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Autopilot Refund/Credit for recent M3 purchases - being fair to customers

Autopilot Refund/Credit for recent M3 purchases - being fair to customers

About 2 months ago prior to moving forward with purchasing a Model 3 LR AWD, I posted the suggestion that Autopilot needed to be a standard feature in order to compete with other manufacturers offering similar capability on lower cost vehicles before I would purchase an M3. Well last week it finally happened. But I made my purchase a week earlier and paid the full $3,000. Elon, if you are reading this I hope you will take action to treat your customers fairly as you continue with the ongoing rounds of pricing changes. It seems to me that even with the recent price increase, the cost of an M3 LR AWD actually decreased by $1,500 given autopilot is finally standard. If you are unable to refund the $3,000 to new owners that took delivery within a couple weeks of the changes, at lease offer $1,500 in Supercharger credits if not an outright cash refund of $1,500!!!!

BTW, putting aside the poor customer relations handling, after 3 weeks of owning our M3, I find it to be an amazing vehicle overall and not disappointed with my decision. I will say that the fit and finish even now, is still a bit rough around the edges. Still seeing questionable body panel fit, and paint that seems to still have a lot of flaws, mostly appearing as if large dust particles must be constantly floating around in the painting booths. But the technology platform is awesome, and being a C7 Corvette, and VW GTI owner I find our M3 AWD as much fun to drive as either of our other rides. Well at least more fun than the GTI! I even passed on a Jaguar I-Pace in deciding to finally go electric.

Please be considerate to new customers when you make these seemingly spur of the moment pricing and configuration changes! I really want to feel good about making referrals to friends...

Regards
Joe

Magic 8 Ball | 15. april 2019

@Joe If prices go up you will be sending them the difference?

minervo.florida | 15. april 2019

If my friend got his Corvette cheaper than mine from another dealer, who should I ask for the refund?

We only drive Tesla for past 5 years, no Corvette.

EVRider | 15. april 2019

I didn't get a refund when the price of my new Model S dropped $13,000 six weeks after I took delivery. You won't get a refund either. Tesla doesn't (and shouldn't) give refunds every time they change the pricing, but they should stop changing the pricing so frequently and drastically.

jwsholtis | 15. april 2019

Magic 8 Ball - I think customer relations are critical to the success of Tesla and the recent changes could have been handled better. To answer your question no, but my making a purchase and sharing a positive experience the $1,500 perhaps as I suggested in the form of a supercharger credit has more benefits to Tesla than ignoring customers that have made a commitment to their products. I think it's called "good will".

Magic 8 Ball | 15. april 2019

@jwshottis Many feel same as you, I call it greed. TESLA has operating costs that fluctuate depending on how bad suppliers squeeze them. You want to squeeze them from the other end. Squeeze on greedy bastard.

apless01 | 15. april 2019

I was thinking the same thing got mine two weeks ago and now 1500 dollars cheaper. Not to mention the heated rest seats worked when I got the vechile and the ota update took them away.

jjgunn | 15. april 2019

We need to help this AMERICAN car company be profitable - not try & squeeze them for "refunds"

I paid $8k for EAP/FSD - I'm not crying about it. So did a lot of others who have been owners for 5 years or more. None of them are crying about it.

If this was the Germans or Japanese, what do you think their response would be if you requested a refund??

You don't get your cake & eat it too.

Carl Thompson | 15. april 2019

@jjgunn:
"We need to help this AMERICAN car company be profitable"

It's not our job as consumers to help a company be profitable. It's the company's job to figure out how to be profitable and at the same time keep customers happy.

mrburke | 15. april 2019

When you buy something like a car, I assume you pay what you think is a fair price. If not why did you buy it ?
If so, why do you think you should get money back from a purchase that you thought you paid a fair price for ?
Tesla never promised not to lower prices. You got what you got, and you paid what you thought was a fair price.

LET IT GO.

ADinM3 | 15. april 2019

I think most here agree Tesla might be better served not changing prices so often however this can be positive for Tesla as they are able to react quickly, certainly quicker than any other manufacturer dare try. However, this is only possible if they hold firm as quick changes are simply not possible if all the hands go out for a refund or free gift on every price move. While it can irk a few on either side of a price move, on the whole more people benefit.

