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Customers degrading rapidly

Customers degrading rapidly

Lately, I've seen a rash of "service is the worst ever" from people claiming to be owners, yet they are unwilling to have service actually correct the issue. They have some minor problem, which agreed should be fixed. They then berate service as the worst they have ever had without letting Tesla actually look at or fix the issue. It takes less time to set up an appointment than to write these scathing posts. You can create an appointment from the Tesla app or a PC in a matter of seconds. You can even request mobile service in the issue description field, something you can't get with any other automaker. Now it's fair to complain if service cannot fix an issue, which happens on rare occasions - but to complain without having Tesla look at the car appears as fake news or perhaps more likely, not a real customer.

grins.va | 20. august 2019

@TT - +1

Mike83 | 20. august 2019

So true. Since the Teslas don't require much service I think some of this FUD is from stealerships who make their money doing service

jimglas | 20. august 2019

"Service" is the new FUD

carlk | 20. august 2019

I thought I read it wrong but then I realized what your title meant. I absolutely agree. I just read the news that Facebook and Twitter removed thousands of Chinese accounts set up to attack Hong Kong protesters. It's just too easy for shorts and haters to do this. Like you said start a thread here without first work it out with Tesla just does not make sense.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

Probably not actually real owners.

Tesla-David | 20. august 2019

@TT +100, thanks for posting, you nailed it! Couldn't agree more!

rxlawdude | 20. august 2019

C'mon guys. Really? You are saying that EVERYONE who posts documented issues with service, or inability to reach a human by phone, are FUDsters? REALLY?

I didn't know that Trumpism had moved into the "fanboi" community - ignore ANY negative facts. Sad.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

Everyone that posts nearly an identical thread title, and the body of which are also similar in nature, being basically a temper-tantrum rant about something they dont like, also including the OP's explanation about how they did not actually schedule an appointment to get it done, or have Tesla even look at it. So yes, FUD.

rxlawdude | 20. august 2019

Ah, so @andy, anyone who writes about their experience objectively is a FUDster. Got it.

Magic 8 Ball | 20. august 2019

Big difference between objective posters and those that whine especially those that have a history of whining.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

@rxlaw

Hey if your reading comprehension is low enough, thats exactly what i said.

rxlawdude | 20. august 2019

@andy, I assure you my reading comprehension is just fine.

But I am really getting tired of the internecine banter at two extremes of a spectrum. This serves no good purpose.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

"Ah, so @andy, anyone who writes about their experience objectively is a FUDster. Got it."

Because thats not what i said. And sharing your experience is subjective because you dont hear both sides.

"Customer is always right" is not a real thing. Thats a slogan that essentially says "keep the customer satisfied to keep their business".

dmm1240 | 20. august 2019

@rxlawdude

Most of it is FUD. We even know who the trolls are for the most part. This is a small forum with not that many participants. It's easy to figure out who is who if you play here a lot.

I simply do not understand what the point is in coming here to whine/complain/report about it. We can't do anything about your problem. This forum is unmonitored so you're not reaching Tesla's ears. Tesla does offer roadside assistance like all car manufacturers. Personally, I'm cautious. I also have roadside assistance via my insurance policy and belong to AAA. Somebody is going to be able to get me out of it if my MX breaks down.

Is Tesla aware of its service issues? I think so. A simple Google proves that.
https://www.autonews.com/service/tesla-too-sees-service-central
https://electrek.co/2018/07/22/tesla-service-new-initiatives/
https://insideevs.com/news/339768/teslas-new-initiatives-aim-to-improve-...
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-repair-service-rangers-double-capacity-p...
https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/24/tesla-focuses-on-service-with-25-new-s...

From one article published 7/24/19 on Tech Crunch:

“We’ve in-sourced a great deal of the collision repair activities, which I think had quite a good impact on customer happiness,” Musk said. “This will continue in the months to come.” Musk also noted that the company is working hard to reset its processes in order to ensure that parts are available on-hand when and where needed for service, which is a gap that has prompted customer complaints in the past.

The Tesla CEO said that he meets with the Tesla service team “multiple times a week” to “get updates on the reliability of the vehicle,” noting the best service possible is “no service” because that would represent maximum reliability (and of course, lowest possible ongoing costs for Tesla). He also said that they’ve seen “fewer and fewer service visits for the most recent cars that we’re building, so we’re on a good trend there.”

Jerome Guillen, President of Automotive at Tesla also noted that the number one reason for service visits is actually people looking to learn how to use Autopilot, and in general education represents a high percentage of visits.

