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Rear cross traffic alert?

Rear cross traffic alert?

RCTA rear cross traffic alert , many of us have it on other cars, it seems like Tesla could add this feature through a software update using existing sensorsan cameras.
This would be imo another basic safety feature included in all cars to keep them competive with the market.

thedrisin | 24 mars 2019

There are some drivers on this forum that don't want or see the need for any electronic safety aids, such as cross traffic alert or BSM, and defend Tesla not to include them. Maybe another driver of lesser skill will back into them because they don't have it either.

Teslajani | 7 maj 2019

If safety tech is a judgment on driver skills, then why have traction control, airbags and anti-lock brakes? A "Good" driver can do without those as well...

howard | 7 maj 2019

@ Teslajani | If safety tech is a judgment on driver skills, then why have traction control, airbags and anti-lock brakes? A "Good" driver can do without those as well...

Yes, but not as well especially under panic conditions. How can a good driver provide his own airbag? Pillow?? It is often the other "Bad" driver that causes the need for ABS and Airbags.

garuda | 8 maj 2019

I have seen this thread a while ago and didn't bother much until I hit a car when backing up in parking lot and totally didn't see the car at all in my camera and also no sensor warning on car coming in and couldn't really see myself because I was parked next to a humongous pickup truck, damaged trunk, bumper and quarter panel :(

thedrisin | 8 maj 2019

Poor driving skills?

Magic 8 Ball | 8 maj 2019

I think it would be cool to have a personal driving caddy. Equip them with one of the flashlights with the cool long orange cones on the end (like the guys on the airport runways use) and have them get out and direct surrounding traffic and guide you in. That would make things a lot easier.

msmith55 | 8 maj 2019

The problem with rear cross traffic alert is the limited range and angle of view, normally this is done with a wide angle rear radar which the Tesla does not have, and the cameras don't quite give enough coverage. It would be nice to have this safety feature.

syclone | 10 maj 2019

The point here is that cars selling for half the cost of Tesla have had rear cross traffic alert for years. How could the weenies at Tesla miss this one?

drm.mhk.ks | 28 maj 2019

I believe that there are two angles here which accentuate why rear cross traffic alert would be particularly helpful for the Model 3. First, the car sits fairly low, which makes seeing around taller vehicles parked adjacent much more difficult. Secondly, the rear windows are quite small and trying to clear traffic over one's right shoulder is challenging. Again, this is coming from experiencing the help provided by the rear cross traffic alert in another vehicle.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

Some, including myself, think rear cross traffic alerts systems are bunk.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/aaa-rear-cross-traffic-alert-systems-...

howard | 29 maj 2019

M8B, of course you don’t. Old news. If Tesla is different it is because everyone else is wrong to you. Fan on!

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@howard Did you read the article?

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

What car is half the cost of a S+ Model 3 and has these features?

dmastro | 29 maj 2019

@SM8B: I've read the article and think it's fairly accurate. Of course blind spot monitoring doesn't work where the sensors can't "see" the oncoming traffic. I understand the limitations of the system, but I also *love* bsm and it's saved my wife and me from several incidents.

We have BSM on our big 'ol SUV. When I'm backing out of the driveway, or especially from a parking stall in a crowded parking lot, the sensors on the butt-end of the car clear the cars and landscaping around me 10' before I do, well before I can see bikes and cars coming. Not to mention it can "see" both directions at once, something I haven't mastered yet. Almost every time I drive it, I get a warning beep long before I can actually see cross traffic coming. Now... I'm a safe and cautious driver and would in almost every case recognize the traffic and avoid an accident, but I value having the extra tool and absolutely believe it helps drivers who are less aware than I. And I definitely miss it in my Tesla.

@andy: Ford Focus, Mazda Model 3, Honda Fit, Chevy Cruze... and so on. I don't know specific pricing for these cars, but I'm certain they all sell for far less than a Tesla.

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

So you can buy a brand new Ford Focus, Mazda 3, Honda Fit or Chevy Cruze for ~$20k that has rear cross traffic alert?