As @mrburke and others have said people should be content with the price they agreed to at time of purchase or don't make the purchase. Even in relative terms, the price moves are still smaller as a percentage than many other things in life that fluctuate like hotel rooms, airline tickets, things on Amazon, or the remaining hotdogs to be sold in the last 30 minutes of a highschool football game.

@Carl, I honestly think the best thing Tesla can do to keep the majority happy would be to never cave to the requests. People's demands would only increase and the disappointment only greater once the punchbowl was finally removed.

jfulton67 | 15. april 2019

Hello all, I'm a proud and happy Model 3, mid range owner since January. As most of you, I have many questions about FSD. I get it, prices change and models change; I'm happy with my car. My issue is I purchased EAP and the salesperson told me it was autonomous driving, and would eligible for all software updates, including full autonomous driving capabilities. My point, I thought I was getting FSD, not the terms they were using in January, but that is how it was sold to me. Anyone have this experience? For me, I would be happy with paying the $2000 offered last month, but now when I go to my account it's $5000. I called customer support two weeks ago and they said as long as I call, the purchase price would be $2000. Today I called to make the purchase, and the rep had no idea what the first was talking about. If you have any experiences like this, please share as go forward to FSD. Thank you.

marinergreg | 15. april 2019

Seriously.........do we really have to do this again?? This Elon owes me a refund madness has to stop.
#NotGonnaHappen

Magic 8 Ball | 15. april 2019

It like the rise of the zombies the rise of the entitled comes in waves.

Carl Thompson | 15. april 2019

@ADinM3:
"I honestly think the best thing Tesla can do to keep the majority happy would be to never cave to the requests. People's demands would only increase and the disappointment only greater once the punchbowl was finally removed."

I agree they shouldn't cave. But I think the very best thing Tesla could do is have a coherent and long-term pricing strategy so they that everything is priced fairly and they don't need to change prices often.

Carl Thompson | 15. april 2019

@jfulton67

That sucks. it sounds like you got a slimy sales rep. I don't know if there's anything you can do if you can't prove what he told you. It can't hurt to try your luck talking to them or sending a letter / email.

creativeguy | 15. april 2019

"If so, why do you think you should get money back from a purchase that you thought you paid a fair price for ?"

Because in the case of FSD, Tesla hasn't delivered anything yet. When I buy something from Amazon and the price goes down before they ship it, I call Amazon and they credit me the difference. Tesla should do the same when they lower the price of something they haven't yet delivered.

ADinM3 | 15. april 2019

@jfulton67, was it actually offered for 2k last month or was that in the 2 week confusion window where people were saying they could buy it was ambiguous. I honestly don't remember. So I'm assuming you paid 5k for EAP. Do you remember what the price was for FSD after purchase at that time or did you buy in the period where FSD was off menu?

If you bought EAP for 5k and FSD was off menu at time of purchase I would try calling again with that argument and what the person told you about and you may have better luck. I don't know if you can get $2k, $3k, or they hold to $5k but more calling can't hurt. Often times being nice and playing dumb will get you farther than angry and demanding. If I understand your situation correctly, you are in a rare(r) case with FSD off menu and I don't know how that was intended to go down if you didn't know it was even an option.

Good luck, if you didn't know about FSD and your salesperson fell short on explaining things then that put you in a different spot in my book from others that had the opportunity but declined the offer.

kpoon.ca | 15. april 2019

The problem is not about changing price, but Tesla can’t support their customers internally.

I ordered my Tesla 3 on Jan 26 2019.

While I was waiting for the car, the options of the car were changed, from EAP (1 option) to AP+FSD (2 options) in Feb 2019.
My car was not due for delivery until March then. I checked online and repriced my car and it ended up CAN$76400 vs my original order at CAN$76500.

I called Tesla to see if I would get the FSD included or I need to cancel and reorder since the price is practically the same. The rep on the phone informed me that in my case, I could keep existing and will get FSD included. If I cancel and reorder, delivery date might be affected.

I also contacted my local delivery team and I was told the same thing. Therefore I decided to keep the order since I would be getting FSD included anyway. The delivery rep also sent me an Email to confirm that I would get FSD for free. (see below in French)

Now I got my car on March 23, everything seems fine until I logged on to my Tesla account, it's indicating that I need to purchase FSD for CAN$6600. Please see screenshots, there is also no FSD option listed in my car.

