replaced too. Don't ask or expect the impossible.

myTesla | 10 juin 2013

It should be no problem do pass DC through the PEM. Maybe not with 120kW but with 20-30kW. The SC can be tuned to deliver any voltage an current wanted. Ok, this needs new software for he pem-controller.

in europ i would love to use a B6-bridge to rectify my 3-phases to DC an let the PEM do the job to smooth the current for charging.

best

Eberhard

samcar | 17 juin 2013

I think Tesla needs to have at least one or two 70 amp HPC's at the supercharger sites. I have a Roadster and a Model S, and I prefer the Roadster for most road trips. An HPC at each Supercharger would not be expensive, it would be a PR boost as mentioned in a previous post, and a fulfillment of the vision sold to early adopters. I've been to the RV parks they're okay but I would rather have the option to travel the Supercharger network with my Roadster.
And while I'm ranting how about a Model S HPWC to Roadster plug adapter. There already is a Roadster HPC to Model S adapter.

MarkA | 24 juin 2013

I too am saddened by Tesla's decision to exclude Roadsters from their charging network. Without the success of the Roadster, there would be no Model S (or any other Tesla). I think the least they could do would be to include one or two 70 amp charging ports at these locations. It wouldn't even have to be free charging - I just want a place to plug in.

Brian H | 24 juin 2013

MarkA;
+1

NAQ88 | 24 juin 2013

Can I add my voice to the complaints about Roadster charging? I bought my Roadster late, it was one of the last to be sold in the UK, a year ago next week, so maybe I cannot moan too loudly as my qualification as an 'early adopter' is a bit thin, but I do a lot of soft PR for Tesla through my political and other connections.

I have had some enjoyable trips in my roadster, but unless one has access to the 70A charging stations, if you want to travel more that 160 miles the mid-range 32A chargers are not very practical. It would help if there was some consistency of charging device, BLueCommando/Menekes II etc, but when I took delivery, the only adaptor available was the BlueCommando Universal Connector, which I bought as part of my package.

I have only been able to use it twice, possibly three times. Last week I turned up in Bristol at Cribbs Causeway Mall confidently expecting to be able to recharge whilst I attended a Green conference a few miles away. Except the Blue Commando connector on offer was DIFFERENT to the normal one, and I had to cut short my attendance at the conference and shoot across the Severn Bridge to use the 70A HPC at Celtic Manor. Fortunately I had enough charge to get there, but it added 50 miles to my total journey!

I therefore made enquiries of Tesla UK about a Mennekes II connector, which was not available last year at all. There are dozens of these charge points now, especially since Ecotricity started expanding their network, and Tesla were pleased to provide me with a quote: Only £930!!! How much??

That is almost 40% of the cost of an HPC and seems totally excessive to me. I suggested a trade in of my (next to useless) 'Universal' Connector, but they turned that down too.

So much for low cost charging!

richardean412 | 6 juillet 2013

A continued effort by all Tesla Roadster owners who have been left out of the Freedom to Travel(Supercharger Stations), promotions advertized by Tesla to promote the sell of the Tesla Model S,
we need to use the social media tools,such as Facebook,Twitter and even U-Tube to make our point to Tesla Motors.

Imagine if U will a U-Tube video of a Tesla Roadster pulling up to a Supercharger station, owner standing outside of his/her Roadster with charging cord in hand and no recepticle to plug into, calling for a tow truck through the Tesla roadside service help number.
We need our charging needs( once promised by Tesla to Roadster buyers) to go viral to the media and public in order to get Tesla's attention.
Complaining on this Tesla limited web site will not prompt Tesla to provide a relativity cheap solution to this Freedom of Charging problem.
Tesla monitors our forums knowing that in most cases the complaints never go anywhere and eventually ends without Tesla having to act !
Tesla responded very quickly when a negitive report surfaced through the media concerning the Model S falling short on its journey and being towed to next charging station.
Tesla was right to respond to the misleading report and so are we, the Roadster owners.
Consider all the news stories picked up by ABC,NBC,CBS and CNN which originated through a U-Tube video.

