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I need Supercharger understanding

I need Supercharger understanding

I wish this forum had a "search" then I wouldn't have to ask a question that probably has been asked 100 times.

When a Supercharger's max charging rate is 75Kw or 150 or ???, how does one estimate how many "miles" will be loaded into the batteries, say for 1/2 hour or and hour or even 15 minutes of charging?

hokiegir1 | 16 Janvier 2020

Honestly, I don't try to do the math myself. I use ABRP (abetterrouteplanner.com) and it tells me when to plug in and for how long, with starting and stopping percentages. If I'm already on the trip, I just plug in and see what it says. It will say something like "632 miles per hour....15 minutes needed to continue on your trip" and the mph changes as the charging tapers.

I'm sure there are people who can and do do the math themselves, though.

JimShaw | 16 Janvier 2020

I see. Plug in, the car will tell me how much/how long to charge to reach the destination

This will be my first trip and first time to use a Supercharger. I'm a little nervous.

hokiegir1 | 16 Janvier 2020

Yup! As long as you have a destination entered, it will tell you how long to charge. I generally include a larger buffer because I drive faster (80-85 mph), and this time of year, you need to plan for heater use in most places as well. If possible, leave yourself about 25-35% on arrival. If it's telling you to charge to over 90% to arrive, see if there is another supercharger on the way and enter that as your destination instead. Sometimes it will plan for fewer but longer stops, and I typically prefer shorter but more frequent ones.

hokiegir1 | 16 Janvier 2020

**Note- the 25-35% buffer is because you are a first-timer. As you get used to your cars' range and the trip planning, you can adjust this downward. Some really experienced people allow down to 5%.

vmulla | 16 Janvier 2020

I never estimated that number in 4+yrs of Tesla ownership. I didn't need to.
If you're really strapped for time, you plug in and check how you're doing on the app - walk to the car and drive out when you have enough charge.

My answer may seem too simple, and I may come across as someone who doesn't get the question - but from my experience, you will not need to estimate charge added in a certain time window.

gparrot | 16 Janvier 2020

As hokiegir1 said, if you live in a cold climate keep in mind you’ll be using power to keep warm. So give yourself plenty of leeway. Personally, I don’t pay attention to what the car says, I charge to 85% most every time unless I’m close to home.
Good luck with the guesstimations.

FISHEV | 16 Janvier 2020

"When a Supercharger's max charging rate is 75Kw or 150 or ???, how does one estimate how many "miles" will be loaded into the batteries, say for 1/2 hour or and hour or even 15 minutes of charging?"

it tells you on the charging screen what the miles per hour of charging is...rule of thumb is 50kW/200mph. On the screen shot below you see it is charging at 133kW which is 542mph of charging, numbers are all right there.

https://imgur.com/LlyiPtk

So apps like TeslaFi.com and StatsApp keep track of your charging so you see how rates vary in different charging sessions.

Bighorn | 16 Janvier 2020

The charging rate is constantly changing, so there’s no exact figuring short of being a savant. Like others have said, it’s superfluous given the car’s assistance when traveling.

landoncube | 16 Janvier 2020

Since you mentioned searching the forum, you can enter this into your browser:

site:forums.tesla.com (your search terms)

FISHEV | 16 Janvier 2020

"The charging rate is constantly changing, so there’s no exact figuring short of being a savant."

https://imgur.com/LlyiPtk
44kW/180mph = 0.2444444

https://imgur.com/LlyiPtk
133kW/542mph = 0.2453874

Bighorn | 16 Janvier 2020

Idiot

jallred | 16 Janvier 2020

When Tesla sees the light and starts using projected range, then we will all start to see different mph charging rates. That will be fun.

Frank99 | 16 Janvier 2020

Unfortunately, your question doesn't have a simple answer.

If you get to a 120kw Supercharger, and most of the spaces are in use, you'll end up sharing power with someone already charging - so you may see anywhere from 30kw to 120kw when you initially plug in. Note that the amount of power going to your car will go up over time as the other car's state of charge goes up and it's charge rate goes down.

Tesla is starting to roll out V3 Superchargers, with 250 kw charging capability. They'll go from 10-50% in about 12 minutes, but they'll slow down after that, eventually charging at the same rate as the older versions as the battery fills - https://cleantechnica.com/2019/06/24/tesla-model-3-on-supercharger-v3-ad...

Your car will also charge at different rates depending on it's state of charge (how "full" it is). Between about 10% and 50% SOC, you'll be able to get the maximum charge rate available. As the battery gets charged above 50%, it'll start slowing down the charge rate - if you're really bored some day, set your car to charge to 100% at the SC. Going from 90-100% may take as long as the entire rest of your charge.

Your charging speed will also depend on the temperature - if you're driving in below-freezing temps, the car will need to heat the battery up before it will be able to charge at full rate. If you're using navigation, and the SC is on your route, the car will start heating the battery if necessary well before you get to the SC so you won't see the delay.

