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Supercharging ISSUES by ICE vehicles continue to worsen in some area

Supercharging ISSUES by ICE vehicles continue to worsen in some area

WHY SHOULD MODEL S OWNERS SUFFER!

After hearing these horror stories time and time again and in all parts of the country.
Tesla should act on this NOW!

Why Tesla owners should be unconvinced by ICE's drivers for even one minute is beyond me!

An easy fix for now and future stalls should have a gate that can be controled and lifted upon a Model S or X approach to a Super Charger Stall. The technology that Tesla processes, we could control the gate lift with our system in the vehicle (much like a garage opener) or even if we have to leave the vehicle to open the gate, with a Tesla card opener. After all we must be outside the vehicle to plug in the supercharge cord.

This would take a resign of the stalls but it seems this problem is only getting worst and worst and if traffic tickets are not accessibly then another deterrent should be put into place immediately.

Grey Model S85 | 8 mars 2015

What do you mean by "Tesla drivers should be unconvinced" LOL!

Putting a gate at the SC stations would be too expensive.

The solution is to bring a pad of paper and a pen and leaving a rather stern note on the offending car's windshield saying they are parking illegally and the police are on their way.
Also, if possible, try to somehow still charge your car by blocking the ICE car access.
That will teach them!

Larry@SoCal | 8 mars 2015

The gate is a good idea. I would like to see the Supercharger areas fenced and gated. This would stop ICE entirely.
.
Security is an issue that is not being addressed; the carjacking and robbery at Barstow demonstrates the need for a secure area.
~Larry

jp158 | 8 mars 2015

Really!

Tell that one to Model S owners who have tried that! and please be aware that Police are not responding to these situations..... Pulling up to a super charger and having a ICE parked in the stall is problem, I don't think Tesla counted on these situations before building the stalls as they currently sit now...

and maybe not all stalls have these situations only the problem ones that have been identified especially in CT.

Beats writing a stern note and think that a ICE who just parked in a stall identified with Tesla Charging would care! and what if the owner arrives and you get into an altercation... Tesla has stated in the past just notify Tesla, however that doesn't seem to be working! .... Gates on stalls is one answer...

Mike83 | 8 mars 2015

I have yet to experience the problems discussed here for the last year visiting over 20 SCs.

benemac | 8 mars 2015

Here's a classic example. The business location at Cordes Lakes, AZ told this group to park in these spots. They took 4 spots because one van parked over the line taking an additional spot. He did offer to move, but we were able to park at the end. Had another Tesla shown up, I would have told the drivers that they needed to move now. And there were at least 10 parking spots open opposite of this row. Tesla was already contacted and they said it was up to the proprietor to enforce. We need some laws changed.

I couldn't figure out how to post the pic except linking, so here goes.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10203604435811829&set=a.36719785...

Solarwind | 8 mars 2015

If you can get a ticket (and go to jail) for parking illegal on the street, why not for illegal parking at tesla chargers? Just need to get it into law and enforced.

TeoTeslaFan | 8 mars 2015

There is already a law in Washington State but it can't be enforced at superchargers because Tesla decided not to display the required signage. Without that sign, legally superchargers don't qualify as charging stations and the existing law can't be enforced.

Tesla is making deals with hosts. Part of the deal is ICE cars can park there. When I wrote that Tesla is doing this wrong, fanboys at TMC (the other Tesla forum) were not happy. It was one of the two topics that got me banned. Here is that topic:

http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/33051-Teo-Takes-Tesla-To-T...

We have lots of fanboys here too. The fanboy mentality is "Tesla is always right." Therefore I wouldn't be surprised if fanboys argued this problem doesn't exist.

Before you ask Tesla to put gates, it might be a good idea to ask them put those two signs that is shown in that topic so the existing law can be enforced at least in states where they have those laws.

I also recommend taking pictures of ICED superchargers and sending them to news blogs. If this issue gets some media coverage, Tesla will fix it. That's what happened in the past with many issues.