I am extremely worried since I have chatted online a few times, and called. I was told that someone would contact me regarding my case. In every occasion, reps on the phone told me that I do not have FSD option and this is very worrying.

My local rep simply told me to wait. But it's not reassuring. We also know now that FSD will require a hardware upgrade in the future, therefore FSD cannot simply be upgraded over the air. I don't see how FSD feature will be pushed to my account if FSD doesn't exist in my account nor car's VIN.

4 weeks after delivery now and nobody could give me a solid answer. I simply feel like they don’t care about their customers. I am considering a model U also for 2nd car. But I would consider twice for other option if Tesla keep changing price, configuration, option very few weeks and unwilling to treat customers fairly

ADinM3 | 15. april 2019

@creativeguy, by your rationale what is the difference then between buying FSD at time of purchase or after purchase which was clearly laid out as different pricing, especially if pricing moved up or down after the fact? This was never structured like the typical Amazon purchase example you gave and I don't think anyone (or almost anyone) really viewed it that way until after the fact.

And yes, I have seen people lose with pre-order pricing also but with the Amazon example is also a little different as Amazon is in the middle between you and the supplier and can lean on the supplier to price match. You can bet Amazon isn't eating that cost.

ADinM3 | 15. april 2019

@kpoon, if you have something in writing prior to delivery you probably have a case if it went down the way you described. Definitely sounds frustrating but hang in there. Try to remember that had the price drop not occurred you would have been content in your purchase.

Btw, I would not just "wait" without an expected response window as you do need to push to get a clear decision one way or the other.

jjgunn | 15. april 2019

Carl Thompson | April 15, 2019
@jjgunn:
"We need to help this AMERICAN car company be profitable"

It's not our job as consumers to help a company be profitable.
------------
You're right.....but it's in your best interest if you want your car to continue to improve like it has been.

I don't want a BMW / Mercedes / Audi / Toyota / Honda / etc.....

ebmcs03 | 15. april 2019

Well Tesla pricing is a joke. I’ve already basically swore not to buy another Tesla because of the drastic price drops and the lies that buy now or it’ll be more expensive after the fact. Nope. It was cheaper!!!!! I’ll stick with traditional car dealers. I tend to do better at negotiating a pretty low price. At least I won’t be short $6000

ST70 | 15. april 2019

@ebmcs03- what traditional car dealer are you sticking with? Dumb@ss!

jjgunn | 16. april 2019

Enjoy your $4 a gallon (or more!) Gas, oil changes & smog tests.

Sounds like fun!

crmedved | 16. april 2019

@jfulton67 You'll probably get a different response for every rep that you talk to. You can try calling every couple of days. Good luck!

@ADinM3 I'm in the same boat as kpoon. Not sure why it takes them so long to apply FSD to the accounts. I'll probably start doing weekly nags until FSD features are announced or HW3 upgrades start... then it goes to daily.

ADinM3 | 16. april 2019

@ebmcs03, what did you expect of a company who's mission is to transition the world away from fossil fuels as quickly as possible and also desperately needs to lower price as quickly as possible to increase volumes for scale and to survive?

Your upset that they are succeeding? What are you proposing they do?

max89 | 16. april 2019

I think there is some merit in the OP's opinion, mostly because Tesla somewhat urged consumers to buy around mid March citing "upcoming price increase." Well, prices indeed increased but only for like two weeks. Now the price is even lower. Truth told, consumers can easily see this as a bit deceptive. It is also bad for the company, frequent price changes and configuration changes make consumers reluctant to buy.

So anyone really tried contacting Tesla about this?

mk4ce | 16. april 2019

I agree that Tesla should honor some kind of discount. I picked up my M3 AWD LR 2 weeks ago and would have gladly waited knowing AP would be included. I think Tesla should offer its M3 customers the ability to buy FSAP at a discounted price if said customer already paid for AP. I'm also fine with the credit of super charging, too. Tesla isn't losing money if they did this. It's only fair.

I've already had terrible customer service experience throughout the entire buying process. Including a damaged vehicle (lower bumper scratch - 4 inches by 6 inches) at delivery. They said they would have it fixed, but I have yet to hear back. I really need Tesla to bring customer service up more. I love the car, but these constant price fluctuations make a difference to me and my view of the company in a negative manner. How am I supposed to recommend this car to my friends and family knowing of the low class customer service I've received and constant changes to their pricing?

