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Very disappointed

Very disappointed

I am so upset with my P85DL. I have really enjoyed my Tesla and been a big cheerleader of the brand. I'm hurting now.

65,000 miles not a lot of miles, but charging is now very slow at a supercharger. Hard to take on a trip now.
My big screen will not come on - it went black permanently, reset will not fix it
My car is very slow to start - takes several minutes then I have to press the brake 2-3-4-5 times and pray.
I have stopped driving for fear it will strand me.
The nearest service center is 350 miles away, car might not make it that far, so.
I can't get service on the phone.
I must schedule online.
I want to ask about a Ranger if they can replace the computer and screen, versus hiring a transporter to come and get the car if a Ranger cannot fix it. I need to ask questions to see what I need to do.

Bighorn | February 4, 2020

You need a new MCU and a ranger can do it. Two came 750 miles to fix mine a few weeks ago. Scheduled with the app. Requested a ranger. Car is better than new and got an LTE upgrade in the process.

2015P90DI | February 4, 2020

Schedule the appointment, they'll instruct you from there. As with all things Tesla, they want a commitment before talking to you. New orders, service, anything, have to book/reserve/schedule online FIRST, then they'll deal with you as appropriate for your situation.

Always schedule first, complain later!

Anthony J. Parisio | February 5, 2020

As they said, schedule with the app. Tesla will take it from there. They will even talk to the car to see what it needs. In your case the car won't respond and they will know you are right about the MCU.

miked | February 5, 2020

I’m in the same situation. 2015 85d. 68k miles MCU went out. Waiting on service soonest available appointment is 2/11 told repair cost to be $3k

Pungoteague_Dave | February 5, 2020

This is why we upgraded last year - the MCU thing scared us. Given that it is a known design error (the firmware electronics can't handle the number of read/writes after a period), and something that is eventually going to impact all (pre-Raven/3?) Teslas, this should be a recall. Expensive, yes, but the right thing to do. Hell, VW bought our son's '10 VW Jetta diesel back in 2017 with 100k miles for at least 2x market value ($14k for a car we bought for $22k new).

Yodrak. | February 5, 2020

"it is a known design error (the firmware electronics can't handle the number of read/writes after a period), and something that is eventually going to impact all (pre-Raven/3?) Teslas, this should be a recall."

I wonder, is it a design error or is it a wear item, like windshield wipers, tires, and brakes? True, a significant difference is that the part is soldered in and can't be replaced independent of the whole MCU.

On the other hand, electronics parts either die quickly and get replace under warranty or last a long time but still have to be replaced and don't qualify as a recall because things do have a lifetime. Electronics parts usually have new and better versions available on a shorter cycle than their lifetime, i.e. the replacement part is better than the original.

flight505 | February 5, 2020

Is the jostling of the CPU causing these CPU's to go out? Will the second CPU last 65K for the same reasons?

A new battery costs about 15 grand I think my Model S charges slow on a supercharger. As a result, I don't feel good about my Tesla. What is the tech on this? Is something wrong? Did Tesla slow it down on an update? The charging speed is the same at home. What happened?

barrykmd | February 5, 2020

Yodrak. | February 5, 2020
True, a significant difference is that the part is soldered in and can't be replaced independent of the whole MCU.

Soldered parts CAN be removed/replaced. It's just not easy. Two ways to do it (I'm assuming it's not a SMT chip):
1. Cut each pin from the body of the chip, then unsolder each pin, one by one.
2. Create a custom tool that makes contact with each pin at the same time, heat, apply solder wick, and remove.

This seems to be one from the Apple playbook - when a part component (eg., battery) dies, throw away the item and buy a new one.

And contrary to Teslatap's comment about this being a rare problem, there are lots of reports on TMC.

GHammer | February 5, 2020

@flight505 "I think my Model S charges slow on a supercharger. As a result, I don't feel good about my Tesla. What is the tech on this? Is something wrong? Did Tesla slow it down on an update? The charging speed is the same at home. What happened?"

After the Asian battery fires last summer, Tesla sent an update that lowered the peak supercharge rate for the original version batteries (pre-100's). They have also tightened up the temperature control for the batteries that lowers the supercharge and regen levels for cold batteries.

flight505 | February 6, 2020

"it is a known design error (the firmware electronics can't handle the number of read/writes after a period), and something that is eventually going to impact all (pre-Raven/3?) Teslas, this should be a recall."

Has such a design error happened on other makes of cars?

Is the "firmware electronics" outside the CPU? If so, why do I have to buy a new CPU? This is expensive. Who is responsible for the firmware electronics? Is this the hardware with which Tesla installed the CPU?

These CPU problems do not address my battery issues. Correct? I paid far more money 5 years ago for this P85DL than a new P100DL costs today. To feel good about owning this car and owning a Tesla, I need a good battery and a good CPU. I think I've paid enough money to be taken care of for design flaws. If not, I can buy another electric car marque later on and for now go back to driving a gas car, which I don't want to do, but the slow battery charging makes this car much less viable for trips, I don't trust it and don't want to drive with the "I might get stranded" feeling I am experiencing.