Tesla CFO Zach Kirkhorn addressed a question about the service center expansion later in the call, adding that the company is pursuing a path of systematic “focus on service and supercharging, as opposed to a retail presence.” He also noted that he believes efforts to improve their parts distribution, with a focus on ensuring that parts are available on-hand in inventory at the service centers where they’re needed will actually help bring down costs overall versus housing them centrally or ordering on-demand from suppliers and Tesla’s own fabrication facilities.
------------------------------------------

That sounds like a company that knows it has issues in certain places and is working on it as fast as they can.

So, this again begs the question: Why are people coming on this forum to whine and complain?

We can't do anything about it if you happen to live in an area of California where the Tesla fleet is growing exponentially.

If I were dissatisfied, I'd write Tesla a letter. I'd complain to my local government. I'd charge into the nearest sales/service center myself and demand satisfaction.

If your intent is to "warn" Tesla owners about the problem, well the company is obviously aware of its need to expand service options. If you're looking for a magic phone number to call, we don't have it.

This is what I did see happen not a month ago. I was in a service center to have a piece of trim replaced, nothing big, and the guy at the desk was on the phone talking with a customer. He freely gave out his contact info to the customer telling the person on the other end of the line to contact him at any time. I suggest you do the same if you have issues. Go to your regular service center, make nice and ask them for a contact point with a real person. If they start citing company policy prohibiting that, then point out that sometimes you actually need to talk to a person about something.

If I were Tesla, I would do the following:
1. Set up a phone bank to handle service appointments beyond "Hey, I be broken down on the 405 and my M3 won't move at all" stuff. Train the call center phone call fielders on how to turn on autopilot, navigate the menus on your touchscreen, etc to get rid of common time wasting issues at service centers.
2. Schedule and advertise "get to know your Tesla" sessions where new owners could come in on a Saturday with their cars to take classes on how to operate their vehicles.
3. Start monitoring this forum to field some of the legitimate complaints.

But in the meantime, there ain't a damned thing any of us can do to help you in terms of communicating with Tesla. We see no point in constantly whining about it here. And it is not all legit.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

+1 @dmm1240

You have alot more patients to type all of that than i do. Thanks.

dmm1240 | 20. august 2019

Not really. I'm tired of reading this stuff. If you look above, I finally blew a gasket about it. IMO, most of it is crap with the national dealership association behind it, if not them then the legacy car companies. Tesla is eating their lunch and they know it. The reason I think it might be the dealerships is -- using their old school thinking and lack of imagination -- they assume EVs require the same level of service as the ICE vehicles they know. Ergo, attack Tesla by trying to spread it around that after the sale you're on your own.

Tesla just opened 25 new service centers in the 2nd quarter. Does that sound like a company that's sitting on its hands? Of course not.

I really hate trolls and we have more than our share here.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

"they assume EVs require the same level of service as the ICE vehicles they know"

This

TeslaTap.com | 20. august 2019

@rxlawdude - I don't think anyone here is calling out everyone who posts, but a few that seem to rant about how awful service and then admit they never scheduled an appointment or had Tesla even look at an issue. Those are ones that need to be called out.

I have no problem with an owner saying they had some problem and wonder if anyone else has suggestions on how to fix it. That's quite different than starting with Tesla is the evilest company they have ever seen and feel Tesla should be sued and want a class-action lawsuit. At the same time, that "owner" is unwilling to have Tesla even look at the issue. It makes it look like a fake owner who has a different agenda.

Many of us help owners every day (and we're not paid a dime - just common courtesy). A few posters rants endlessly every chance they get. This is a small attempt to counteract that crap.

andy.connor.e | 20. august 2019

A very tiny minority of very outspoken users, who may or may not be actual owners, have almost identical posts as @TT and @dmm have stated. No one is saying ALL complaints are FUD. That was very specifically stated in which was ignored into a derogatory generalized statement that was never said. The FUD is very obvious. If its not obvious, you may not spend alot of time on here.

@dmm also makes a very good point that you should really take into consideration. Asking yourself why someone is posting a complaint, which is in itself a 100% rant complaint that is not asking for suggestions, but is declaring something low quality or lacking and assigning a blame to Tesla when we dont even know what actually happened. Having a Temper-Tantrum on forums that are not checked by Tesla doesnt do anything, so why do it? There must be a reason why that person wants us to read what they are writing. Because it has pretty much zero net value to anyone who owns a Tesla, or anyone who is interested in buying.

carlk | 20. august 2019

@dmm1240

Like you I hate trolls and I dislike troll defenders even more. Trolls at least have a purpose but troll defenders are you really that clueless?

