Several days ago a Tesla Model S meets a BMW i8. See yourself.
I want my 52 seconds back.
The first i8 crashed at high speed in Germany. A prototype..
Only 200,000 Euro for the i8 prototype (hybrid drive train) to go from 0-60 mph in 4.5 seconds.
Hmm, the P85 can do 0-60 mph in 4.2 seconds for less than half the price with a single EV drive train.
A 2+2 vs. 5+2, which one is more practical?
I like to compare cars when they are for sale...
I am sure the word "Practical" was never used in the vocabulary of the design team building the i8. It is a $200,000 sports car. No one buys them for their "practicality". That would be like judging a Model S on how well it fits in small parking spaces. It was never in the design of the car.
Actually, BMW says the i8 will start at $135k; I doubt you'll be able to option it up to $200k.
Until we have independent instrumented testing, I'm withholding my opinion of the car. Well, except for the styling, which is cool.
The "five ways the i8 is better than the MS" link in the comments was pretty funny to read!
My chuckle for the day...;-)
"The "five ways the i8 is better than the MS" link in the comments was pretty funny to read!"
I'll say. Wow. Some angry readers in there. :-)
What were the 5 ways? All comments are gone, now.
i8 = range crippled performance enhanced Volt with jazzed up styling.
20 miles AER (All Electric Range)? Fail.
I'm still waiting for Tesla's real competition. I wonder when we will finally see that. It is amazing just how far ahead they really are.
I think I commented the first time the link was posted, but the two cars bear no comparison at all. I do personally think the i8 looks fantastic and I'm sure it drives beautifully, plus I'll bet my left nut that the quality of the interior would put MS to shame.
But I couldn't care less. The MS is revolutionary. It's what I want and it suits my needs in every way. The i8 could be half the price of an MS, but I'd still be buying the Tesla.
As for the article itself, it's a pile of ill informed shite.
Until there is another car with 200 mile BEV range we should refrain from using the words competition or comparison.
As for the i8 styling it just does not do it for me. Too transformer like.
This is not an electric car, it is a plug in Hybrid. Toyota does not call their plug in hybrid an EV. It is better than the Fisker. No one gets it, but a few; BMW and the big three need to produce a pure EV that goes 200 plus miles. Only 4% opted for the 160 mile Model S, this should tell them that they need to step up a put in a large battery. Hybrids are too complex; imagine needing service for a 135K Hybrid, BMW no less.
Yes Yes, it is crap, when compared to Tesla. But think of the lovely awkward moments coming to BMW's internal structures, when the simpleton lower end EVs the i team makes, outperform their M unit's offerings...
Appreciate the irony in that :)
Yes, Germany's other big export: schadenfreude
Why is it that people don't get that unless a vehicle comes on the market that is truly comparable to the S they should stop comparing apples to oranges.
Still Grinning ;-)
+1 Cat t man. The fact that the MS out accelerates the M5, cost relatively next to nothing to maintain, no premium gas cost, etc. has to be flat out embarrassing to BMW. Anyone know far one can go on a tank of gas in an M5? I'd imagine it's inline with the S85. They along with everyone else is now going to have to start to play catch up.
I think it will be a while before you see a "real" competitor to the MS (i.e. a performance sedan with seating for 5). I don't think any ICE manufacturer wants to bring one to market as it will eat into their lucrative ICE revenue--face it, BMW will never bring a BEV or hybrid M5 to market anytime soon, even if they could. Instead, you will continue to get these weird/niche vehicles.
I don't think you will see any movement on this until they start to feel the pain in their core revenue.
An m5 can go about 337 miles on a tank. It's 30% more efficient than the v10 m5, it gets 14 city 20 highway, combined 16 mpg, 21.1 gal tank. Man the v10 must be a real pig. About $80 to fill up, about .25 cents a mile, just in fuel. A model S is about .03 cents in electricity.
I think the majors are trapped by the high cost of the specialty automotive cells they're using for the battery. Putting 60-100kWh capacity in a car would be ruinously pricey.
... all that being said, I think the i8 is beautiful, in a "Tron meets lamborhini" kind of way.
*Ack! Lamborghini *
Completely impractical in every way, though.
Rear is OK but front is Bangle ugly... Beached whale.. And an ugly specimen at that..
I do think the i8 is sexy, but that's about all that's exceptional about it. In that sense, it's a lot like a Maserati.