Ev | February 6, 2020

Agreening with GHammer. Your car is supercharging slow because Tesla slowed it down via update. This is un-acceptable. Lots on folks on the same boat. I now have to take my ICE car on longer trips because charging is too slow.

Silver2K | February 6, 2020

The slow charging situation seems to have been applied to the 85s and down. My P90D is still charging the same as the day I got it as a CPO.

The MCU replacement is 2200, not 3k, miked.

Flight, cars have issues, tesla vehicles are not invincible.

TeslaTap.com | February 6, 2020

@GHammer - Not sure I'm an outlier, but around the September update, my Supercharging has gone up a lot on my 2016 S75. Used to be limited to 85-95 kW and I got 122 kW in November. I started at a low SOC and had a paired stall to myself. This was after driving 150 miles, so the battery was already warm. Temps were about 60F. So there may be some combinations that do better than before, and others that do worse.

@flight505 - The flash memory for code and other data is on a board made by Nvidia. It has the CPU, flash memory and RAM. All items are soldered in, as the severe vehicle environment requires soldering parts rather than using sockets, or you'd have endless problems. As far as I can tell, the Nvidia board is out of production and you can't buy the board Tesla uses. As is common with all auto manufacturers, they don't do part swaps at service - they replace the entire module and in some cases, ship it back for repair and enter into refurb stock.

I'm not ready to call it a design error, as the parts function as designed. It may have been the best available back in 2009/2010 when it was designed in. All the additional features over the years may have contributed to some of the issues we see today. It's unclear how many owners are having the problem. There are about 330,000 cars with MCU1. Still, it sucks if your MCU fails outside warranty.

Silver2K | February 6, 2020

Also, my friends with Tesla vehicles say I'm not sympathetic to their vehicle issues at over 150k miles. :)

Should I be hugging and holding their hand after 150k miles?

rxlawdude | February 6, 2020

"I’m in the same situation. 2015 85d. 68k miles MCU went out."
106K miles here, 2015 70D. Still working fine. Supercharging still >100kW.

akikiki | February 6, 2020

TT, wasn't their a report or confirmation by one of the EV magazines (I think it quoted Jason Hughes saying) Tesla had stated they reduced the logging and read/write to the eMMC recently? So many of those 330,000+ cars will are less likely to reach that failure point.

flight505 | February 6, 2020

Does $2200 cover the travel expenses (or mileage) of the mobile service? Tesla charges $175 per hour, I believe.

Will a new CPU restore supercharging rate?

akikiki | February 6, 2020

Unlikely, newer MCU replacement has nothing to do with the HV battery.

flight505 | February 6, 2020

What warrants a battery replacement under warranty, which is 8 years and unlimited miles?

Tesla won't replace it due to slow supercharging, so my discontent is not going away.

Later model batteries have different chemistry - by are stukk the 18650s, correct?

Silver2K | February 6, 2020

Supercharging will stay the same after mcu replacement.

2200 covers everything.

Chemistry has changed over the years

Bighorn | February 6, 2020

Rangers don’t charge for transit, even from 750 miles away. Sales tax bumped my total just over $2000 3 weeks ago.

Darthamerica | February 6, 2020

Yodrak it's a design issue. They didn't account for the amount of read write cycles when they selected the BOM(bill of materials). They also didn't perform sufficient Monte Carlo methodology and HALT(Highly accelerated life testing) to catch the failure during development. It happens. But the issue is 10x worse with automotive applications. It's a lesson learned and they'll get passed this. But any cars with the old parts should be recalled and fixed in good faith.

Darthamerica | February 6, 2020

Offering a discount to MCU1 owners who want to trade their cars would also be a good way to make it right.

GHammer | February 6, 2020

"Tesla won't replace it due to slow supercharging, so my discontent is not going away."

The actual overall charge time isn't that much longer, 20%-80%, which is a typical road trip charge cycle, is only 7 minutes longer. There are plenty of us who still do long road trips just fine.

akikiki | February 7, 2020

"wasn't their a report" - there. My redneck-cracker hillbilly past leaks through my makeup too often - ya'll

flight505 | February 7, 2020

Tesla app on my phone only lets me select a service center - can't find anything about mobile here. I hate using my phone for this. Prefer my computer. Very tired of inserting my address and no mobile option.

barrykmd | February 7, 2020

Make the appointment, state the problem. They will call you to arrange mobile service, if possible.

redacted | February 7, 2020

I've always wondered: Why do people use fairly useless titles such as "So Disappointed" for their posts, when they could instead say something like "So disappointed in supercharging degradation?" Is it because you think people will be intrigued by your title?

jesssstuckey | February 7, 2020

Disappointment about degradation of supercharger degradation here as well. Made last road trip more stressful. Always was told charging will get better with time and it almost did for a bit. Now there is a big difference in charge rate in my 2013 model s60. This after having to fight to have faulty charges removed for charging and had to fight for the free supercharging. To call it free,and then limit to near dysfunctional, is ludicrous. Tesla, please fix this.

flight505 | February 7, 2020

I've always wondered: Why do people use fairly useless titles such as "So Disappointed" for their posts, when they could instead say something like "So disappointed in supercharging degradation?" Is it because you think people will be intrigued by your title?