All that said, my M3 LR RWD reaches about 500 miles of range added per hour of charging while it's in the 10-50% SOC range in warm temps. (Yes, "MPH" in the USA or "KPH" for the rest of the world can mean both speed as well as how fast the car is charging. ) This only lasts for about 20 minutes, adding about 160 miles of range (very approximately). If my battery was at 75% SOC, the same 20 minutes might only add 50 miles of range (a WAG).

It's good to have a rough estimate in mind; the car will tell you if you're using navigation ("charge for 20 minutes, then continue"), or you can use an online tool. You'll quickly learn to guesstimate yourself - once you know what you're hooked up to.

Frank99 | 16 Janvier 2020

Nota Bene: FishEV is a long time member of this forum under various pseudonyms. His contributions to this forum are generally indistinguishable from those of a troll paid by anti-Tesla interests to cause consternation here, so it's best to ignore him as much as possible.

jallred | 16 Janvier 2020

On the last trip we took, the car charged before the show we watched ended.

Frank99 | 16 Janvier 2020

jallred -
I've noticed that - what good is NetFlix if a 45 minute episode of "The Expanse" is only half over when you've got sufficient charge to continue on your journey? ;)
(Note to the humor impaired: Yes, I know NetFlix is only available if the car is connected to WiFi, and most SC's don't have WiFi, but roll with me here...)

spuzzz123 | 16 Janvier 2020

With nobody parking next to me, low soc, warm weather 140kw charger goes above 600 mph. As bighorn states takes a savant to be more precise.

FISHEV | 16 Janvier 2020

"NetFlix if a 45 minute episode of "The Expanse""

I thought Amazon purchased all the rights to The Expanse for Amazon Prime Video?

mike | 16 Janvier 2020

"I've noticed that - what good is NetFlix if a 45 minute episode of "The Expanse" is only half over when you've got sufficient charge to continue on your journey? ;)
(Note to the humor impaired: Yes, I know NetFlix is only available if the car is connected to WiFi, and most SC's don't have WiFi, but roll with me here...)"

Grandson had spent the night and we arrived at father's work to have him picked up pretty early. We were at least 10 miles from home (wifi) and we were able to watch a Netflix movie while we waited. I assumed that we were using LTE since the car was not connected to wifi.

Bighorn | 16 Janvier 2020

There's a complex tapering of charging speed, as mentioned above, which makes the calculation beyond the realm of most without a TI-84.

@Frank
Get Hulu and watch Letterkenny instead. Netflix doesn't require Wifi, btw.

FISHEV | 16 Janvier 2020

Another point is to make sure you use Tesla Naviation to the Super Chargers in cold weather. This will activate Preconditioning and you will get an alert about this probably 10-20 miles before you get to the SC.

Preconditioning will warm up the battery so that the charging rate is optimized. A cold battery cannot charge as fast no matter what rate is available.

If you show up to SC with cold battery, rate of charge will be reduced until battery gets to optimum temp for charging.

As others have pointed out SuperChargers can be crowded which lowers the rate of charge. The charging rate is also slowed down as battery is charged.

https://insideevs.com/news/349267/video-tesla-model-3-supercharging-v2-1...

Patronus | 16 Janvier 2020

This forum is indeed searchable. In a Google search type (without quotes): "'search item' site:forums.tesla.com"

Patronus | 16 Janvier 2020

This forum is indeed searchable. In a Google search type (without quotes): "'search item' site:forums.tesla.com"

gmr6415 | 16 Janvier 2020

Just plug your destination into your navigator. It will give you all the information you need. It will also automatically start on route battery warming as you approach the next supercharger listed in the navigator.

FISHEV | 16 Janvier 2020

"When Tesla sees the light and starts using projected range, then we will all start to see different mph charging rates."

You can see charging effects on your Projected (actual) range in the car's Energy graph. While the graph does not move when the car is not moving the Projected Range number will update as you charge. I always have that up if I'm in for a quick get home charge as Projected Range will tell me how much charge I need to get home.

gmr6415 | 16 Janvier 2020

@vmulla +1000

jallred | 16 Janvier 2020

I've moved my car twice while waiting for food at a restaurant.

Every one in the family prefers stopping every couple of hours max. Tesla does a great job of placing SC near the highway and near places that we enjoy visiting while charging.

JimShaw | 16 Janvier 2020

I really thank all you guys and gals

A lot of info. I will now read all again and click the links to see what is there

A BIG thanks to all of you

JimShaw | 16 Janvier 2020

I started reading one of the Posts from an above link and read "Tesla is ruining family time" That was because her Tesla charged too fast to get her fast food for the kids

Funny

teslamazing | 16 Janvier 2020

Damn every thread getting hijacked by fish. Dude needs to calm tf down.

spuzzz123 | 16 Janvier 2020

He’s just doing his job (Literally). cut him some slack.

vmulla | 16 Janvier 2020

@JimShaw,
I'm glad that the forum got you started off on the right foot. Hey, just remember the real difference between ICE and Teslas show up only on longer road trips (5hrs+). Travel time on Teslas is about 20% more, but it much more enjoyable - you'll need to experience it to understand it. If your road trips are with kids Tesla travel will change your idea of a road trip.

kevin_rf | 16 Janvier 2020

Use the simple rule, plug in, flip back to the nav where it shows you your expected percent battery remaining at your next waypoint and unplug when it shows you arriving with a 20-25% buffer. A little more in the winter, a little less in the summer.