Comparing MS to I8 is like comparing the Vatican to German potato pancakes. Lets continue. It will be fun.
I drove my MS on a 4400 mile tour. My passengers could bring all the luggage they wanted. No one needed a shoehorn to get in or out.
Now lets get back to the German potato pancakes. Or the Vatican.
Please someone do a face-off between the P85D and the i8. There is absolutely NO competition.. The P85D would beat the i8 on all parameters.
One of the major auto mags (Car & Driver or Motor Trend) recently compared a P85+ (this was pre-P85D) to the i8. They picked the P85+. P85D vs i8? Easy victory for the S!
It almost seems like the i8 is sucker-bait. The illusion of speed and coolness ...
Tesla P85D vs. BMW i8 infographic, it's no contest...http://evannex.com/blogs/news/15740912-did-tesla-just-pull-ahead-of-the-...
There is no relevant comparison OR competition. They are both cool cars, intended for different audiences. ANY MS will beat my wife's Boxster on any measure except handling and the sound of a screaming flat-six. The Tesla carries more, is faster, more comfortable, quieter, etc. But the MS is no substitute for the Porsche when it is Boxster time. Having sold the S85 in preparation for the incoming P85D, it has been a pleasure to be "forced" into the Porsche for a few weeks of glorious fall weather. The i8 is and will remain a very successful car and BMW will sell every one they can make. No need to be so dismissive and superior. There are plenty of good cars out there without a Tesla badge.
How do they both do when they come to a corner though?
My P85D is arriving in about 5 weeks, and I already love it - the speed, safety, practicality... as far as I'm concerned it's the perfect car.
However, there's a tiny nagging thought in the back of my mind that it's heading in the direction of an American muscle car - brain-bendingly fast in a straight line, but a little flabby around a corner. Sort of like the comparison between the Roadster and the Elise.
There is no car that will do everything perfectly. But just maybe the impractical, range-anxiety-inducing, overpriced i8 will show it's true colors the moment Top Gear puts them side by side on a test track, and the i8 laps 10s quicker...
swid - it ain't gonna be no Porsche at that weight, but I'm betting that the very low center of gravity combined with some cutting edge torque vectoring and other ridiculously cool engineering tricks, it won't be a slouch either.
swid, when you hit the apex of a turn, just get on it and you will forget you are driving an American car.
However physics being physics, this is a heavy car. For people to compare the handling of the MS to that of i8 is another apples to oranges comparison.
Apples to oranges, one of these cars has been crash tested in europe and usa...
Physics also is involved.
It incorporates the suspension that was developed for the P+ for exactly that reason.
Here's a quarter.........
There are several comparisons on the web. The i8 handles very slightly better than the p85, but effectively equivalent numbers. I8 feels lighter.
Have you checked the weight of the Porsche Panamera turbo? It isn't much lighter. It is a far better track car, but who needs a 4 for sedan track car. Even BMW m cars are not good track cars.
Why again are we comparing the MS to a 2 door "sports car"......
Since there is no other full size EV on the market, comparisons should end there.
One could compare the BMW i3, MB B-Class EV and the Leaf since they are roughly the same size.
We are comparing the i8 to the Tesla, because they are both state of the art alternative fuel vehicles in a similar price class. In addition, their performance is similar, which is an amazing feat for a 5+2 passenger sedan vs a 2+2 sports car.
Often big AMG and M sedans are compared to Porsche Cayman's as 0-60 "they are faster than a Porsche". The problem here is the Cayman kills them in every other performance category, whereas the Tesla actually holds its own or betters the BMW in ALL performance categories which is a comparison people should be aware of before sacrificing for the sports car performance.
Where is that boy who kept telling us how great the i8 was going to be last year? He was a hoot!
Oh, you mean Bob Myer Warner?
Yeah, funny kid, that.
Any car that requires two technicians to open the hood, is an unfinished engineering job. The i8 will never compete with a Porsche, let alone a Model S.
A Porsche is very fun to drive, but unfortunately has the power plant of yesteryear.
An i8 is a sheep in wolf's clothing. It has looks that make promises, but bones that can't deliver.
It's a textbook case of conflicted management. BMW's best and brightest were held back from greatness by management that doesn't understand where the world is headed, and is clueless about how to lead through a period of disruption.
Mark K | NOVEMBER 19, 2014
"... a sheep in wolf's clothing."
ha ha. I like that.