The bigger problem here is perception. If a supercharger station is fine 99% of time but fully iced 1% of time, that creates charge anxiety. It means when you travel long distance with your family, you are going to worry that it might be ICED. Another problem is, it creates conflict risks. With all the road rage killings in the US, is it really necessary for Tesla to allow ICE cars park there? It would take only one bad incident to ruin the reputation of superchargers and Tesla.

When people call Tesla to complain, Tesla says "it's up to the hosts, we can't do anything." However superchargers have Tesla branding on them. Anything bad that happens at superchargers will affect Tesla's reputation.

I'm not a Tesla owner and I'm not from the US. This problem doesn't affect me the slightest. I did some research on this issue because I was surprised when I realized how bad Tesla manages this issue.

Brian H | 8 mars 2015

The spaces are not Tesla owned or leased, but shared and allowed by the landowner. Tesla has no authority to tow, block or reduce overall parking availability in most cases.

daniel.rowe | 9 mars 2015

I love the ideas of the supercharging stations but the history of people would suggest this is but the beginning of these problems...I'm not buying a Tesla with the intent that I'll ever use a supercharging station. I hail Elon as a visionary but if these aren't done on a more massive scale, there's really no point until everyone one else buys in..

Boukman | 9 mars 2015

I agree that this problem will probably get worsens more and more supercharger locations are open. Tesla has to address the situation by making sure the owner of the location will enforce a "no parking" rule to keep the SC stalls free of parking poachers. If the problem is not addressed, it's just a matter of time before frustration gets the better of somebody and something nasty happens. Nobody wants that. Tesla should put pressure on these locations owners to address the situation asap. In fact it should be part of the agreement to install SC's in an area. Posting ticketing and towing signs might deter some people, but actually doing it will definitely get their attention...

grega | 9 mars 2015

If they can't enforce a no-parking rule, it would be useful to put some other rule in place.

"Not charging?
Leave your number.

If there are no other places to park we understand you may need to park here. Please leave your number on your dash so that a car that needs to charge can contact you and find out when you'll return."

That message would stop most people.
(I know, it has issues.... just brainstorming :) )

Grinnin'.VA | 9 mars 2015

@ Brian H | March 8, 2015

The spaces are not Tesla owned or leased, but shared and allowed by the landowner. Tesla has no authority to tow, block or reduce overall parking availability in most cases.

This is true in many places.
However, in most places, there is no legal basis preventing Tesla from including restrictions on the use of SC stalls, including the authority to tow violators. Indeed, IMO that's what needs to happen to eliminate ICEing SC stalls as a practical problem.

Grinnin'.VA | 9 mars 2015

All Tesla needs to do is to establish SCs only at sites with owners that are willing to impose such restrictions.

Have you ever heard of BEVs blocking access to gasoline pumps? What do you think would happen if you tried that with a Tesla MS?

Boukman | 10 mars 2015

Perhaps Tesla needs to review the design of the SC's to mimic that of the gasoline pump. Grega mentions "If there are no other places to park we understand you may need to park here", to me there in lies the problem. The mindset is wrong. People are thinking of these spaces as parking spaces where you can recharge your car while they should be thought as recharging stations just like gas pumps. I would take what Grinning says "Have you ever heard of BEVs blocking access to gasoline pumps?" a bit further. At a rest/refueling area, have you ever seen a car parked in front of a gas pump? Nobody would ever think of doing such a thing, why is it easy for people to do it for EV's charging stalls? Changing the design to recreate the look and feel of a gas station could help people realize that this is not a parking spot...and get them into a different mindset...

sbeggs | 10 mars 2015

Great point, @Boukman.

stuart | 10 mars 2015

There is a well known way to handle these issues, but it may not be legal in every locality. With the permission of the landowner if necessary, you post a sign saying "Tesla Charger Parking Only, Tow Away Zone" and include whatever legal niceties are required. Contract with a towing company to enforce it. That costs Tesla nothing. The towing company is paid by the owner who has parked without permission. They have an incentive to enforce the rule.

The enforcement will be much simpler than it would be at an office or shop where unauthorized vehicles may be towed since it may be difficult to prove the car owner had not visited the shop or office at some point. In the case of a Supercharger the car is either a Tesla or it isn't. Not easy to change that.