Tesla-David | 20. august 2019

@dmm1240, nice post. Trolls posting FUD, especially their defenders need to be called out. It may be true that some parts of the country may be experiencing service issues, but I am confident that it will get better in those rare places. I can say definitively that up here in Seattle where we have lots of Tesla's, the service I have experienced over almost 7 years has been outstanding. No issues over that period. I have never had a problem getting attention with any issues I have brought to their attention.

Wattsworth | 20. august 2019

@rxlawdude "You are saying that EVERYONE who posts documented issues with service, or inability to reach a human by phone, are FUDsters?"

I read the OP twice trying to find 'EVERYONE.' Didn't see EVERYONE. Did see 'rash of.'

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rash

"A large number of instances in a short period" seems appropriate.

Mike83 | 20. august 2019

The trolls and their astroturfers are obvious to those of us who've been around. There are the wolves in sheeps clothing as well. The FUD must continue to keep the Stock down since 40 million shares need to be bought back($9 billion at price now) that are shorted along with declining ICE and gas/diesel sales.
They will have new shit to toss and it gets washed off again and again. But it doesn't seem to work as well like the boy who cried wolf.

rxlawdude | 20. august 2019

Guys, you are sticking your head in the sand if you think that even legitimate owners don't get the FUD and troll labels.

This place is becoming a microcosm of the USA.

carlk | 20. august 2019

There are trolls and there are legit owners. What is so hard for you to understand? Yes too bad the country got too many people like you.

TeslaG | 20. august 2019

I'm not sure why you guys are trying to bully RX. To me he is not defending trolls, but just saying that not everyone who talks shit about Tesla are tolls and trying to create FUD. I'm sure there are people getting paid to put FUD out there, but it doesnt mean every negative post is a FUD. Those that are attacking him by saying he is worst then the trolls are on the other end of the spectrum imo. Most of us can tell apart the real post to the fake ones, but most are real, but the fake ones are just louder.

I love my T3 and i absorb helpful information from the forum, but cut off all the noise. You guys can come at me as a troll, but i'm almost 50, and can take it, first post and all. I do not know RX or any other person here, but felt like i had to post because of the bullying.

Magic 8 Ball | 20. august 2019

There are legit owners who are whiners and/or trolls. Those that come to a party to try and take everyone else down with their misery are some of the worst types of trolls there are.

carlk | 20. august 2019

" I do not know RX or any other person here,"

Lol....

TeslaG | 20. august 2019

i dont know carlk or any other person here, but i'm glad i made you laugh out loud (do we know each other?). This is my last post on this thread and i'm moving on. Let real owners post about their opinions and experiences without the bullying, period.

Magic 8 Ball | 20. august 2019

Trying to tell others what to do is bullying, period. Pot calling kettle.

carlk | 20. august 2019

And amid all the unjust in the world someone would register and post on an obscure forum to help "RX" he does not know is really the funniest thing I heard today.

Magic 8 Ball | 20. august 2019

It never ceases to amaze me when others try to tell others what to do and how to behave and they call others bullies.

Dramsey | 20. august 2019

Hm. Fake accounts? But doesn't Tesla verify that only Tesla owners can post here?

rxlawdude | 20. august 2019

Thanks, usual suspects, for proving my point, and thanks @TeslaG for a breath of objectivity.

andy.connor.e | 21. august 2019

"I do not know RX or any other person here, but felt like i had to post because of the bullying."

Bullying? Not even close. RX is acting like we are generalizing people who report problems with their cars. Plenty of topics i do not get involved with because they are not the typical temper-tantrum related not really an actual problem from someone probably not actually an owner. If you dont like discussion the forums are not for you, because a conversation between people in which people disagree, is not bullying.

theo181 | 21. august 2019

My one service experience with my Model 3 was pretty much perfect. I had a stress crack in the glass roof panel that appeared over the front passenger seat. I took it in, found that it was covered by warrantee, had an appointment to have it fixed three days later. Tesla even gave me Uber credit to go home home for a few hours as they did the work on the day of repair. They had the part, the work was good, and I was treated very well.

It was as good as any experience I've had at a traditional dealership...if not better.

TeslaTap.com | 21. august 2019

@theo181 - Thanks for posting. Most owners are quite happy with Tesla's service.

I'm sure there are a few owners that have a legitimate beef, but this thread is not in any way complaining about those. It's really focused on those that spew extreme unfounded complaints that service is awful, but those same individuals admit they have not even set up an appointment or let Tesla address the issue. Not sure how any real owner can defend such annoying crap.

rxlawdude | 21. august 2019

@TTap, because the usual suspects reflexively attack anyone who posts about a problem. There are legion examples of this behavior across these fora.
The attack goes something like "you are a troll!" or "I've never had that problem" or a litany of other gainsays.