Mike UpNorth | 16. april 2019

Waa waa.

Kathy Applebaum | 16. april 2019

The best thing about this thread is finding so many users to mute. Thanks, TFES!

crmedved | 16. april 2019

@mk4ce "Tesla isn't losing money if they did this. It's only fair."

Erm. Either they're giving you hundreds of dollars in free electricity or they're selling a feature to you for less than they value it. Both things cost them.

Customer service could use a bit of help. But yeah, Tesla is notoriously slow at most repairs, especially if parts need to be ordered.

I bought my LR AWD in Feb. Price for same config is $1,200 cheaper now. Honestly, I don't really care much. A 1-2% price change isn't that horrendous. Besides, the difference between Tesla and other car manufacturers is you actually notice when Tesla changes the price. The traditional way to modify the price is to offer cash back or other promotions and discounts instead of changing the MSRP... then recent buyers don't know their car is cheaper now and go asking for "compensation". Or, they can just say the promotion started after they purchased.

weluvm3 | 16. april 2019

Not happy that I paid more than some people for FSD, which I purchased with my car.

But I sincerely appreciate Tesla and Musk's gesture to invite me and the rest who purchased FSD prior to the price drop to the Early Access Program. If you think about it, we ARE the Early Adopters for this technology. We voted with our wallets at the earliest possible opportunity. Good on Tesla for recognizing this and rewarding it in a meaningful and exciting way.

That said, I, personally, haven't received any communication from Tesla since they posted, on March 1st, that they would be inviting us to the Early Access Program. I've heard rumors (from Customer Service reps and other owners) that some owners have received emails acknowledging that we will all be invited, eventually. But I haven't personally received an email to that effect. Keeping promises to your customers is a big deal, and I'm very hopeful that Tesla fully intends to keep this one.

cfryatt | 16. april 2019

My car is something like 10 days old. The most recent price changes happened the evening of my 7th day of ownership. I probably could have pushed the issue and returned and rebought - it was difference of $1,000 total ($500 less for AP, $500 less for paint). I didn't do that. I paid what I thought was a fair price and so that's that.

However, I've seen rumors/rumblings of Tesla giving away AP truly for free. In other words, lowering the extra cost of bundling to zero and also providing 2019 owners who haven't yet bought AP for free. This would absolutely upset me, not because of the money, but because of the fact that someone who didn't have the desire or faith to buy AP up front would now get rewarded for that, and those of us who did would be effectively punished.

Magic 8 Ball | 16. april 2019

"Punished", now that is new.

#Entitledcrybaby

Pepperidge | 16. april 2019

You signed, that's your price.

mk4ce | 16. april 2019

@crmedved I suppose I exaggerated a bit with it not costing Tesla anything to offer free supercharging or discounts. I'm probably still upset from my experience thus far. In my opinion regarding my specific situation, it would be fair for Tesla to offer a reimbursement for these new price changes considering the amount of stress I've incurred and the patience I've given to Tesla and their staff through the process.

I was told by my "sales rep" that the prices would increase if I did not purchase by the cutoff date approx.. 3-4 weeks ago. I asked her several times over and she assured me the vehicles would not be cheaper ever again. I put my trust in this Tesla representative. Only to see that the prices are now cheaper. I know 1-2% isn't much to some and I’m happy to hear some people are not bothered by this. However, I take this a bit personally as I feel a bit deceived by Tesla and their representatives.

Whether or not my situation is fair can be argued at length. I only hope Tesla does the right thing for its very recent customers who have an issue with the latest price changes.

crmedved | 16. april 2019

@mk4ce Hm... 3-4 weeks ago was probably when they rescinded their 6% cut to a 3% cut (raising prices by 3% from a temporary low). I'm sorry your sales rep promised you something way out of her control :( I understand the frustration, but ultimately Tesla is aiming for profit. They decided it was more profitable to force people to buy AP at a discounted rate by making it standard... likely hoping it will cause increased interest in FSD as well.