TeoTeslaFan | 10 mars 2015

Going from "no signage at superchargers" to towing seems extreme. What happened to the steps in between? The first thing Tesla should do is to add these tarmac signs:

The idea is to communicate information with international symbols like the disabled parking symbol:

Whoever is responsible of the superchargers needs to understand that the name "Tesla" doesn't somehow magically transform into "This is an EV charging spot therefore I shouldn't park here" in people's minds. This is how many superchargers look:

An ICED supercharger:

This is how some people see them:

Quote: I was charging on a trip at Vacaville when a lady came up to park at the SC. I went to confront her but nicely. She thought the big cables were a vacuum cleaner. Source

finman100 | 10 mars 2015

I'm going to go ahead and go for the low-hanging fruit here... that vacuum story sucks...

TeoTeslaFan | 10 mars 2015

Here is the correct link to the vacuum cleaner story reported by forum member Mike83:

http://my.teslamotors.com/forum/forums/just-confronted-someone-who-iced-...

SamO | 11 mars 2015

I have to say that these threads always make me laugh because rarely do you find anyone who has actually been iced. This thread is much the same in that there is sound and fury signifying nothing.

Having actually visited more than 60 superchargers and living in the most densely populated supercharging location in Southern California my actual experience may vary with the theoretical experiences both nonowners and actual owners who don't spend much time at a supercharger.

1. 99.9% of the time there is no ice car parked in a tesla spot.

2. Most people have never seen a tesla let alone any EV charging so there missteps are usually out of ignorance not malice.

3. Tesla has an almost sure fire foolproof method for preventing internal combustion engine cars from occupying supercharging spots

This is the culver city supercharger with signage posted stating that the spots are for EV charging and the parking spaces are painted red with a giant tesla emblem.

No gates.

No bollards.

No knife fights in the parking lot.

Some signs and buckets of red paint and (imaginary) problem solved.

SamO | 11 mars 2015
Larry@SoCal | 11 mars 2015

Yes, painting the stalls is a great idea. An inexpensive solution and should be begun at every site. Just as with handicap, the EV parking needs credibility.
~Larry

Grinnin'.VA | 11 mars 2015

@ SamO | March 11, 2015

... these threads always make me laugh because rarely do you find anyone who has actually been iced.

Sam, what you've experienced is a very lightly used startup SC system. Your experience is NOT what we should expect in 2016 and beyond. By then there will be very many more Teslas on road trips relying on SCs for charging.

Just one example of recent history of SCs. Last fall Tesla installed an 8-stall SC in Topeka, KS in a place convenient to I-70 travelers and several businesses. My brother-in-law who lives about 3 miles from this SC took quite a few pictures of it during the construction and some after it opened. Of course, it was very lightly used. Why? At that time, traveling east on I-70 the next SC was in Ohio, over 500 miles away. Since then, Tesla has installed SCs near Kansas City, Indianapolis, Dayton, OH, and Columbus, OH. They are in the process of putting SCs in St. Louis and Effingham, IL. When that string of SCs is open for business, I'd expect a lot more Teslas using I-70 on road trips between the eastern and western parts of the U.S. And the use of the Topeka, KS SC will increase quite a bit. If Tesla thought otherwise, they would have built this SC with 4 stalls instead of 8.

I just got my S85D this week. No way in hell would I take it on a road trip to visit my brother-in-law in Topeka, KS, driving from my home in Fairfax, VA until there is a robust SC string from Ohio to Kansas on I-70. IMO, my 'theoretical analysis' of SC growth and usage is a hell of a lot more reliable than your experience using SCs in 2013 and 2014.

There is a simple reason that you didn't see me at one of your many SC visits in the past: I didn't yet have an MS then. And I'll venture an outlandish forecast: More than 10,000 new Tesla cars will be sold in the U.S. in 2015; many of them will visit SCs on road trips.

SamO | 11 mars 2015

@Grinnin'

Your fear and anxiety are internally generated and not a product of Tesla's business model.

You dismiss my experience in the area with the busiest Superchargers, most cars sold and most local drivers out of hand.

You dismiss Bighorn who has has not had any ICEing problems with over 200 Supercharger visits.