So let us unite in our efforts to right this wrong.I live south of Houston,Texas, is anyone up for the task.
We can share ideas through personnal e-mails if necessary.
richardean412@verizon.net

Thanks,
Richard Thompson

Brian H | 6 juillet 2013

Since the Roadster can't use DC power to charge in the first place, exactly what are you demanding?

richardean412 | 6 juillet 2013

Hello Brian H.,
Recently I made a trip to Austin,Tx. from League City,Tx.(south Of Houston Tx, Total miles approx.200.
I drove in our (gasoline) Lexus, not sure of access to any charging stations of 50amps or more. There were a couple of Chargepoint Level 2, 30amps along the way, but time was a factor, so I could not take the Roadster.
But, while I was in Austin, I paid a visit to the Austin Tesla Service Center with the question of; In the future could a Tesla Roadster owner use the 70 amp or 50 amp Nema 14-50 receptacle to charge a Roadster during shop hours was entertained and discussed.
The manager of the service was very helpful and understands our charging concerns on the open highways between Austin to Houston/ Dallas or Houston to Dallas/Austin and the fact that most hotels do not have charging stations in their parking garages.

Suprisingly the service center had their hp 70 amp & 50 amp removed from the location and re-located to the Domain shoping center parking garage on the second floor with 24 hour access to all Tesla owners.
Any Tesla owner Roadster or Model S can now charge 24/7 at the Domain with access to a Nema 14-50amp , 70 amp or Model S charging connector.A total of three receptacles, one Nema 14-50 for Roadsters, one 70amp for Roadster and with proper pigtail converts to Model S and one connector Model S only.
So therefore what solution I am asking for is basicily the same approach for the Supercharge stations nation-wide.
The area is marked for Tesla only midway on 2nd. floor.

This is the same approch Tesla could incorporate at all Supercharger Stations nationwide,not a costly improvement.

Its a workable solution Brian , proven in Austin ,Texas.
Thanks,
Richard Thompson

Brian H | 7 juillet 2013

That's excellent. FWIW, I agree that every SC station should have a Roadster HPC setup "on the side".

richardean412 | 14 juillet 2013

Thanks to each of U who responded by personnal e-mails.
We are now in the process of creating our first authenic Roadster video showing a Tesla Roadster owner, with connector in hand and unable to charge at a Tesla Supercharging Station. Simply because there is no HP 70 AMP or Nema 14-50 recepticle available to connect to: Tesla's Model S charging only.

Updates on UTube video availibility comming soon !

DHrivnak | 16 juillet 2013

Good luck. I agree it would be relatively inexpensive and great PR to add a 70 amp plug to supercharging stations. Or even 80 amps so J-1772 so a Roadster or a Model S can use it. I agree it would be difficult to add fast DC charging to a Roadster but please do not leave us totally out of the picture.

Brian H | 16 juillet 2013

Elon promised a nice surprise for Roadster owners in the new year (2014). Wait for it.

richardean412 | 18 juillet 2013

OK Brian H.,
What info do U base that comment on?
I, as with most Roadster owners are only wanting the FREEDOM 2 CHARGE equal to Model S owners and as stated in the early years of Tesla to Roadster owners.
We are willing to wait, but do not leave us out & stranded without charging rights.
I have not picked up on any headlines indicating a surprise in the works for Roadster owners.
Do U have a link to that news article ?
Thanks for replying and UR ideas.
Willing to wait !
R.Thompson

DarrellH | 18 juillet 2013

As Brian H said, Elon did promise a nice surprise for Roadster owners in 2014 when he was at the Teslive conference put on by the Tesla Motors Club.

ppape | 20 juillet 2013

http://new.livestream.com/teslamotorsclub/teslive2013

Go down to the video with Elon on the front. First Leilani speaks, then Elon.

J.

