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Bag of Spare Adapters?

Bag of Spare Adapters?

TM now has several adapters for sale. Is there much benefit to buying some or all of them to have on hand when out on the road?

jat | 13 maart 2013

The ATL service center has 10-30 and 14-30 adapters, so I am picking them up. My home-made 10-30 adapter was used once, and my 14-30 adapter was never used, but I had them available if I needed them before getting the real ones.

SJenkins | 13 maart 2013

I need an adapter for my generator to be able to charge the Tesla in the event of a power outage. It takes an L14-30 plug. I found this on Amazon - looks like it will do the trick (as long as I lower the charging amperage first):

http://www.amazon.com/Camco-55422-Female-Generator-Adapter/dp/B005BNZFQ0...

Any reason why this wouldn't work?

jat | 13 maart 2013

@SJenkins - I think that should be ok, though it says it is rated at 125V -- I would make sure that is just a typo (the L14-30 has two phases plus neutral and ground, so it should be ok) before ordering (and yes, you will need to manually lower the current to 24A).

Hills | 13 maart 2013

@jat,
you think the 20 feet mobile connector will usually reach other people's dryer outlet?

jat | 13 maart 2013

@Hills - yes, at least the two places I frequently travel to - YMMV.

shop | 13 maart 2013

@SJenkins - yes that should work. When you get it, test that each hot from the generator only goes to one hot on the 50A receptacle, but I can't imagine how else they would wire it.

Shesmyne2 | 13 maart 2013

@jat That should be, YWhMV :-)

Hills | 13 maart 2013

At the two houses that matter to me, I need 50 feet to reach the dryer outlet(s), which is why I have my 30 ft extension cord, 6 ft home made cord/plug/adapter, and 20 ft mobile connector.
Thus the Tesla adapters don't help me.

shop | 13 april 2013

So I was at a horse show today and looking around the exhibit grounds I found all sorts of power cables powering vendor RVs and the like. Always being on the lookout for new and exciting ways to charge my MS in an emergency, I looked at what kind of plugs they were using. It was one I had never seen before:

Turns out this isn't a NEMA plug at all, but a "California Style" 50A locking connector made by Hubble - a CS6365 in particular. I guess they are often used for temporary venue power since the connectors are in-line with each other and lock. It provides 120/240V at 50A, just like the NEMA 14-50 that most of us use. So making an adapter shouldn't be much of a problem. Anyways, throwing this out here as yet another plug to consider...

shop | 14 april 2013

And the TMC forums has yet another power source that you might run into - a marine ship to shore 50A 120/240V pluig called a NEMA SS2-50P. You can just a buy an adapter for this to adapt it to a NEMA 14-50 here:

http://cordtec.com/products.asp?id=852

Sudre_ | 15 april 2013

This reminds me of the reason why I thought all these expensive charge stations were a joke in the first place. Plugs already exist for every voltage and every amperage yet the car makers had to come up with their own totally new plug. I have no problem with Tesla because they offer adapters at reasonable prices. All other car makers want you to purchase a sold separately charger to have installed in your garage.
When you go camping with your Leaf I guess you are screwed as far as charging.

shop | 15 april 2013

Yeah, I couldn't believe it when I saw that other electric cars needed garage chargers. What for? All they do is give you a huge J1772 plug which is at a reduced amperage to what you can get with a 50 amp receptacle. Once again, Tesla out thinks the competition.

jat | 15 april 2013

@Sudre,shop - J1772 provides some additional safety measures that a regular outlet doesn't, and most importantly it has one connector that serves all the needs (and communicates how much current is available and negotiates with the car how much is desired) and is waterproof.

Sure, it is more expensive than it needs to be and I would have wished for some latching mechanism controlled by the car, but it is far better than most design-by-committee standards.

shop | 15 april 2013

As may be, but Tesla's ability to plug into any electrical socket with an appropriate adapter is a major, major win. J1772 for public chargers sure, but no need for home garages.

jat | 16 april 2013

@shop - all other plugin vehicles come with a mobile charger as well. Nissan's unit is designed for 120V/240V operation, though the firmware on US units restricts it to 120V operation. evseupgrade basically chops off the cord, puts an L5-20 plug/receptacle inline, and updates the firmware to support 240V operation. You can get other pigtails to use any of the plugs that people have made adapters for the Model S, just the same way. So, the only difference I see is that they used a standard connector that can also be used for public chargers instead of a proprietary connector.