Is it hypothetically possible Tesla will slow construction of Superchargers below demand: yes.

Is it likely: NOT EVEN A BIT.

My experience AND my analysis based upon cars sold, density of sales and density of the network tells me that you need to do a bit more "analysis" and a bit less "handwaving".

Show your work and I'll consider changing my mind.

Captain_Zap | 11 mars 2015

Why blame Tesla and waste time complaining about this in a forum?

Be a good citizen and take it up with your government and get some laws in place. Start a citizen's initiative if your government is slow to act.

All they have to do is copy the laws that are in place in Washington State. Our State laws include how the property owner must properly paint the charging station stalls. (Red would not be appropriate.) Fines have been established. Officers will ticket.

Grinnin'.VA | 11 mars 2015

@ SamO | March 11, 2015

@Grinnin'

Your fear and anxiety are internally generated and not a product of Tesla's business model.

I did NOT generate this thread or submit any reports of seeing ICEing. Other MS owners did that. I'm still in my first week of owning an S85D, and I haven't yet visited an SC. That will change.

... you need to do a bit more "analysis" and a bit less "handwaving".

Show your work and I'll consider changing my mind.

Possibly you missed my previous posts on the subject. Taking you at your word, here goes:

I made a spreadsheet to estimate the number of SCs needed and their costs based on the number of SC-compatible cars on the road and various other assumptions:

* SC Fee Up Front: $2,000
* SC Uses per Month per Car: 3
* Avg Charge Time (min): 50 -- paired stalls both in use for busy periods
* kWh per Charge: 50
* Electricity Cost / kWh: $0.10
* Days per Mo: 30
* Peak Day/Avg Day: 2, meaning that busy days see twice as much SC ues as average days
*

Grinnin'.VA | 11 mars 2015

Sorry, but I hit the wrong button. My SC assumptions continue:

* Users on Peak Day: 18.0%
* Busy Hours per Day: 10.0 -- 1/10 of SC use on busy day in peak hour
* Stalls/SC Site: 8
* Capital Cost/Stall: $30,000
* Operational Cost/Stall/Yr: $1,000
* Average utilization of SC capacity in busy hour on busy day: 66.7%

Basic Results from M/M/m Queuing Theory:

* Average Waiting for an available stall: 3.3 minutes.
* Probability User Must Wait for service in busy hour on busy day: 22%
* The SC system should about pay for itself, provided SC stalls are NOT used for any purpose other than SC charging during the busy hours on busy days. (Moderate ICEing would require more SC capacity to avoid significant increases in waiting for SC charging service, costing more than $2000 per car.)

OK, SamO, it's your turn. Please critique my assumptions or methods and tell us about the details of your analysis.

BTW, I can provide technical detail and/or explanations for my analysis if/as desired.

Captain_Zap | 11 mars 2015

No horror stories here.

There are thousands of Model S cars in the region, but not many cars are doing the 150+ mile intercity trips routinely. I doubt that there has ever been a wait for a Supercharger within 1000 miles in any direction.

SamO | 11 mars 2015

@Grinnin',

1. ICEing NOW

You wrote "Your experience is NOT what we should expect in 2016 and beyond."

But then you wrote "I did NOT generate this thread or submit any reports of seeing ICEing. Other MS owners did that. "

So which is it? We have an ICEing problem or NOT. I say NOT.

Have I run into ICEing?

Yes. Especially right after Culver City was complete but before the red paint went in, the week before Christmas. Since then, I haven't seen a single ICE car there.

Anecdotal? YES.

Consistent with other heavy users reports? CLEARLY.

So we agree that there is NO ICEING PROBLEM in March 2015.

2. You then make a claim that there will be waits based on queueing theory. This is FAR DIFFERENT THAN ICEING. But, I've noted your assumptions and mine are in [BLOCKS].