TeslaTap.com | 29 maj 2019

@andy - Perhaps a 10 year old MB on its last legs :) Then again why don't any other cars at any price have far more important safety features that Tesla includes? Tesla provides Side collision avoidance and emergency lane departure avoidance for free on every model, even the SR.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@dmastro It is all about overall effectiveness. The path to FSD seems to be more and more driver aides but I see many of these aides as becoming crutches that people come to depend on. For those that have been using it successfully there are others who come to depend on it so much they will back up without looking at all.

I assume that TESLA will put in the detection for FSD and that they could implement some sort of function right now so it would be nice to know why they have not implemented.

howard | 29 maj 2019

M8B, yes I read it. To me and apparently most other major car manufacturers any safety aid is better than none.

Yes my son’s 20k VW Jetta has cross traffic alert and according to him has made a difference as it has often with me in my other cars that have it!!!

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

actually, @syclone said that.

Sounds like its not true as i just went to hondas website, and the base model Honda Fit is not even an automatic transmission. Its nearly $19k for the trim level that includes the whole Honda Sensing suite, which is Collision Mitigation Braking System (CMBS), Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC), Lane Keeping Assist System (LKAS), and Road Departure Mitigation System (RDM). Neither of the 4 systems have any rear detection, and all of those systems only help you hold your lane or apply break pressure when it determines a frontal collision is unavoidable.

You are all not appreciating Teslas Autopilot software's level of Technology.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@howard Yes, many car manufacturers will take your money and sell you something you think you need, nothing wrong with that, I guess?

dmastro | 29 maj 2019

First, while I wrote BSM in my post above, I meant CTA.

@M8B: I guess that's the difference between us. I see advanced safety features as tools that can increase safety, not crutches that people rely on. I understand that some people will be lazy and rely on them, but I believe that those people would be lazy and unaware anyway, so they're better off having some assistance rather than none.

From what I've read here (so take it with a grain of salt), Tesla did not install hardware such as long/wide range sensors that would be compatible with CTA, so it may not be as simple as just activating the feature.

@Andy: I didn't make the initial claim that cars with CTA could be found for half the price. I simply pointed out relatively inexpensive cars that I know have the feature, and all cost less than a Tesla. By the way, I don't think the S or X have CTA (correct me if I'm wrong); if so, there are certainly cars with CTA for less than 1/2 - 1/3 the cost of a Tesla.

I think the point the poster was trying to make is that CTA is available in many cars that are less expensive and lux than a Model 3. I'm sure you understood that and argued the semantics to avoid that point.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@dmastro I am data driven, if my insurance company, data driven also, is not offering breaks for having these "features" I am going to assume the data shows no significant improvement or any real detriment (pretty much what the article is saying).

If the TESLA cannot detect then FSD will not be possible.

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

@dmastro. Dude.... I literally said @syclone said that. SO defensive for no reason

dmastro | 29 maj 2019

@M8B: I appreciate data but am not ruled by it. My insurance company can't tell me about my experiences with BMS, CTA, and other safety technologies that have clearly provided safety benefits.

Also, insurance is a market driven business. There isn't necessarily a correlation between those features and premium cost.

Understanding your desire for data, from a Forbes article that discussed the reluctance of insurance companies to provide discounts for safety features:

"They looked at research done by the federal government’s National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (which is funded by the insurance industry) and the American Automobile Association to see whether these technologies had been validated as being effective in saving lives, reducing crashes and preventing car theft.

The analysis showed that seven of the nine safety features had some degree of proven value. The two that haven’t shown conclusive results, according to The Zebra, are heads-up displays and night vision."

So even a study partially funded by the insurance industry concluded that these features are effective.

Lastly, I agree. I too wonder about the viability and effectiveness of FSD. I'm not sure how it's going to be "ready for prime time" until cars are generally all autonomous and connected with one another, given the limitations of sensors (which will hopefully continue to improve by leaps and bounds) and better integration with the unpredictable nature of human drivers - we do weird things.

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

The insurance industry would benefit from reduced crashes, as there would be less cost that the insurance companies need to cover. Insurance companies benefit from no accidents. Like health insurance benefits when you dont get sick.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@dmastro We can piss back and forth for many days, months, years, on this and google for support on both our positions. Until the opinions are translated into value (cheaper premiums) I will go with my opinion of these features as being something I do not want to pay for because others want it.

dmastro | 29 maj 2019

@andy: You posted that while I was responding to your first post.

