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Why Tesla has not came out with a replacement battery program for the older models?

Why Tesla has not came out with a replacement battery program for the older models?

The obvious reason is probably they want the older problematic models to be removed from the market?

If true, i think getting rid of the older classic Model S model from the market will be a big mistake and hurt Tesla's image.

Many early adopters have taken good care of their Model S and i think keeping them on the road in Public's eyes can only promote market confidence in Tesla seeing that those early models are still holding up well. Personally, i feel my 2013 Model S rides as comfortable or even more comfortable than the new models during my loaner experience with the 2019 Model s 75 and 2016 90D. i could be wrong, but the newer models with the facelift feel like a lighter car; the older models have a more solid feel.

It would be a shame if Tesla does not come out with an affordable battery replacement program for the early adopters in order to force us to turn in those older cars for newer models.

Bighorn | 15 Janvier 2020

Most are still under warranty. They are replaced for warranted failure or in case of accidents, primarily. But conspiracies are always exciting and fit some people's world view. Batteries were tentatively listed recently in the parts catalog, if that news was overlooked.

TeslaTap.com | 15 Janvier 2020

I wasn't aware there was any difficulty in having a battery replaced. Batteries are still being replaced under warranty for rare cases where they fail.

Now, it rarely makes financial sense on a 8+ year-old out of warranty car that is worth less than the battery cost. The used car market is harsh too, and might not even consider a new battery in the value of the car. The same holds for a new ICE engine in a 150K mile car. It rarely makes financial sense.

Bighorn | 15 Janvier 2020

Looks like the new 85kWh battery has quite a bit more range as well.
https://electrek.co/2020/01/14/tesla-new-85-kwh-pack-for-the-model-s-but/

jordanrichard | 15 Janvier 2020

I think people are getting ahead of themselves here. We don’t know what the cost is of this new pack to be installed in one’s car.

I have never been one to look at repair cost vs the value of a car. Everyone agrees that cars are not investments, yet everyone starts treating them like they are, when looking at repair costs. If a car is worth $3,000 and needs $4,000 in repairs to bring it back up to par, people will say hell no. So they go out and buy a new car, ending up spending more than the $4K to fix their previous car. Even if they bought another version of their previous car, used, then they will end up starting all over again, whereas had they just spent the money to fix their previous car, they know the repair history of the car.

GoldAK47 | 16 Janvier 2020

They could offer a refurb and new version with warranty on both. It would drive the market up on used cars, and create so much more value on the cars.

My biggest hope is, they keep the same platform and make the newer cars batteries work with the older models. if not, that will kill the used ones and the resale value.

MARION.MONDOR | 16 Janvier 2020

I love my Model S but service is TERRIBLE!!! I have left several messages without a return call. I have had the error message "12V Battery needs service or replacement soon" for 3 weeks now. I'm afraid I will be stranded. A couple of other forums stated that this error is common for older Model S cars and that they were left stranded from 1 week to 6 weeks after seeing the alert. I immediately made an appointment and service sent me a text message stating that the 12V betteries are on back order. Something needs to be done! Even if replacing it with something similar, albiet more expensive, I would be willing to pay for the replacement. I'M TIRED OF LEAVING MESSAGES TO GET ANSWERS TO WHEN MY 12V BATTERY WILL BE REPLACED!! WILL SOMEBODY PLEASE CONTACT ME??!!

PrescottRichard | 16 Janvier 2020

2020 will be the first year for battery warrantees to end, right? For 2012 Model Ss? Maybe that’s where that 85 will come into play.

FWIW- I had a problem with the HV battery in a 2013 P85 just over a year ago and they swapped it out with a refurb which was of similar rated range. This has happened to plenty of owners at no cost.

Earl and Nagin ... | 16 Janvier 2020

I have a 2008 model Roadster. it has the first generation of Tesla battery. Its showing maybe 10 - 15% degradation from new. I have no plans on replacing its battery any time soon as it still works just fine. Some folks have upgraded to the Roadster 70 battery but most that I know of are still doing fine with the original batteries.
This means that, other than a few infant mortality issues as @BH and @TT mentioned above, there currently is no serious market yet for normal replacement batteries.
Tesla does seem to recognize the value that keeping old cars running has for wary potential new customers.
What I really hope, however, is that there is a plan for reuse of the batteries in energy storage since a 50 kWhr Roadster pack with only 75% of its original capacity is still a 37 kWhr battery.

mikefa | 16 Janvier 2020

No doubt Telsa has improved its car batteries over the past 7 years. They need to offer affordable battery replacement or battery upgrade programs for early adopters since there are no aftermarket HV batteries for Tesla Model S.