* SC Fee Up Front: $2,000 [YES]
* SC Uses per Month per Car: 3 [1-2]
* Avg Charge Time (min): 50 -- paired stalls both in use for busy periods [ACTUAL AVERAGE TIME SPENT IS 28 MINUTES. SEE SUPERCHARGER DASHBOARD PHOTOS]
* kWh per Charge: 50 [45. SEE SUPERCHARGER DASHBOARD PHOTOS]
* Electricity Cost / kWh: $0.10 [OK, BUT WHAT ABOUT THE BATTERIES AND SOLAR INSTALLED AND BEING INSTALLED]
* Days per Mo: 30 [OK]
* Peak Day/Avg Day: 2, meaning that busy days see twice as much SC ues as average days [OK]
* Users on Peak Day: 18.0% [MORE LIKE 5-10%]
* Busy Hours per Day: 10.0 -- 1/10 of SC use on busy day in peak hour [OK BUT I SUSPECT IT'S LESS WITHOUT SPECIFIC EVIDENCE]
* Stalls/SC Site: 8 [OK]
* Capital Cost/Stall: $30,000 [ELON WAS QUOTED AT $150,000 BUT . . .OK]
* Operational Cost/Stall/Yr: $1,000 [OK]
* Average utilization of SC capacity in busy hour on busy day: 66.7% [10% SYSTEM WIDE UTILIZATION MAX]

Take a look at some photos from the Hawthorne Supercharger Dashboard where they've been posting utilization stats for the past 18 months and which is where they show time spent charging and amount of electricity per car delivered.

Here are some images that might help in your research:

https://www.google.com/search?q=tesla+supercharger+dashboard&safe=off&es...

Brian H | 12 mars 2015

SamO;
The $30K was meant per stall, and the $150K per station, which would work out to average 5 stalls per station.

SamO | 12 mars 2015

@brianH,

But grinnin' assumes 8 stalls making the price $240,000.

Red Sage ca us | 12 mars 2015

Inclusive and ubiquitous. Common.

NOT exclusive and rare. NOT Lordly.

There will be no 'gated communities' of Superchargers. Instead, Supercharger Stations may grow in time to be Tesla Depot/Waypoint locations with multiple Superchargers, along with HPWCs, set up to service the needs of EV travelers. With a lounge, gallery, lavatories, food court, and Service Center on hand. Possibly also a car wash and battery swap installation.

It would be open to the public, twenty-four hours a day, and ICE owners would be welcome to stop by... Either by accident or to satiate curiosity. But there would be no sales of gasoline, diesel, alcohol, tobacco, or firearms & ammunition on the premises. No need to scare people off when you can use the opportunity to educate them about the glory of electric cars.

AmpedRealtor | 12 mars 2015

Tesla is at the mercy of the property owners. Tesla cannot dictate policy to someone who is doing Tesla a big favor by allowing Superchargers on their property. The easiest and lowest cost solution is to improve the visibility of signage and pavement markings. Tesla will not be installing gates or any of that kind of stuff in parking spaces. That's just silly.

Larry@SoCal | 12 mars 2015

I am suggesting a gated, fenced area because of the ICEing and also for security.
A Tesla driver was robbed of his car and possessions in Barstow. The Ft Tejon Supercharger continues to be papered by Jehovah's Witnesses. Security needs to be addressed in some way.
~Larry

sorka95032 | 12 mars 2015

Tesla seems to have several different stall configurations.

1) Chargers are at the back of the stall.
2) Chargers are on the side of the stall half way back.
3) Chargers are on the side of the stall at the front.

2 and 3 will allow a Tesla to double park an ICE which I wouldn't hesitate to do in a heartbeat even if it meant I had to sit there for 20 minutes waiting for my fuel.

Tesla should avoid configuration problem 1 wherever it can.

Perhaps cones can be put in the stalls and Tesla owners know they can remove them and put them back when they leave. Most of the time, an ICE isn't going to go through the hassle of getting out of there car to remove a cone when the could park elsewhere.

BTW, the first time a Tesla gets towed for double parking an ICE, that will be a media s*%) storm.

Is there an extension cable that would work with the SC that could be kept in the rear bin for ICE storms to help with configuration 1 above?

Grinnin'.VA | 13 mars 2015

@ SamO | March 11, 2015

@Grinnin',
You wrote "Your experience is NOT what we should expect in 2016 and beyond."
But then you wrote "I did NOT generate this thread or submit any reports of seeing ICEing. Other MS owners did that. "
So which is it? We have an ICEing problem or NOT. I say NOT.