ChrisH | 22 juillet 2013

I can only echo the desire to charge my roadster at the stations. As a very early owner (102), I did expect a better solution after the S became successful. We already had to live through the plug issues.
I don't want to have to get rid of my roadster for an S.
Maybe there will be an electronics upgrade in the future??

Brian H | 22 juillet 2013

Almost impossible to allow the Roadsters to use DC charging. IMO the best solution is simply to put an HPC at every station.

defmonk | 22 juillet 2013

I get the frustration, but is long distance travel really the use case for a roadster (of any type)? Not much space for luggage, not that comfortable for long drives. I'm sure some folks want to do it. Me, I'd much rather do it in a sedan.

bent | 29 juillet 2013

I love taking my Roadster on a 500km leg in summer (as the one I recently came back from, racking up 2,000km in total over 2 weeks). Cruising around in a Roadster in Oslo in the summer sun is absolutely priceless. I would love even more being able to take it farther still. (Sweden, Denmark, even Germany or France maybe.)

The most inconvenient part of that atm is having to lug around the big (no, huge!) 230V/30A charging cable+box as it takes up a substantial portion of my already quite meager cargo space. And I won't even be able to use that at all outside of Norway which makes international trips very fiddly.

An HPC on each super charger would be absolutely ideal, and I can't imagine it would be fantastically expensive* to install them. We wants pretty please. :-)

I can tell that my car is a little unhappy about having to hang around gas guzzlers while charging at 32A outlets on gas stations (although it's too polite to say so itself), just imagine how much happier it would be cooling it out with its younger Model S cousins at a Tesla station instead! Oh the tales it could tell them. ("Back in my day there weren't these newfangled super charging thingamajigs, we had to battle through slush and mud to get to a lowly domestic 10A …" yeah you get the idea.)

* Of course, anything at all that involves not my money is easily going to be "not fantastically expensive", but still …

DHrivnak | 29 juillet 2013

Possible WIN, WIN WIN??

I really like the idea of a adding a Model S HPC and then selling Roadster owners an adapter can, and I am 99% sure the Roadster will work just fine pulling it's maximum 70 amps.

Tesla wins as they obtain some great PR at virtually no cost by supporting Roadster owners as an adapter could pay for the installs. This will likely help them move the CPO's as well.

Model S owners win as those who plan on charging for more than 60 minutes can use the slower HPC and not block a more expensive super charger slot. I have read a number of posts where people plug in and then go see a movie blocking others.

Roadster owners win by making roadtrips possible up from the current very-painful.

Say an adapter costs $250, actual manufacting costs but then Tesla sells them for say $1000. The extra mark up covers the cost of the HPC's and power. If 1/3 of the Roadster onwers buy it, Tesla's "take" is ($750 * 600 =) $450,000. The Model S HPC cost $1200 so I am sure Tesla's cost is less than $1000. Add $500 to install as an extra set of breakers and #6 wire is not that much extra with all the other owrk for a total cost of $1500. The $450,000 would cover 300 such installs more than the number of expected Superchargers.

I am 99% certain the communication is standard J-1772 as both cars work with J-1772 with simple adapters. So it would just be a simple pass through plug. This keeps out non-Teslas from using the new service.

Let me know what you think?

Brian H | 29 juillet 2013

I think you may have sussed the "nice surprise" Elon is going to spring next year.

DHrivnak | 29 juillet 2013

I wish that were the case. But my guess is if it were they would be already adding the Model S HPC to the Superchargers as the time to do that is as you are running the wire and have the groudn torn up. While building the cost of another circuit is trivial. But after the building stops then you need to call the crew and pull additonal permits which I am sure more than doubles the cost.

Brian H | 30 juillet 2013

Model S - HPWC
Roadster - HPC

richardean412 | 10 août 2013

Brian H.,
Are U an employee of Tesla or a proud owner of a Tesla vehicle ?
U seem to b more active and frequent in commenting about concerns reguarding Tesla Roadsters and Model S, than most other individuals in the forum.
UR comments normally lean in support of Tesla.