This is about more than the supercharger charge times - also about the MCU replacement.

akikiki | February 8, 2020

ditto

jimglas | February 8, 2020

So disappointed that I flagged it

Tldickerson | February 8, 2020

I flag all of jim's post now. He just waste to much space here.

flight505 | February 9, 2020

Is there a mobile APP? I tried the APP and as instructed inserted an explanation that I wanted mobile, but at the end I have to insert a time for my appointment, which is not mobile, so I think Tesla will be expecting me to show up for service on Monday morning. My center screen stays blank and start up is long and suspect to stranding me, so I don't drive the car.

Bighorn | February 9, 2020

I texted saying I wanted a ranger when they scheduled me for a service center appointment.

Pungoteague_Dave | February 9, 2020

@TeslaTap.com "I'm not ready to call it a design error, as the parts function as designed. It may have been the best available back in 2009/2010 when it was designed in. All the additional features over the years may have contributed to some of the issues we see today."

I agree that this likely snuck up on Tesla and that it did not show up during testing and prototyping or even during the first year or two of MS sales. But just like the windshield leaks on VW's on the 1980's that destroyed many voltage regulators and IC boards (and for which VW performed a recall), some design errors only appear over time. When they are clearly a "mistake" that immediately gets designed out of newer cars, it isn't okay IMHO to say "oops" and "pay $2,200" to fix a failing electronic component for which the owner could not possibly have been negligent or guilty of misuse. When it occurs to you, you did nothing but drive the car, and it quit due to a design oversight, failure to predict, failure to understand the then-technology, or whatever it was - in any case it happened inside Tesla's engineering suite, not at the consumer level.

Put another way, when a firmware engineer retroactively swears and bangs his palm on his forehead after a discovery like this, the hope is generally that a reflash or firmware/os update will fix the problem. Tesla would do that in the next software update and include it in the car's original price if possible. However, this design error requires hardware too. I get that after a lot of time and miles (ten years?) there should be some shared manufacturer/consumer financial responsibility for design mistakes, but many of these things are being reported as failing after three or four years. No computer chip should be caused to fail by read-write processes after a few years use, and Tesla cannot be happy that it missed this up front. Yes, it happens, but when it does, it should be on the software/firmware developer, not the owner.

HP recently (2018) paid us $2,172 for two laptops we owned from 2002 - at full retail price, because of repeated LCD screen failures, even though ours had never completely failed (did have some dimming) and were already out of service, sitting in the basement - literally $2 grand falling out of the sky due to a class action lawsuit. Of course we cashed the check, but did actually feel a little guilty. I would not feel any compunction in expecting Tesla to fully fund a failed MCU on a 2014+ MS or MX. It's the right thing for them to do.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/01/29/hp_pavillion_lawsuit_settlement/

Tldickerson | February 9, 2020

Amen...Pungoteague_Dave
You are so right!

Darthamerica | February 9, 2020

Tesla needs to make this right.

NKYTA | February 9, 2020

Surely not to you DA.

flight505 | February 10, 2020

From the Tesla text today, the service APP does not allow me to schedule mobile service. I can't get service people on the phone to schedule. HAVE to use the APP on a cell phone - not computer. But, Tesla does not program in their APP to schedule mobile service for people like me, 350 miles from a service center. I hope they are "up my way" before the cows come home. I've been driving my BMW now for 2 weeks.

"Typically you are able to select mobile service. Unfortunately there is not a designated team for your location and it is shared between various mobile teams. This why you are unable to select mobile from your location. I have your information passed along and they will reach out when they are preparing a trip up your way. Thank you kindly, we hope you have a great day."

Bighorn | February 10, 2020

I waited 16 days since I’m 750 miles from the ranger’s home since he was already booked out and has a prescribed loop I imagine. But it only came about after contact was established—it wasn’t offered on the app. I just booked an appointment with the service center in my preferred Ranger’s area even though it was a bit further out on the calendar than a closer service center. To get it done sooner would have meant a flatbed for me since charging was non operative. Saved a couple grand by waiting on the ranger.

flight505 | February 10, 2020

They texted me to approve mobile service time, which I said yes, and then sent a text to approve a $200 charge for installing passenger side airbag, which I looked up is a recall and listed by government to be installed by Tesla for free on my car. So it is not free on mobile service? I asked and they don't text back.

Silver2K | February 10, 2020

It's free via mobile service or at the service center.

They probably screwed up.

Bighorn | February 10, 2020

They’ve done airbag recall on a previous visit. No charge even well out of warranty by law.

Haggy | February 11, 2020

"I wonder, is it a design error or is it a wear item, like windshield wipers, tires, and brakes? "

It's a design error when a wear item can't be replaced without replacing an unrelated component that's not a wear item and is not worn out. If they had designed the memory so that it could be swapped, that wouldn't have been a problem. There are types of swappable memory that should be more than fast enough.