Btw. I find the stops typically last 20-30 minutes. Except at 75kw Urban chargers. I avoid them at all costs. You can click on the charger icon in the nav and it will show you how busy it is and how much power it can put out. 75kw (sucks), 120kw (older ones that can't be upgraded), 150kw (majority, 600 miles an hour), or if you find a unicorn 250kw, 1000 miles an hour.

It takes a few trips to get use to it. The other thing is about a cold battery if you can. It's better to supercharger at the end of the trip when the battery is warm than to hit one cold as you start your trip back home after cold soaking overnight. Plan a significant amount of time in the penalty box.

jfaubl | 17 Janvier 2020

The car will tell you when to charge. It will be faster than you think. A short bathroom break will add a lot of miles. It does depend upon your starting charge. I like this video https://insideevs.com/news/349267/video-tesla-model-3-supercharging-v2-1...

Does it really add time when the trip is over 5 hours? Doing a college trip over spring break for my son. One long segment to get to the next school of 9 hours. I figure a stop for lunch and bathroom breaks will be needed and I'll just charge then and it won't be longer.

vmulla | 17 Janvier 2020

"Does it really add time when the trip is over 5 hours? " @jfaubl

--
It does and it doesn't. It really depends on how you're traveling. We do our longer trips at night while we take turns sleeping/driving - so yes the charging stops would add some time when compared to an ICE. But again, we wouldn't do that kind of travel on anything other than a Tesla.
The point I was trying to make when I said it was about 20% extra travel time in a Tesla is to really set the expectations - more road time, but vastly more enjoyable road trips.
If there's a better way to set that expectation I'd be happy to adopt it :)

Effopec | 17 Janvier 2020

The only thing to worry about is your backing in skills. Those cables are damn short. I used to have to reposition my car every few times I've stopped, but I've learned that you need to bias towards the drivers side and back all the way in.

kevin_rf | 17 Janvier 2020

Effopec, agreed I feel you basically have to kiss the charger stall with your back bumper.

Bighorn | 17 Janvier 2020

Elon's original P85+ had a bashed in rear bumper presumably from hitting a pedestal.

vmulla | 17 Janvier 2020

I expect special markings near the SC stalls to allow for easy autoparking in the future. Just drive up and the car will give you option to autopark for charging. I was convinced that the Tesla T markings were for that purpose - now I'm not as convinced :)

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi | 17 Janvier 2020

You guys are scaring me. If you have problems with backing up in to the parking spot I don't want to be near you when you parallel park.

vmulla | 17 Janvier 2020

WW_spb | January 17, 2020
You guys are scaring me. If you have problems with backing up in to the parking spot I don't want to be near you when you parallel park.
---
Maybe someone can back into you and then claim it was you who probably had unintended acceleration and crashed into them :))

FISHEV | 18 Janvier 2020

"I expect special markings near the SC stalls to allow for easy autoparking in the future."

Does humanity have that much time for Tesla's to be trying to self park backwards? Tesla has installed additional curbing as people are damaging the chargers (and their cars) back into them. One is demolished and taped off at Woodburn SC.

Everyone else is going with easier, faster, safer pull in parking for charging, putting the port on front of the car not the rear. It was odd Musk went with traditional "fuel port" on an EV instead of rethinking that for EV.s. The front port that other EV's use is better design.

There's one pull in vs. back in stall at Vancouver and that is the most popular because it is so easy.

Tesla has some pull throughs which are

Magic 8 Ball | 18 Janvier 2020

FISHEV is evil

Bighorn | 18 Janvier 2020

@jallred
Probably should have led with this pre-emptive quote:

"That’s when backing into a parking space is the best option – even if the vehicle is equipped with such safety technology as rear cross-traffic alert systems, AAA said."

jallred | 18 Janvier 2020

I was thinking that others would read it. Jack probably wouldn’t because that would be a lot of work. If he didn’t read it he wouldn’t reply.

Big_Ed | 18 Janvier 2020

Not an old charging veteran, but the SC near me has wheel blocks that prevent you from backing in too far. Go til the wheels hit the bump and you are within reach of the cable. Is that not a thing everywhere?

vmulla | 18 Janvier 2020

@Big_Ed,
No, it’s not there everywhere.
Besides it's something else to ignore the camera, the distance sensors, and general awareness to back into a charger. Tesla can only do so much ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

jallred | 18 Janvier 2020

I’ve only been to about a dozen sc in Maryland, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Ohio and Michigan. But the ones I’ve been two have had wheel blocks to back up to.

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