You seem to think there is something inconsistent in my statements. Please reread them. There is no inconsistency! OTHERS have reported IECing.

Have I run into ICEing?
Yes. Especially right after Culver City was complete but before the red paint went in, the week before Christmas. Since then, I haven't seen a single ICE car there.

That's pretty much what I'd expect.

So we agree that there is NO ICEING PROBLEM in March 2015.

Others disagree with you. BTW, you just disagreed with yourself. (Please reread above.)

You then make a claim that there will be waits based on queueing theory. This is FAR DIFFERENT THAN ICEING.

My previous post explicitly addressed this. I built a queuing model without ICEing. That's a best-case model. And I said that the results would be worse with ICEing. I don't have credible data describing the amount of ICEing to expect. If I had such data, I'd build a model with queuing and ICEing.

But, I've noted your assumptions and mine are in [BLOCKS].

* SC Uses per Month per Car: 3 [1-2]

My estimate amounts to about 5000 miles on the road per year per car. I read a report that Tesla owners are driving about one-third of their annual miles on road trips.

* Avg Charge Time (min): 50 -- paired stalls both in use for busy periods [ACTUAL AVERAGE TIME SPENT IS 28 MINUTES. SEE SUPERCHARGER DASHBOARD PHOTOS]

The Supercharger page says SCs provide about 170 miles charging in "as little as 30 minutes". That is for charging at maximum of 120 kW, which can work ONLY when charging a stall with its paired stall NOT in use. Under heavy load, I expect that most of the stalls to be in use most of the time. In that situation, the maximum charge rate is 67.5 kW. Then I'd guess that it would take closer to an hour to get a 170-mile charge. Anyway, at the maximum of 120 kW, an SC could deliver 56 kWh in 28 minutes. At roughly 3 miles per kWh, that would give a range of about 168 miles. That's the best it can get with the current MS and SC.

My experience is limited to one visit to an SC. I arrived with 188 miles showing on my charging screen. One of eight stalls was occupied. Of course, I selected one of the stalls that wasn't paired with that stall. I charged up to 221 range miles. That's 33 miles; it took 13 minutes. That's 2.54 miles per minute. At that rate, 150 miles should take about an hour. Since, the batteries charge faster when they are run down to a more typical level for SC charging, I'd estimate that a typical 150-mile SC charge would take something between 30 and 40 minutes if the other stall of its pair weren't in use, but at least 50 minutes if the other stall of its pair were occupied. After review, I stick with my 50-minute charging time for typical MS cars charging at heavily used SCs. Can someone who has charged at a SC at a stall with another MS at its paired stall please tell us how long it took to charge some numbers of range miles?

* kWh per Charge: 50 [45. SEE SUPERCHARGER DASHBOARD PHOTOS]

Where will I find a "SUPERCHARGER DASHBOARD"?

* Electricity Cost / kWh: $0.10 [OK, BUT WHAT ABOUT THE BATTERIES AND SOLAR INSTALLED AND BEING INSTALLED]

At home I'm paying $0.12 per kWh. Solar isn't "free". What do you think it costs per kWh?

* Users on Peak Day: 18.0% [MORE LIKE 5-10%]

Please explain.

* Capital Cost/Stall: $30,000 [ELON WAS QUOTED AT $150,000 BUT . . .OK]

I'm assuming that Elon didn't include all of the costs of planning, negotiating with landlords, zoning, shipping and installing SC hardware and the associated management overhead involved.

* Average utilization of SC capacity in busy hour on busy day: 66.7% [10% SYSTEM WIDE UTILIZATION MAX]

I suspect that you don't understand this assumption. It's a basic driver in calculating how many SCs are neeeded to support any given number of cars. It means that SC capacity can be planned to have 66.7% of the stalls in use during peak periods without unduly/adversely affecting the performance goals. Queuing calculations tell us to expect about 78% chance of an arriving car finding an open stall to use without waiting to charge. And overall average waiting for an unused stall would be about 3.3 minutes. Do you consider such peak-hour, busy-day SC service OK? (I do.)

