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Negative comments

Negative comments

Some of the negative comments remind me of product reviews on Amazon. When you look closer at them they seem to be made up, then a few posts later someone has a totally positive experience. Something is odd.

Pg3ibew | 15 ottobre 2019

I am a Tesla addict. Getting my M3 this coming weekend. With that being said, I think your statement is a bit off. Because there are totally positive reviews, does not mean that there can not be negative reviews.
I do understand about negative trolls and all that Jazz.
But, I am sure there are real people out there, that have had negative experiences with Tesla cars.

vmulla | 15 ottobre 2019

It's all about context.
Don't take any comment at face value, dig a little deeper and you'll often see there's more to it.

Magic 8 Ball | 15 ottobre 2019

This forum does have its regular negative commentators. Several have definite agendas and they are not trying to help Tesla.

spuzzz123 | 15 ottobre 2019

@Pg3 if you frequent these forums you will begin to discern the users which are lodging legitimate complaints versus bogus ones. There are 3-4 regular posters who complain every day about any and every feature. Some are more subtle than others and will occasionally post what looks like a positive enthusiastic comment but ends up being nothing complimentary about their Tesla. Like “I love being able to charge at home!” Or “I’m excited to be getting my chademo adaptor!” Then when they get the conversation going will turn south on Tesla. “2 supercharger stalls out of order, thank god for electrify America”. Unfortunately casual or newer forum visitors have a small sample don’t see the ad nauseum repetition that we see and dismiss.

Of course there are some true negative experiences. And those who have bad experiences often use the forums to vent. Most satisfied customers don’t frequent the forums.

coselectric | 15 ottobre 2019

My theory about the negative commenters is that, because this forum shows up in Google searches about Tesla vehicles, there are people with agendas who are strategically adding negative and/or misleading comments to seed search results.

It's just a theory, but the evidence to support this is that:

1. Some commenters seem to be OK with adding occasional positive comments. I suspect this it to perhaps build/maintain their credibility in the "community" and/or with Tesla's largely non-existent moderators.

2. The same commenters will dive-bomb into a discussion and take it off into left field with some negative or misleading comment that is only loosely related to the topic being discussed. These comments are usually vague, unprovable, lack citation and out of context.

3. The same commenters will often be lambasted - even flagged - by many of the pro-Tesla regulars here (myself included), but they won't necessarily stick around and defend their comments. And yet they also don't go away even after getting caught red-handed. THIS is the one thing that has baffled me, because normally when people comment frequently in a forum yet do not engage others in debate even when making negative comments, it seems fishy (FISHy) to me. It's as if these folks don't actually care about the debate but just want their comments recorded for some ulterior purpose? My guess: search engines.

foodking | 15 ottobre 2019

There's also the people that have had legitimate issues and knowing how they resolved them is important. M8B is usually there to vet them

Joshan | 15 ottobre 2019

The stock has been rising hard the last week. Every time the stock goes up the haters and stock shorters come out of the wood work.

Joshan | 15 ottobre 2019

It is pretty obvious who the trolls are. When you point out how to resolve their issue they refuse to accept anything anyone says. Someone who truly wants to resolve any issues works with people to find a solution and doesn't just stomp and cry like some well known posters here.

spuzzz123 | 15 ottobre 2019

Your theory is the only thing that makes any sense coslectric. Someone else suggested text mining algorithms that can provide quantitative scores for negative/positive trending. Perhaps trying to trick institutional investing models? Seems kind of desperate .... a whole lot of work required for something that may not even be effective.

PteRoy | 15 ottobre 2019

Lol you guys are funny. Not sure how hard it is to understand that someone spent a lot of money on something and are not happy with the product they received.

You spent a lot of money on something and are happy with the product you received. You praise. They vent. That’s how it works.

Either way, if there was no venting on this forum you guys would be really bored. I can see it now. SamO posts something followed by every comment saying “I agree”. The end.

Joshan | 15 ottobre 2019

PteRoy - not that simple. Many times people are clearly given the explanation/solution and they act like the explanation was never given as it does not fit their "agenda".

Half of the "complaints" are people who do not understand the technology or did not read the user manual.

karma01 | 15 ottobre 2019

I have vented a few times here as I love the car but the lack of customer service is something that bothers me. The things I've read through this forum is that the customer service varies from people to people and region. Some say that Tesla is the greatest while others say that they sucks due to lack of response. Some say their Service Center is great, while others have had bad experiences and treated like second class citizens. Tesla reps giving different answers to different people on issues (AC) or making it up as they go along. Where's the unified response and experience? Are these places franchises or what? I know there are people who trolls but there are legitimate concerns like paint, AC smell issues, body alignment, etc... Also the whole point of buying direct is to avoid the stress and shady car dealers but now face a different kind of issue like lack of response, delays, quality of workmanship, etc... We should critique them where they need to improve and praise them where they do well. We shouldn't sugercoat it. I don't mind being a beta tester in Tesla's technology but not in its customer service.

I also see similar things on Tesla Motor Club and Tesla Owner Online forum as well.

coselectric | 15 ottobre 2019

@PteRoy, so imagine that we're discussing this thread right now, and out of the blue I change the tone of my opinion and say something like "@PteRoy, I think you have a point. Tesla has never addressed design flaw X, and - while I love my car - I can understand that there are many people dissatisfied with the quality of the product because of that." That's the kind of behavior we're referring to.