GoldAK47 | 17 Janvier 2020

@ Earl
Eh, consider yourself lucky. Im on a 2 month old refurb and its not even great. Power is way down because 4 banks cave under power. Its going to fail early, without question. Dont get me wrong, it drives, it has decent power, but if you are under 75% charge the first 4 modules will drop to 2.7v per cell where the others are at 3.6v. So, it looks like the refurb has 4 modules of really tired cells. This first pack failed as well. People dont understand these batteries, they seem to only look at degradation numbers. The more important thing is to watch the voltages under load. .

TeslaTap.com | 17 Janvier 2020

@mikefa - What some feel is affordable is quite different from another. I expect for the next 5 years, replacement packs will be in the $12K to 18K range for the same size pack as the original. Sort of hard to justify for an 8-12% range improvement.

There also has been a desire by some to get a larger pack. So far Tesla is not shown any interest in offering that. It may even be problematic, as the car is certified for a specific weight with regulators. Not what regulatory issues Tesla might get in offering such an upgrade that comes with more weight and changes the EPA numbers. Now there is nothing to limit individuals from doing it themselves, perhaps with a donor battery from a totaled car.

PrescottRichard | 17 Janvier 2020

TT- Is there more to adding a longer range battery than just the actual battery? That is, if I moved from a 90 to a 100 would there be wiring and other bits that would have to be beefier? Maybe that isn’t the best example because 90 to 100 doesn’t sound huge, but say 60 to 100 is more dramatic, how about that? I’m guessing software could protect some of the systems or motors that weren’t designed to handle a bigger battery pack.

Personally I’d be happy with a battery tech that didn’t mind cold & hot temps so much, more efficiency that way would be great too even at the same kWh.

GoldAK47 | 17 Janvier 2020

You could go from a 60 to a 100, it needs programming though.

PrescottRichard | 17 Janvier 2020

GoldAK47- Without any additional hardware changes? That would be nice at some point in the future!

TeslaTap.com | 17 Janvier 2020

The early 60s used the same wiring and connectors as the 85. When the 100 came out, my understanding is Tesla did make quite a few changes, including a new power connector to the pack, new plumbing for coolant, and redesign of the cabling. I'm sure with enough effort, time and money an old car could be retrofitted to the new pack, but it may add another $3-5K in costs, a WAG on my part. I'm less sure about the 90 pack if it used the new connectors and other changes or was closer to the 85 in design - I suspect closer to the 85.

As Gold points out, changing the battery size is going to need some internal software settings changed that are very difficult for non-Tesla people to get too. Doubtful if Tesla would help on this either unless they did the pack replacement.

kevincwong | 17 Janvier 2020

Personally I would rather the vehicle and battery be purchased, warrantied, and insured separately. This would lower the cost of BEV, establish a real cost for the battery (it seems to be all over the map based on people's out of warranty posts), would reduce the anxiety of prospective EV buyers, and creates a risk pool where the burden of an unwarranteed battery replacement cost would be reduced by the contributions from those who didn't get a dud.

I'm sure there are negatives to such a system, but I always think about it when you hear about Tesla owners claiming $17K for a refurbed 60kWh out of warranty battery pack.

jordanrichard | 17 Janvier 2020

You can not just jump from a 60 to a 100 pack and think all it needs is a software update. That's like thinking you can simple go from an in-line 6 to a V8 with 100 more horsepower and not have to change out the transmission to handle the new power load. The 100's have different fuses and wiring. A 60 or even my 85 are literally not wired to handle 150 kw of charging like the new 100's are.

Bighorn | 17 Janvier 2020

Jason Hughes does updates with bigger batteries in Hickory, NC. Several outfits have followed suit.

GoldAK47 | 17 Janvier 2020

@jordanrichard
Not really the case here, its just a few pieces that need upgrading. Teslatap kinda summed it up

Earl and Nagin ... | 17 Janvier 2020

@GoldAK47,
I would consider your situation to be "infant mortality". Clearly, you got some bad stuff.