That's a fact. But more disturbing is the attempt to rationalize it by becoming even more strident. Sad.

Xerogas | 21. august 2019

@Dramsey: "Hm. Fake accounts? But doesn't Tesla verify that only Tesla owners can post here?"
------
Nope. Anyone can reply to an existing thread.

mos6507 | 21. august 2019

"Probably not actually real owners."

Every time I duck in here I see a further and further advanced case-study in denial.

nwfan | 21. august 2019

I agree with many of the customer service failing at Tesla. Try getting an issue resolve with account,
purchased item, upgrade to FSD, etc. I haven't been able to get anyone on the phone.
Send emails no answer.

My recent example. Look at Tesla account page and look at your Model S car.
All my information disappeared. No longer shows my FSD invoice and that the car has it.
Looking at printed copy of the invoice and my credit card purchase. Try getting Tesla to fix it.
Impossible.

Unlike some on here. I have 2 Tesla cars in my garage right now (purchased 3 T's). I have watched Tesla
customer deteriorate since purchasing my 1st Model S. Remember the gift bags?
Guess that stopped starting 2017. Or if you went in to have your car service and a loaner would
be waiting? Or if you called the Service Center you could talk to a human? Or goodwill care
of your car for extra items. Latest Service visit for A/C smells on my Model S with 13k miles
and Tesla wants to charge me $450 to correct.
At least with my previous 2 Chevy Volts someone always answered the phone and provided me
with help in scheduling and provided me with a free loaner.
Time to hire George back to manage customer service or even the previous guy who went to Lyft.

reed_lewis | 22. august 2019

@nwfan - But but but. You need to understand the 'Tesla can do not wrong' response. They think that every issue can be resolved via scheduling an appointment with your phone, and that will take care of all issues that you might have. If you have not scheduled an appointment for service in the future, then it is your problem.

I have said many times, that Tesla is taking great care of the normal issues. The issue is the exceptions.
- Your car is not drivable? Good luck getting anyone locally on the phone to help.
- You have an issue with the store about an item not delivered? Good luck getting any answer from that.
- etc., etc., etc

I really like my two Tesla cars (S, 3) so much that when my wife totaled her 3, we replaced it with another one. But the customer service from corporate has gone completely downhill for handling the 'exceptions' that always occur.

@nwfan - I have no issues with some of the things you point out though:
- Gift bags - As long as my car is perfect, I do not need that.
- Service extras for free - If the issue is something that should be a warranty repair, then it should be covered, but Tesla cannot give everything for free.
- Loaners - I still get loaners for service, but they are arranged through Enterprise which is fine with me.

The people in the local stores and service centers are attempting to do a great job. Even they complain about the lack of support from the corporate offices.

andy.connor.e | 22. august 2019

omg @mos is back!

lilbean | 22. august 2019

This is unfortunate. We want an S but crickets from Tesla regarding our Powerwall isn’t helping. They upgraded our main panel and disconnected our solar panels. It’s been over three weeks. :(

Madatgascar | 22. august 2019

@rxlawdude - I’m not one of those who reflexively attack anyone who posts about a problem. But OMG the astroturfing can be so obvious. There was recently a post from “Apostle” (a reply to a thread that has since been deleted) that listed an absurd litany of repairs, then claimed that his receipt for the work was an “illegible” small slip printout. So, of course, he couldn’t prove his story. Really? Anyone ever get a receipt like that from Tesla? Taco Bell, maybe.

Of course people here are going to be suspicious, and occasionally an innocent person with a real lemon will get shouted down. There is nothing like this on other car enthusiast forums because nowhere else on earth is there so much money riding on one company’s failure.

I think we owe it to the newbies to explain why some of the folks here are so strident. There is undeniably a misinformation campaign underway that has recently made “service” and “reliability” its central theme now that “Tesla is about to die” is no longer credible.

reed_lewis | 22. august 2019

lilbean - If you email me at my name here (at) hotmail I can give you a few names and numbers of people at the Solar/powerwall office who are very helpful.

My experience with them has been quite good now that I have people who are helpful and take good care of me. One thing is the red referral powerwalls are hard to come by. I told them that I did not care about the color, and the regular ones were fine with me,

andy.connor.e | 22. august 2019

The most obvious "astroturfing" is when someone makes a topic that is a total rant complaint as explained previously, and they NEVER leave a follow up comment to their topic.

nipper2 | 23. august 2019

@lilbean where are you located? I live in Ocean County NJ and had Solar panels and 4 Power Walls and I have had no issues if you want I know one of the Tesla Electricians in my area and could pass your information on