I'm fine with people having legitimate gripes to discuss. But this feels different somehow, and we've been witnessing this behavior from certain individuals on this forum for many months now. To the casual observer, it's not something you can put your finger on. But the posts in question seem contrived to just casually introduce any one of a list of negative "talking points" into a discussion - often with no consistent context, and almost always with no meaningful follow-up discussion from the individuals in question after the negative point is introduced.

I'm not an internet mechanics expert, but I do know that many other forum engines somehow avoid being indexed by search engines. This is not one of them. When you consider that all of our discussion is being indexed by a search engine - and showing up often in the top 10 hits when you Google search a specific topic - it seems like this forum is an easy target for astroturfing.

Joshan | 15 ottobre 2019

It is also a case of "the boy who cried wolf".

There are many people here with legitimate issues,I do not think anyone is denying that at all. No car, product or company is perfect.

Now people with real issues get skepticism and doubt because of the fakers who posted before them with an agenda.

rxlawdude | 15 ottobre 2019

Definitely related to the TSLA price rally.

SamO | 15 ottobre 2019

Nobody agrees with me. I’m a radical who is shunned by polite society.

I prefer to punch trolls and point out the clowns. Nobody “likes” that guy, but they appreciate the heads-up.

coselectric | 15 ottobre 2019

And on that topic, if you Google TSLA right now, the top stories are:

- Tesla solar panels have become nightmare for some homeowners - Business Insider
- Tesla navigating land mines that zapped rivals - Fox Business (I think THIS one is actually positive? Maybe?)
- Cash-Strapped Tesla Unleashes Capital Outlay for Model 3 - Seeking Alpha
- Tesla Sales Stagnate, New Data Service Says - Barron's
- Tesla Numbers Show a Sudden Drop in August and September - Fortune
- Tesla: Uphill Battle in China - Seeking Alpha

Yeah, no stock manipulation being attempted here. Move along, nothing to see.

(And gosh, I thought I blocked Seeking Alpha from my search results... gotta recheck that).

coselectric | 15 ottobre 2019

(that was in response to @rxlawdude before @SamO snuck in)

lbowroom | 15 ottobre 2019

Its a machine

andy | 15 ottobre 2019

The car is fantastic, but I do also think it worth giving feedback on where the software can be improved. This is an owners’ forums after all.

karma01 | 15 ottobre 2019

@andy - I agree. Before I purchase my Model 3, I looked at the forums to see the potential issues I may face with.

leo33 | 15 ottobre 2019

@andy As do pretty much most folks on the forum. The problem is that constructive feedback is polluted with a such a flood of disingenuous anti-tesla FUD that it becomes difficult to identify and discuss the honest feedback.

TabascoGuy | 15 ottobre 2019

I'll admit it, I like you SamO and I do appreciate the heads-up.

If people are being honest, who doesn't enjoy seeing a clown punched?

SamO | 15 ottobre 2019

:-). You too Tabasco.

Funny story: my grandad never traveled anywhere without a small bottle of your namesake hot sauce in his breast pocket.

TabascoGuy | 15 ottobre 2019

That's awesome, gotta love people like that. I put one of those tiny bottles in my son's lunch now and then. They always come back empty so maybe I can talk him into the front pocket method for when I no longer pack them for him.

lbowroom | 15 ottobre 2019

They will turn the clown punching reference into a threat of physical violence and report it to Tesla.

Tronguy | 15 ottobre 2019

Just going to pile in a bit. The three or four regular FUDsters aren't really talking to get an answer; they're here to poison the well. They're trying to inveigle themselves with newbies who are here to find out what people think. For those of us who've been here for a while their antics have been rather spectacular: They own a Tesla, they don't own a Tesla, they've got solar power, no they don't; they don't know what sockpuppetry is; and so on.
And the threads they start.. when too many people point out the errors of their ways, they can (as any thread starter can do) and do delete those threads so they _won't_ show up on searches.
And, pretty much, the whole gang comes out and plays when the stock price goes up. There's been some discussion that these entities are beltway bandits, taking money for negative speech. And it's suspected that they've got the ability to create accounts, possibly by getting VIN numbers off of rentals, and then using those accounts to have Fun.
They don't play over at the Tesla Motors forum.. the forum masters over there have teeth and aren't afraid to ban people. Over here, it's a very light hand by the Tesla types so it's definitely more wild-west.

vmulla | 15 ottobre 2019

@Tronguy,
This is Tesla's problem to fix. Every Tesla enthusiast on the forum can try and put a band-Tronguy to this, but this isn't an easy problem to fix.

I have a half-baked solution, I know that it's not completely effective. But still...

For whatever junk is being shared, start an other thread with a title that clearly states the facts, keep the post rooted in facts with examples. Do not reply to the original polluted thread.

As a group keep the factual thread on the top. It really doesn't matter much whatever junk is repeated within the thread - keep the facts with a strong title showing first on the top.

Lot of us attempted this and it is not new, but there's no synced resistance to junk. I also get tempted to reply - and that's exactly what they seek, a reply to a thread with a damaging title.

The real solution has to come from Tesla.

Thoughts?

howard | 15 ottobre 2019

vmulla

The real solution has to come from Tesla.

Thoughts?

+1 forums@tesla.com is the appropriate place to voice your suggestions for a real solution.