If I had used your 10% number, it would dramatically increase the numbers of SCs "needed" and the costs of the system. Please confirm if you'd like to see an update of my results with that change.

Thanks for your response.

mysimplename | 13 mars 2015

Samo,

You are forgetting that elsewhere in North America, with the exception of Connecticut which has SC's every ten miles at one point, ridiculous, most SC stations are at least a couple of hundred miles apart and getting ICED there would be a problem. You have no idea what getting ICED really means!

mysimplename | 13 mars 2015

Samo,

You are forgetting that elsewhere in North America, with the exception of Connecticut which has SC's every ten miles at one point, ridiculous, most SC stations are at least a couple of hundred miles apart and getting ICED there would be a problem. You have no idea what getting ICED really means!

mysimplename | 13 mars 2015

Teo,

Did you get reinstated at TMC?
What are you going to do about it?
Have you re applied? I know that once the fanboys ban you, you are done for life!
Good luck!

Brian H | 13 mars 2015

sorka;
re extension cords: See above. You couldn't lift or bend it, especially in the cold.

jp158 | 14 mars 2015

It's clear that some area's say they don't have situations and some do!

SO WHY WAIT!

Actions are needed to refrain the charging stations NOW.....
This is a situation that will only get worst with time.

Notes, blocking are not the answer!!!!!!!

A secure method of entering the SC is needed and let's not wait till some situation happens and an owner of a Tesla get injuried by some ICE'd fool parked in the stall and just waiting to get in an altercation.

Mr. Musk please address these issues NOW!

Thank you

mysimplename | 14 mars 2015

i can't wait to pull up to a SC station to find all slots blocked by ice vehicles.
I will happily try to prevent as many ICE vehicles from leaving as possible even if i can't charge myself! NOT!

Grinnin'.VA | 14 mars 2015

@ jp158 | March 14, 2015

SO WHY WAIT!
Actions are needed ...
Mr. Musk please address these issues NOW!

This is a serious issue.
Tesla has failed to recognize and address it.
If not addressed, it will be a serious problem.

@ mysimplename | March 14, 2015

I will happily try to prevent as many ICE vehicles from leaving as possible

See above.

IMO, pretending that ICEing isn't a serious issue threatens the viability of the SC system. Is anyone listening? Does anyone care?

SamO | 14 mars 2015

@Grinnin,

Nobody is listening because it isn't a serious issue.

Hand waving and crying don't make it any more real.

And neither does posting over and over about how it's GOING TO BE A PROBLEM some day.

It makes you seem like this:

jp158 | 15 mars 2015

Grinnin

GET REAL! cause it's real...

Grinnin'.VA | 16 mars 2015

@ SamO | March 14, 2015

@Grinnin,
Nobody is listening because it isn't a serious issue.

Can you refute a single claim that I ever made on this issue?
If so, PLEASE do.

Until then, you can expect me to continue to suggest that when there are many hundreds of thousands of Tesla cars on the road in the U.S., any significant incidence of ICEing would be very costly to Tesla.

PLEASE point out to us where I said ICEing had caused a significant problem for SC users. Others claimed that.

BTW, you are listening.

Finally, statements that "everybody" or "nobody" ... are virtually always FALSE.

SamO | 16 mars 2015

@Grinnin',

The only thing I refute is that you need to worry about what WILL happen in 2-4 years when "hundreds of thousands of Tesla cars are on the road."

Tesla has show that they have a process to scale.

Brian H | 16 mars 2015

But, but, but... it MIGHT be awful!

Remnant | 17 mars 2015

The charger should detect the non-Tesla vehicle and turn on a loud lecture about the unfairness of occupying a stall intended for charging Teslas, then urge the occupant to leave the stall promptly, then repeat the lecture and the appeal over an over until the non-Tesla complies.

THRΞΞ | 17 mars 2015

I have an idea...

A siren & flashing lights would go off within 90 seconds of pulling into a spot if someone doesn't plug in and/or if a Tesla key fob is not detected. Violators would be deterred, I would think.

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