HzSoGood | 16 april 2013

One more adapter q?
Would this work for older dryer plugs - looks like this is 10-30 to 14-50 (lower Amp warnings noted)
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003PY60J8/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF...

Still hunting for a ready-made 14-30 to 14-50 any recommendations for someone like me who doesn't want to make one?

jat | 16 april 2013

@EVbugs - no, that isn't a 10-30, it is a TT-30P (click on the image with the pin diagrams) and will not be usable with the Tesla regardless.

You aren't going to find people that sell a ready-made product for this, because it isn't safe in the general case. It is only safe in the specific case of the Model S, and then only if you manually dial down the current. If you don't want to make one, just buy the Tesla 10-30 and 14-30 adapters and be done with it.

shop | 16 april 2013

EVBugs - why not buy the Tesla 14-30 adapter?

http://shop.teslamotors.com/collections/model-s-charging-adapters/produc...

(Other than the fact that it shows sold out ... again. How hard is it to order a gazillion of these? What do they do, order 10 at a time from the manufacturer?)

Of course that will only work if your Tesla is within 20 feet of the 14-30 receptacle. If it isn't, then you need to make something of your own since no one makes NEMA 14-30 extension cords. My solution if that is your problem is to use a NEMA 14-50 extension cord (since those are available), and a home made 14-50 to 14-30 adapter. Look here for info on how to make these things:

http://cosmacelf.net/Home%20Made%20Adapters.pdf

Sudre_ | 18 april 2013

Does anyone know if the Model S can be charged on 277 or 480 single phase?

shop | 18 april 2013

I seem to remember the UMC being limited to 265V max.

shop | 18 april 2013

Actually the back of the UMC says 240V max. Uhm, why do you ask?

jat | 18 april 2013

@Sudre - not directly, you would have to use a transformer.

shop | 19 april 2013

Hey guys, I've updated my Home Made Adapters document to add a new adapter I found and to add a page of receptacle identification. If anyone runs into a different kind of receptacle that could be useful, post it here. Here's the revised doc.

http://cosmacelf.net/Home%20Made%20Adapters.pdf

thomas.schlatter | 19 april 2013

Anyone knows about adapters to be used in Europe and Switzerland?

gimp_dad | 19 april 2013

shop,

Your work is awesome as usual!

I also have the 6-20 which is not only used in AC units but also computer rooms.

Also, 10-50 which is the old style arc welder (50A) outlet. It looks a lot like the 10-30 dryer plug but has a straight neutral spade instead of the 'L' shaped one. I actually have this outlet at my cabin because the previous owner had an arc welder from before the 6-50 days. Allows me to charge at the same rate as 6-50 or 14-50 with UMC. At some point I will probably just change the outlet to 6-50 but it shows that it is a plug worth having for completeness sake.

There is also a 30A RV generator plug L5-30 (Camco 55333) which you can get as a single piece adapter to your TT-30 in case you ever come across a generator rather than an RV outlet. I have purchased a TT-30 to 14-50 adapter but haven't cut off the 14-50 yet to replace with my 6-50 female. Once I do that, I will use it for L5-30, TT-30, 5-15 and 5-20 using one piece adapters to the TT-30. This will just make it possible to not have to carry a 120V extension cord in addition to the 240V extension cord.

Where did you find the CS6365 plug? I have been using Cooper for my 6-50R (female) ends.

Thanks for sharing all your work with the rest of us. A little bit of work up front can come in handy when you really need a charge!

shop | 19 april 2013

@gimp_dad - what kind of 6-50 female did you use? An outlet box, or something that integrates directly with a cord? I just searched for "Cooper NEMA 6-50r" and came across this which looks nice:

http://www.mrsupply.com/cooper-wiring-devices-6-50r-straight-blade-conne...

I didn't need to make a CS6365 adapter since one comes ready made that terminates to a NEMA 14-50 end:

http://cordtec.com/products.asp?id=852

That's one of the nice things about using the NEMA 14-50 as your adapter receiver, it is a common enough plug that there exists ready made adapters for different plugs. On the other hand, the advantage of using the 6-50 is that the extension cord is lighter since it has one less conductor. Also, that female 6-50 end is sleeker than the Camco 14-50 receptacle.