Just curious, what R the last 4 digits of UR VIN ?

Please do not take my comments and questions as an expression of disapproval to UR input,but are they objective, without bias.

vin 1125
RThompson

bent | 10 août 2013

Nobody is without bias.

Brian H | 10 août 2013

Supporter since '09. May get in on GenIII.

richardean412 | 11 août 2013

Brian H,
I enjoy the enthusiam U bring to the forum with UR ideas & comments.
I was just curious if U R a Tesla employee following the comments of owners & the general public as many companies do on a regular basis.
Please continue and hope to see UR VIN in 2014 or sooner.
I myself will sell our Lexus RX3 when the Model X arrives in 2014 and end our use of gasoline/oil in our household.
Thanks,
RThompson

telsayu | 13 août 2013

Looking into pre-owned Roadster, but no charging station would be the ultimate bummer.

richardean412 | 17 août 2013

One more Reason why Tesla sales department & Elon should re-think the SuperCharger Installations nationwide and how these stations should accommodate all models of Tesal Motors.
Tesla is selling the remaining dealer Roadsters,(loaners & preowned from trade-ins)presently and should consider the negative effect of a Roadster being exempt from charging at SuperCharging stations, not to mention how this decision of providing a charging station only for Model S will affect the resale of any Roadsters owned by the first 2150 worldwide origional owners who may be trying to sell their Roadsters and supported Tesla from the beginning,the individuals who help make the rollout of Model S possible.
Not being able to charge at a Tesla SuperCharging station will definitely hurt the re-sale of Roadsters and projects a bad image of Tesla Motors.

Brian H | 18 août 2013

A supplementary HPC would be nice, but Roadsters can't do DC charging. They can never use 'Supercharging'. Ever.

bent | 18 août 2013

The very best one might hope for regarding super charging of the Roadster is probably a new battery pack design in a few years when replacement packs start being needed. If they take the trouble of designing a whole new pack then they might be able to do one that can be super charged.

But even that is very optimistic imo. The Roadster is essentially a concept car that saw a limited production run: People who buy one should be aware of this and not expect too much in the way of receiving running updates for it. Perhaps if Tesla has been super successful in the mean time and doing a new pack design is peanuts compared to their trillions of dollars of annual revenue ... I'll not be holding my breath.

I'd be quite happy with HPCs on the Tesla stations myself, in fact it won't be much of a Tesla station without one the way I see it. But I am sure I already said that. :-)

MichaelN | 18 août 2013

Wouldn't a simple inverter do the trick DC to AC - I realize there would be some loss, but built into one charging post doesn't seem like to big a bother for Tesla - I would expect that Tesla will listen and come out with something that works - most likely a back burner item because most all the Roadster owners have something worked out already, just not as convenient - Imam told about a roadster network - does anyone know how to find information the Roadster network that is built along the west coast?

DHrivnak | 19 août 2013

A "simple" inverter will not work as one is talking about a LOT of power. As for the west coast network I think is is small and you can find stations on PlugShare.

mdemetri | 21 août 2013

@richardean412

First let me say as a Model S owner, I thank you and every other Roadster owner. You are the true early adopters and I am quite confident that I would not be enjoying my Model S without the Roadster pioneers.

Thus, I completely agree with you and others on this thread: Tesla needs to honor the early adopters and add Roadster charging capabilities at SC sites. I suspect that they will do something but if they do not, I will lose a lot of respect for the company.

scotty2541 | 26 août 2013

Me too.

I didn't buy any adapter, just the HPC I mounted in my garage. Good thing because my local service center can't even charge my car. They only support S's.

I can't use the car for a road trip because there is no place to stop for a charge. Even it it was a 3 or 4 hour charge, I'd still be willing to do it.

And think for the publicity for Tesla. The S looks almost like any other car. But in my Roadster I have people take pictures almost *every* time I go for a drive in my city.