@cfryatt Some people did get AP or FSD for free. I'm in the free FSD bucket (if they ever apply it), although I did pay $5k for EAP. They gave it "for free" to people who had not taken delivery so they wouldn't cancel their orders when they dropped prices by 6%. I opted to take it over saving a couple thousand dollars, because I wanted FSD.

ADinM3 | 16. april 2019

And as @crmedved example highlights it is impossible, or at least extremely difficult, to start trying to "make it right" for one group without the next adjacent group feeling slighted. The old adage that not good deed will go unpunished definitely applies to Tesla.

cfryatt | 16. april 2019

@8 Ball Entitled crybaby? Man, you guys on here are hilarious.

That's my opinion and yes, I'm fully entitled to it. Perhaps you didn't read my whole post. I was commenting on a hypothetical and you resort to name calling. This isn't about getting a refund because the price changed, I was pretty clear about my stance on that. It's about giving someone who doesn't seem to be invested in the company a reward for that lack of faith. Maybe you feel differently, and that's cool with me. :)

@crmedved Yeah, that's different to me. You actually put $$ down for a service and in good faith to the company by buying EAP. In comparison, Tesla isn't giving away free FSD to those who didn't buy EAP.

max89 | 16. april 2019

Now start to realize why Apple opted for "same price, different models" approach. Except for recent iPhone X, pretty much all prior iterations saw no price drop. A brand new iphone 8 is sold at the same price no matter 1 day or 1 year after release. That gives consumers confidence to buy right after release rather than just waiting.

In some sense, Tesla is loosing demand to its future self -- consumers are waiting for price to drop. Perhaps this explains the disappointing Q1 sales. The ironic part of this is that, because of the disappointing demand now, the company will find it attempting to lower price, which self-fulfills the consumer expectation of price drops.

burdogg | 16. april 2019

Um...I disagree - lower demand for S and X was multifaceted - with price change probably being 100,000 on the list. First the 3 is an amazing car that really cut into the Model S sales - I would hope all could at least admit that regardless of what the media likes to spin.

Second - the 3 has seen so much attention that even new features are being pushed to it first. This leads to many waiting to buy an S and X until they update it to include batteries like the 3 - to give access to V3 charging and just flat out faster charging.

Third - many are just waiting on the refresh - there has been long rumored that things were going to be changing for the S and X - so many are waiting for those to be put forward.

And the list goes on - but price change on the S and X is NOT a main reason.

Next up - the 3 - drop in demand again is multifaceted. First - it was time to ship oversees - this in and of itself was going to create an initial bottleneck and thus a drop in cars sold in 1st Quarter - this has NOTHING to do with demand.

Second - of course there was going to be a drop off at some point - there was quite a backlog of reservation holders. That long with daily demand made a huge sales push, there was bound to be a drop off as soon as reservation holders AND new orders were caught up on - eventually you are going to be past all reservation holders and down to just new orders - so yes, there will be a natural drop that was going to occur.

Third - most average person has no clue what the price "was" versus now. Honestly - go ask anyone if what they know about how much a Tesla costs - or if they have raised or lowered prices. Most don't follow all this as closely as many on here. The majority learn about Tesla, look into it, drive it and say wow - then buy it. Sure there are some that go to see if there is any deal - but when they look on Tesla site - they won't see any incentives or deals. Some may go searching and find that the price has already been lowered - and they will feel even better about buying.

And then yes, you may have a select few that wait to see if it will be cheaper - but most after driving or wanting it are not going to be sitting around waiting to "see" if the price drops more.

And no - iPhones are NOT sold for the same price as when they first came out - not sure where you are going to buy your iPhones.

fazman | 16. april 2019

Rather than keep lowering the price, it would actually be better if they held pricing and just include more features as a value add. Personally, i would rather give me FSD as a free upgrade when it becomes "ready" rather than have to keep waiting for a deal to preset itself magically for a week and then disappear (oh wait and it took 6 of those days for them to figure out the backend issues to display the ability to buy it... go figure.

i'll just keep driving the car till the day Tesla is ready to take my money at a fair price for the feature

VolleyballNE1 | 16. april 2019

People, Think of it fairly. Return policy is 7 days. So 3 weeks is too late for any action for any business with a return policy. Stop trying to put blame on the company for price adjustments. Within 7 days, you might have an argument. Otherwise, you are just not being an adult about just bad purchase timing. It happens on small purchases such as a pipe fitting, to a large one like a house. Prices change over time. Such is life.

max89 | 16. april 2019

@burdogg, your points well taken here. Just one thing: I was not saying Q1 sales is mainly due to consumer waiting, but I feel that it definitely played a role, and is still playing the role. Consumers are smarter than what we usually think they are. Yes most people do not follow Tesla prices, but a consumer planning to spend $50k on a car -- he or she should and I believe would follow prices for a while.