I had heard that the 10-50 is used here and there - sometimes ovens got plugged into it. Where do you anticipate using your 6-20 adapter?

gimp_dad | 19 april 2013

That's exactly the Cooper device I used. I have several of them.

I have no problem with 14-50 receivers as I have a 14-50 to 6-50 pigtail I daisy chain to in order to hook to my 6-50 extension cord. I will buy the same pigtail. Cordtec is who I used for my Marine 50A to 14-50 pigtail.

gimp_dad | 19 april 2013

That link seems to go to a SS2-50P -> 14-50R adapter. I am hoping to find the cleanest simplest path to CS6365P -> 14-50R or 6-50R.

shop | 19 april 2013

Well, that Cordtec pigtail I referenced above works for both a marine 50A AND a CS6365 temporary power plug. So you may already have the the same pigtail. I doubt they have two so similar.

It turns out the marine NEMA SS2-50 and the CS6365 are almost identical, the only difference being that the CS6365 has a spike in the center. So Cordtec used a plug that works with both power sources.

gimp_dad | 19 april 2013

Excellent news. Glad it will work.

The CS6365 seems to be used by some generators that output in the range of 10kW. Finding one of those might be the easiest way to test the pigtail.

Sudre_ | 19 april 2013

The company I work for has a 480 volt three phase plug and cord temporary setups that we use on large construction jobs. It would not have been very difficult to create an adapter and charge at 277 or 480 single phase while at work. Carrying around a heavy transformer would be annoying.
I will be easier to just run a cord to the 240 volt spider box distribution center.

I haven't looked at the voltage rating on the UMC.... I figured someone here would know.

shop | 19 april 2013

That's why I was wondering. Anywhere you have 480volts, you are likely to have access to 240v. Let us know what kind of plug is on the 240v outlet on the spider box.

Sudre_ | 19 april 2013

That's easy. I have created the cords to go between the spider boxes many times. I have a few sitting around somewhere. I haven't felt the need to create the adapter yet.

leviton CS63-64C female end
http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-CS6364C-Industrial-California-Style-Black-...

male end
http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-CS6365C-Industrial-California-Style-Black-...

The disadvantage is usually we put around 5 spider boxes on one 50amp run. Charging the car on a spider box circuit would pretty much draw all the power on that branch.

spider box
http://www.amazon.com/Coleman-Cable-01972-3R-02-Temporary-Distribution/d...

jat | 19 april 2013

@gimp_dad - be careful with 10-50 outlets. At my grandmother's house (built in the '40s), it had a 10-50 receptacle for the dryer, but the fuse (and presumably wire) was rated only for 30A. So, be sure and check to make sure it really is a 50A circuit before drawing 40A on it.

gimp_dad | 19 april 2013

Yes. First thing I did was check that 1) it was a dedicated run, 2) it was a 50A circuit. Yes and yes. And it is about a 3 foot run to the panel so it is solid.

Of course all this means it would be exceedingly easy to make it into a 6-50 anyway....

shop | 19 april 2013

@Sudre - there you go, there's my temporary power plug, the CS6365 or CS6364. That ready made pigtail adapter I found is perfect for that as it adapts it to a NEMA 14-50. http://cordtec.com/products.asp?id=852

The guy who sells these from Cordtec just emailed me saying he's already received four orders "all from California" for these adapters in the day or so I've posted the link to that pigtail adapter.

We must have a bunch of boy scouts on this forum, "always be prepared!" :-)

Sudre_ | 20 april 2013

SWEET! thanks shop.

prytog | 21 april 2013

What's involved in converting a NEMA 10-50 to NEMA 6-50?

