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Saving our Oceans, thoughts?

Saving our Oceans, thoughts?

Hey everyone!!
I just got finished watching Blue Planet II on Netflix and it really shows you how much the earth is warming up and the effect it has on our Ocean life.

You know, I bought my Tesla Model 3 because I wanted to switch away from Gas cars, and I know it’s better for the environment so we don’t release some much emissions in the air.
But after watching this series on Netflix, I know that each and every Tesla and EV for that matter is helping reduce global warming and saving our planet.

What are your thoughts?

jimglas | 25 maart 2019

EV's are a small step. The elimination of all fossil fuels is mandatory unless we want to kill ourselves

RedShift | 25 maart 2019

Renwables are scaling and getting cheaper than coal. It’s a slow march in the USA because of all the disinformation campaign weighed by fossil fuel interests and their gullible followers. It’s inevitable that fossil fuels will dwindle down to bare minimums during this century.

Uncle Paul | 25 maart 2019

I believe the pollution in the air is almost insignificant compared to the amount of liquid and solid wastes flushed into the oceans every day from third world countries like Africa, China, India and the Soviet Union.

Maybe going after the wrong target, influenced by emotions.

El Mirio | 25 maart 2019

@Uncle Paul we do not have the luxury to tackle one problem at the time. The attitude to search and find worse problems to misdirect focus has been going on too long.

The best is to tie the major problems together and search solutions which tackle them simultaneously.

SCCRENDO | 25 maart 2019

@Uncle believes a lot of things that are just plain wrong

RedShift | 25 maart 2019

@uncle Paul

You are incorrect. First in the assertion that air pollution is somehow insignificant compared to other pollutants, and secondly, to bring up the favorite scapegoats of the conservative crowd. (‘Our shit doesn’t stink, but theirs does’)

I don’t know how you can assert the above without doing some basic googling. Please, go ahead, and see for yourself the footprint of developed and dveloping countries. I don’t deny that the developing world is increasing its footprint, but the developed world by and large still has the bigger footprint.

carlk | 25 maart 2019

@Uncle Paul Are you still living in the 20th century? Soviet Union no longer exists. Even back then Soviet Union and China belonged to the second world not the third world.

kcheng | 26 maart 2019

We're going to have to do alot more than buy Teslas to save the planet from climate change.

blue adept | 26 maart 2019

@Uncle Paul

Every time you take it upon yourself to type out something across the screen you reveal to us all just how ignorant you truly are...

You should do yourself the favor of doing a bit of research BEFORE you decide to grace us with your opinion.

Just saying.

blue adept | 26 maart 2019

@kcheng's got it right.

+1

Individuals swapping out their ICE transportation for that of an EV is a small step in the process towards mitigating, if not altogether eliminating, carbon emissions, but it is still a no less impactful step in the right direction.

NKYTA | 26 maart 2019

From previous posts I’ve seen, my guess is that @kcheng is more using the False Dichotomy/False Dilemma logical fallacy.

I’m not saying we need to do a ton more, but it strikes me funny/sad, coming from him.

Why bother! :-/

blue adept | 26 maart 2019

So, false equivalency fallacy?

NKYTA | 26 maart 2019

Go find his posts on AGW, he has giving up. But no, those I mentioned.

Basically fatalism, wrapped I words.

NKYTA | 26 maart 2019

sI/in/

blue adept | 28 maart 2019

@NKYTA

Yeah, I can see that.

blue adept | 28 maart 2019

@kcheng

It is always better to have tried and failed than to have never tried at all.

Just saying.

Munka | 28 maart 2019

How about, as a compromise to what Paul is trying to say, we just agree that plastics in the ocean are a significant environmental threat which is currently under publicized compared to global warming.

Now when you dig a bit you find that most of the plastic in the ocean is coming from one of less than 10 rivers. One river in Asia alone is responsible for half the world's plastic in the ocean. A plastic straw ban in Chicago is not going to do anything to stem the flow of plastic from the second and third world countries. It is just a virtue signal. It makes a few dumb cattle like people feel they are achieving something to use a soggy paper straw. The real issue lies outside of the countries with effective waste management systems and we are doing nothing about addressing the issue elsewhere.

jimglas | 29 maart 2019

@Munka: My fear, I don't know if it has any basis, is that if plankton start "eating" plastic microparticles (which permeate all oceans) and then die off. No plankton, No humans.