On another issue, why no LR RWD any more? It was $47,500 with AP I think, just $2,000 less than the current LR AWD. Is that $2,000 worthwhile for a AWD?

Always felt that LR RWD is a good option. Big battery and better interior always practical. AWD feature not really that practical for most common users, let alone that it lowers range by 15 miles. But just my own opinion.

rhj | 16. april 2019

Thing should never go on sale ? But when they do you want reparations ?
When prices increase will you send in the difference ?
If the car was a subscription service you have it longer you pay more.
Tesla offered Free Supercharging in the Performance M3. I didn't get it so who's going to send me MY free KW ?
When the US Federal EV Tax credit decreased Car prices were adjusted. Fair ?
After the Y was announced prices were adjusted. Fair ?
Features were shuffled in and out of AP, EAP and FSD to make a better product. Fair ?
Tesla goes out of their way to allow some features to be added after the fact. Fair ?
Contract - Payment - Car. Thats IT. Anything else is Gravy or Arbitration .

weluvm3 | 16. april 2019

"On another issue, why no LR RWD any more? It was $47,500 with AP I think, just $2,000 less than the current LR AWD. Is that $2,000 worthwhile for a AWD?

Always felt that LR RWD is a good option. Big battery and better interior always practical. AWD feature not really that practical for most common users, let alone that it lowers range by 15 miles. But just my own opinion."

I am very annoyed that I didn't wait and get the AWD option. Every time I stomp on the accelerator, I wonder how much quicker my car could have been.

But, yeah, for me the extra engine would just be for fun. And I am glad to have the extra range.

max89 | 16. april 2019

@weluvm3 Haha, right, also had that feeling. But typically stomping accelerator is something I only do in a short period of time after getting a new car.

Real question is whether someone has contacted Tesla if you are not satisfied with price drops, instead of just vetting voices here at a forum... I did, they avoided my inquiry then kicked me around between departments :(

kaushal | 16. april 2019

I am picking up an M3 with Standard Plus, Blue Color and AP tomorrow afternoon.

Should I just drive it for a week, return and order another one with same config? It's actually a $1600 difference if you take into account 7% GA sales tax.

ADinM3 | 16. april 2019

@burdogg, +1

@max89, I'm guessing rwd was dropped because many will choose and AWD for a few thousand more. AWD probably only costs them about 1k so it improves margin.

@fazman/max89, They need to work hard to lower price to increase volumes for their mission and perhaps more importantly to subsequently lower costs. While a very very few may hold off hoping for a better deal, the cars are still too expensive for most and the addressible market probably quadruples for every 5k price reduction at this point. They need to get into deeper water.

The only real reason for not dropping price is if they are severely supply constrained but I think the goal of removing the 35k target albatross from around their neck and a genuine attempt to help as many people waiting at lower price points still be able to partake in the tax credit helped convince them to reduce.

I'm pretty certain the whole 3 week price swings period was not planned and clearly a result of the whioe price reduction/store closure move going sideways on them. Hopefully they learned a lot.

Price moves on the software will be interesting to watch but I suspect we are getting to a point where the base car prices are probably stablized. Certainly, if you think they will drop 5+% drops at a moment's notice you may be waiting a while.

Lastly, even if you think some may hold off buying waiting for a lower price, who it really hurts is the competitors. I don't think this is Tesla's motive, but it brings a world of hurt for others as people who thought they may have to buy something else because they couldn't afford a Tesla may think twice.

synon2000 | 16. april 2019

jfulton67 I am in the same boat as you are. Bought my M3 in October 2018 when FSD was not in the scene. I was also told as long as I take the EAP for $5000/- I will have the autonomous lifetime updates! Did not even know there was a $2000/- offer for FSD last month. They should have notified their M3 customers when there are new enhancements. Will be contacting the support to see what their response would be.

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