My Red MS85 will soon arrive. In the process of getting ready, to my surprise, I discovered a 40-amp breaker in the electrical panel labeled 'Welder'. I then scrounged around the garage and found a 10-50 wall plug only 4 feet from the panel.
The plug is labeled as 50 amps, but the breaker on the panel is for only 40.
From what I've read, installing a 6-50, with what I already have, will be the path of least resistance :)

I will have an electrician do the swap, but want to queue the work order correctly.

dortor | 21 april 2013

I would just swap the plug for 6-50 female - and then get the 6-50 adapter from Tesla…

also you could probably have the electrician look at the wire - if it's rated for 40 amps it might be no problem to upgrade to 50 amp circuit at the panel…even it the wire isn't rated for 50 amps a 4-6 foot run should be no problem for any electrician to handle and not too much money...

either way you'll be go to go and have at least a 40 amp circuit - which is good for 32 AMPs of charging happiness - which is 18-22 miles of range per-hour of charge.

dortor | 21 april 2013

or if you're going to pull wire - the run is so short - your panel might be able to handle 60, 80 or 100 AMP circuit and you could then get a HPWC - and have mucho charging lickity split…it all depends on how many circuits are already in your panel - but if you run is short you may be able to upgrade to a much bigger amp system and it shouldn't cost too much in terms of labor or parts (wire).

prytog | 21 april 2013

Thanks,
I did order twin chargers, but don't have a need for an HPWC at this location. I'll just request a)plug swap and b)upgrade to 50 amp circuit.

mcptwo | 22 april 2013

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8534/8671664825_19c9c353bf.jpg

This is a NEMA 14-50 to NEMA 10-30 adapter. I have used it successfully with our Model S. It allows you to plug your NEMA 14-50 into the old type dryer outlets. These are 30 amp circuits that must be limited to 24 amps in your car, or they will probably throw the breaker. Our Model S appeared to know this automatically and ste the charging rate to 24 amps.

I do not need this adapter and will send it postage paid to anyone in the US for $50.00

mcptwo@gmail.com

shop | 22 april 2013

In general you sure do have to set your car to charge at the lower 24amp rate when using an adapter like this. The car will default to charging at 40 amps if you use the tesla 14-50 adapter with this adapter.

prytog | 29 april 2013

Update: The existing 10-50 cabling only supported 40 amps. It was cheaper to install a new and separate 6-50 plug on the garage wall then rewire the 10-50. So now I have both a 10-50 40 amp plug and a 6-50 plug on separate breakers. My 6-50's installed with and extra conductor if I want to change to a 14-50. Probably won't as I've decided to go the 6-50 route as my main adapter. And will buy a 25' 50 amp Welders 6-50 extension cord for travel, and build a 14-50 to 6-50 adapter, for charging at RV parks and KOA; at least that's the plan.

I thought about buying one of these Hobart 14-50 to 6-50 adapters
http://www.amazon.com/Hobart-770674-Adapter-Cord/dp/B003J8NMF0/
, but
1. I could not verify how neutral and ground are wired, and
2. I can build one w/ 6-AWG instead of 8-AWG and use the Camco 14-50 plug which has more utility.
Homemade will be bulkier, but Tesla specific.

We are scheduled to receive our MS on 5/13 and counting down.

gimp_dad | 29 april 2013

Prytog,

I have that Hobart adapter. I "ohm'ed it out" with my multi-meter. Neutral is not connected as you would expect. It is each hot to corresponding hot and ground to ground. This is what you want. The reason it is sold by a name brand unlike many other pigtail variants is that it is a perfectly valid wiring. Nothing unexpected should happen as there is no ambiguity about what you have. You just lose neutral which means there is no way of getting 120V if plugged into an RV outlet through this pigtail.

prytog | 29 april 2013

gimp-dad
Thanks,
Maybe I'll just buy that Hobart 14-50 to 6-50 adapter and not build my own. (not going anywhere by motor until delivery 5/13)
Many moons ago, I own a multi-meter. I should probably get another. Any recommendations for a multi-meter, useful for Tesla MS owners?

jat | 30 april 2013

All you need is connectivity, so anything Radio Shack sells will be sufficient.

txjak | 30 april 2013

Search for a "continuity tester."

shop | 30 april 2013

By the way, Tesla is now selling a Roadster charger adapter for the Model S. While you can use it with any Model S, only ones with dual chargers will be able to take full advantage of the Roadster charger's 70 amp output.

gimp_dad | 30 april 2013

Shop, thanks for the notice. Just ordered it. My ridiculous obsession with Model S adapters will not allow me to pass this one up. I asked about it back in Aug when I got my car but they would only sell it to Roadster owners in those days.

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