SCCRENDO | 29 maart 2019

Why do we always compromise with the facts. If we are being poisoned with arsenic and strychnine do we say let’s try get rid of the arsenic but keep the strychnine. People like uncle Paul and others do not care about the environment and think they are doing everyone a big favor by showing signs of compromise. There is s difference between right and wrong. We are right and they are wrong

blue adept | 29 maart 2019

@Munka

Because it isn't an issue of "compromise" when it comes to thinking that any input from U.P. has any merit worth consideration inasmuch as he appears to be intent on sowing discourse

Take, for example, what he said/the very premise of his argument:

>>> "I believe the pollution in the air is almost insignificant compared to the amount of liquid and solid wastes flushed into the oceans..."

Anyone with a basic understanding of Nature/the atmosphere/the oceans from middle/grade school would be aware of the "Hydrologic/Water Cycle", that is, the continuous circulation of water in the Earth-atmosphere system which involves the processes of evaporation, transpiration, condensation, precipitation, and runoff.

To put it simply, the "...liquid and solid wastes flushed into the oceans..." are, through the natural Water Cycle, processed into various molecules of the air we inhale daily, ergo, the "wastes" contribute to the overall "pollution" content of our atmosphere and are not separate unto themselves.

I mean, on the one hand it demonstrates a certain degree of actual intelligence on U.P.'s behalf, what with their being able to create a dichotomy between several aspects of what are actually all a part of the same process while, on the other hand, simultaneously attempting to undermine a conversation by sowing discourse through conflating the constituent parts in a negative context with one another...

That's some next level trolling right there, but ultimately not worth the effort to engage because of the ignorance such practices sow.

blue adept | 30 maart 2019

@SCCRENDO

Short answer? Politics...

Politics always gets in the way of morality as opponents to change are all too often fond of championing/favoring economics over existential necessity by falsely insisting that the two are incapable of coexisting.

RedShift | 30 maart 2019

@blue adept

You da man.

RedShift | 30 maart 2019

@jimglas

They are already being eaten by small creatures which feed on even smaller creatures. They look like food to them.

This is of no concern to the myopic conservative. All they want to talk about is the ‘liberal conspiracy’ and the ‘big government’ killing the economy by over regulation.

SCCRENDO | 30 maart 2019

@blue adept. I would suggest that the ignorant and immoral gravitate to certain politics.

Uncle Paul | 30 maart 2019

Be easy on me guys. My opinions are based on my own personal observations, not the media.

Went to China couple years ago. Saw with my own eyes the environmental effects of all those billion people. Sent to the source of the Yang See river. It was pure and clean, Sourced from the mountain snow melt. Within 20 miles that river became so polluted you could not believe. Pure filth from everything that was being dumped into it from factories and cities.

Just got back from San Francisco. One of the most aware and eco facing cities in the world. They are some of the most progessive people in their beliefs. No straws, most drinking from reusable water bottles, get the stink eye if you ask for a bag instead of bringing your own at most stores. More Prius and Tesla than most anyplace else in the world....yet the place is a stinking mess. Feces on the streets mixed with hypodermic needles. Broken glass all over the streets from smash and grab thieves. Streets still clogged with polluting vehicles, and the streets themselves all broken up like you would expect in a 3rd world country. Their own beaches are pretty scruffy, not the bliss you would expect from all those well meaning folks. Thousands of homeless set up encampments where they are able to do the most foul things, but seem to get a pass from the powers under the guise of compassion.

Drove through the convention area of downtown San Diego. Again, hundreds of homeless camping and lolling about in many of the governmental open spaces and along freeway overpasses. Horrible living conditions but still encourage to continue with that life with free needles, free food and an occasional screening by the powers.
The multi can recycling program has turned out to be a fraud. Used to seen most of the recyclables to China, but they will no longer accept them. There is little market for most of the "recyclables" so if the cities cannot make a profit off them they are mostly just dumped into the landfill with all the other stuff.
I saw where Mexico is dumping rivers of raw sewage into the ocean just south of San Diego. It floats up the coast and people get sick just from going for a swim. Signs are posted along most of the beaches warning against body contact with the Pacific Ocean.

My concern is with so much attention to the feel good doings, people are missing the reality of what really needs to be done to preserve our planet.

If things keep going this way the alternative will be that the people will need to adapt to survive and thrive. Reduce our purchases of stuff, use less electricity, quit driving polluting vehicles as much, quit living next to the oceans and rivers and invest more in water conservation and reprocessing.

Seeing things with my own eyes has shown me that the media has been green washing much of what we see, hope and fear.

See people bringing their own shopping bags, but still living in big houses and driving big cars. See Moms giving their kids refillable water bottles, but still driving them to school and activities. See the poor taking the brunt of the initiatives, while the rich simply pay their way to eco dalliances.