I don't expect a 30 minute DC high energy fill up like the S. But if one of those HPC's like the one I bought was available, it would be great.

Scott #1277.

bent | 27 août 2013

scotty2541: There's a 240V/30A charge cable (with a big box on it) you can get. It takes up a bit of your trunk space but lets you put in ~40km of range per hour of charging. It's what I use for road trips and while it doesn't make them comfortable at least they are now possible. Can't tell you where you'll find 240V/30A (or 32A) outlets in your region though.

kent | 3 septembre 2013

I would purchase the CAN from Henry Martin instead. Compact perfect adapter to allow the Roadster to charge at any J1772 station.

https://sites.google.com/site/thecantesla2j1772/

DTsea | 5 septembre 2013

60 kWh Model S owners pay $2000 extra for supercharger, and 85kWh owners eat that in the battery pack cost.

I bet if 400-500 Roadster owners got together and offered to each pay Tesla $500 (my guess at cost of a NEMA 14-50 plug) Tesla might be willing to add a 14-50 at each supercharger.

richardean412 | 7 septembre 2013

Gentlemen and Tesla Roadster owners,I just received an e-mail from the Tesla Senior Regional Sales Manger for Norht America, Ben Kanner, inviteing Model S owners and others interested in a test drive to share in the grand opening of the Waco,Texas Supercharging Sation on September 10,2013.
Mr. Kanner did state that their is limited charging connections and that Tesla expects a large number of Model S vehicles,so expect to wait in order to charge.
I am presently attempting to contact him through the Tesla # 1-888-518-3752, but as of 8-6-2013 have not heard back in response to my message concerning my attendence of the event.
I intend to drive my Roadster to Waco,Tx, and can only hope the SuperCharging station will accomodate my Roadster with a HPC or Nema 14-50 as in Austin,Tx. at the Domain shopping center setup.
If not, I will just have to call Tesla for a tow truck to transport My Roadster to the nearest Chargepoint or Blink Tech. Level 2 charging station which is 30AMPS.
I live south of Houston so as I drive out to Hwy. 290 towards Waco, I will stop at the Gallery and top off my batteries at the(2) HPC(70 AMP) Tesla charging station in the parking garage.

If I connect with Mr. Kanner prior to my departure on Monday, hopefully he will provide me with more information on charging accomodations at the Waco Supercharging Station.
I would hope to see other Roadster owners at the Waco Grand opening.
Thanks,
Richard Thompson
#1125

hasse | 8 septembre 2013

How much do you have to tear out to offer a Roadster SC retrofit?

Sean | 12 septembre 2013

Tesla just announced a pan-European Supercharger network, and as a London-based Roadster owner (Euro vin#0021) I suddenly become more interested, and then of course disappointed to learn that Roadsters can't (yet?) supercharge.

Elon often advocates going back to the underlying physics rather than looking at what the world does today, and I think that applies in this case. The battery pack gets charged with DC which comes from either rectifying up to 17kW of 240V mains or from up to 50kW regenerated by the motor. If the PEM can successfully manage up to 50kW of highly variable power from the motor then I'm sure it can handle, say, 50kW of nice stable DC from a Supercharger (it can handle 200kW in the other direction).

The existing external power connector on the power may need to be changed, or a DC connector might need to be added, perhaps under the trunk lid next to the PEM.

I suspect that the limiting factor for Roadster charging is heat dissipation, from the batteries or PEM or both. I guess the two fans at the front can dissipate perhaps 5kW between them, depending on outside temperature, so if charging is 90% efficient or better then 50kW charging would be achievable.

So, if I were a betting man I would wager that Elon's "2014 surprise" is an upgrade kit, supplied and fitted by Tesla, that enables DC supercharging. DC connector, cabling to PEM, software upgrade, perhaps an upgraded coolant pump. Maybe in the $1500-$2500 range, but that's just wild guesswork :)

cheers
Sean

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