If you think the solution is living a simple life, take a trip to India. Most of those people live with very little, yet the pollution of their urban lives is almost sub human to many of us.

Wake up...

SCCRENDO | 30 maart 2019

@uncle Paul. It is not an either/or. Most of your arguments relate to let’s clean up local pollution before we address global pollution. Impacting greenhouse gases impacts the whole planet so it is a priority. I am indeed as worldly as you if not more. I spent the first 32 years of my life growing up in Africa. As a physician I have volunteered my time providing medical care in rural areas and in multiple African countries. I have been to the 6 continents including places such as China, India, Vietnam and Cambodia. I have travelled to many countries in South and Central America. I have been to Vladivostok and St Petersburg. I have also visited much of the first world. Yes there is a lot of work to be done. And we need to help. The Trumpian approach to pulling out of the Paris accords and cutting off aid to places like Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador sets all these efforts back significantly. We also need to help our own homeless problem here by providing jobs with living wages and providing sufficient shelters for those who cannot afford housing.

SCCRENDO | 30 maart 2019

Btw. If you spent time studying climate change instead of blindly denying it you would realize that climate change leads to drought, wars including genocide and poverty. This increases local pollution.

David N | 30 maart 2019

Original post ended with “What are your thoughts”.

Perhaps the post should have ended with “ What are your thoughts? You will be corrected and critized if someone thinks your thoughts are not in line with their thoughts”

RedShift | 30 maart 2019

So the homeless problem is to be solved before we tackle our plastic pollution? Why? Where is it written that that’s priority and order of problem solutions?

Is it possible to solve two unrelated problems the same time?

Also, why does the solution to a problem be a ‘feel good’ only solution?

I still don’t see a serious attempt to address problems. Only obfuscations borne out of a necessity to promote self -held political and ideologicsl beliefs.

SCCRENDO | 30 maart 2019

Many are expressing their thoughts. But it is worthwhile fact checking thoughts.

NKYTA | 30 maart 2019

@RedShift, yep, Uncle Paul got bit by a False Dichotomy.

blue adept | 31 maart 2019

@RedShift

Meh...I have my moments.

blue adept | 31 maart 2019

@SCCRENDO

A reflection on our country's history/past validates your suggestion.

blue adept | 31 maart 2019

@Uncle Paul & @David N & @Munka

There's expressing one's opinion/"thought's" and then there's deliberately conflating and twisting and subverting facts to define the narrative in a manner favorable to their particular subversive agenda that isn't even remotely reflective of the truth...

That's called "bullshit artistry" and everything you lot type across these pages REEKS of it!

Long story short, you aren't actually as smart as you might like to think you are or, perhaps, as you might like for us to think you are.

Also, the rest of you are not doing yourselves any favors trying to stick up for him, for someone who has displayed such disreputable and unscrupulous behavior, as they're not deserving of your support, @David N & @Munka, that is, unless you are each of the same cloth of disreputability and unscrupulousness, afterall, as @SCCRENDO pointed out, birds of a feather do tend to flock together...

You guys wouldn't happen to be from that poser life, fraudulent TMC site, would you?

To put it bluntly, you need to take your freshman moves the hell on somewhere else, @Uncle Paul, and you can take your circle jerkers with you 'cause we varsity here!

Uncle Paul | 31 maart 2019

I have no agenda...just my personal observations.

Just would like to see real effective solutions, but not interested in feel good banter.

SCCRENDO | 31 maart 2019

@Uncle Paul. You are unlikely to see effective solutions unless you can clarify the problems. Sadly your thoughts don’t seem to match what most see are the real problems.

Uncle Paul | 1 april 2019

Fantastic news for our Oceans. Scientists have just discovered that the huge plastic mass floating in the ocean has begun to dramatically shrink. Most believe it is caused by the recent banning of straws in the US. The massive switch to reusable plastic and metal drinking containers instead of single use water bottles also believed to be a contributing factor.

Enviromentalists breath a sigh of relief...

blue adept | 1 april 2019

You don't even know/understand what-in-the-hell you're trying to talk about, rendering your "observations" woefully obtuse and mocking to the point where your comments are actually making the rest of us look dumb.

Don't go away mad...Just. Go. Away.

SCCRENDO | 1 april 2019

@blue adept. +100

Uncle Paul | 2 april 2019

Not supposed to take April Fools Day posts seriously nor literally

SCCRENDO | 2 april 2019

@uncle. April fools day is but on April 1st. How come you post this April fool’s stuff all year long??

Tesla-David | 3 april 2019

@blue adept +1000, well said!