And just because there is one feature we think would be nice to have, doesn't mean we can't appreciate the overall software package. It's not mutually exclusive.

I love my Tesla, and I love most everything about it. But there are certain things I don't love and I think can be improved. I've never had a perfect car and don't think I ever will. I get the feeling too many fanatics on this site think when someone makes 1 suggestion, or criticizes one feature, that it's meant to be an indictment against Tesla as a whole.

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

not sure why you were responding for someone elses argument

dmastro | 29 maj 2019

@M8B: That's the beauty of being people. We don't need to agree. If the manufacturers find that these features will drive sales, they will install them in the cars.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@dmastro Agreed, another beauty of being people is we don't have to be responsible for anything as long as there are other people to blame.

howard | 29 maj 2019

Magic 8 Ball
@howard Yes, many car manufacturers will take your money and sell you something you think you need, nothing wrong with that, I guess?

No, But Tesla can take 3 times my money and provide way less than I have on my lowly 2019 Volt. Currently I don’t use any of the Tesla technology because it is still Beta and more dangerous to me. Go figure.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@howard Really, did you buy the TESLA without motors, because I can drive circle around any Volt out there. How are you still alive if you drive a TESLA?

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

@howard

There is alot about a Tesla that is objectively better than a Volt or Bolt than just the driving assist software.

howard | 29 maj 2019

Sure the Tesla out performs the Volt but when basic features don’t work as well it is less of a vehicle period!! I know this makes no sense to you Tesla fanatics but I drive both back to back every couple of weeks. I am currently on Coronado Island having driven the Volt over from our Gilbert home. There is a big difference in just the adaptive cruise alone. Not to mention things like the intuitive blind spot warning system in the mirrors. Mentioning blind reminds me of how this forum operates toward Tesla. Blind allegiance without first hand experience that is rationally considered. .

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@howard Your mission is to compare everything against a Volt or Bolt and sell them as being superior. You are on a TESLA enthusiast forum with that pitch for a very long time. I commend you for your comedy but you have me laughed out. Stop it already I am peeing in my pants with your ridiculous humor.

andy.connor.e | 29 maj 2019

I dont even discuss the features portion probably because i've never had them. Arguably never needed them since i've never been in an accident nor pulled over before. You could say that they 'help', but maybe it wouldnt have mattered without them. If they dont work, dont rely on them. I've been on this forum early enough that people would make the same argument about other companies who make $50k cars and can get their panel joints aligned but apparently "Tesla Cant". Its all a bunch of garbage, because no manufacturer is perfect. Perhaps you had a good experience. Because in my experience, basic features on cars dont work alot of the times.

I've been in a 1 year old van where for some reason the cruise control decided it didnt want to work and there was literally nothing we could do to get it to work, even looked through the manual for an answer. 2 year old Lincoln MKX has an automatic mirror positioning, and half the time they wouldnt go back to the correct position, and everytime it rained the mirrors would start moving uncontrollably. These are just a few examples. But you dont even know what you're talking about if you try to say that "other companies can do something why cant tesla".

Maybe the auto industry has gotten so uncompetitive that people wont buy a car unless they're all the same. Its more of a cult relationship with a company today more than it is actually wanting the vehicle for a specific purpose or feature. Tesla happens to be all electric.

TeslaTap.com | 29 maj 2019

The Volt is a fine car - just can't be made for the price sold and is the prime reason GM dropped it. Now I'm less sure of the value against the 3, but there are many differences that matter to some and not others. The Volt styling is rather blah to me, but not bad. The 3 has great styling, but perhaps that unimportant to some.

Then there is a wide range of features such as the huge 15" display, cool venting system, free features added for years after purchase, dashcam, sentry mode, DC fast charging, AP hardware, 8 cameras and more. The list of 3 features over the Volt keeps going and growing. I find the center rear seat fairly poor in the Volt (tunnel) and fine in the 3 - but if you never take three passengers in the rear seat, that may not be important. The Volt's smallish luggage space 10 sq ft, vs the 3's 15 ft is also a factor.

For safety, the 3 also has a lot more than the Volt, but the Volt is no slouch either. Both get great safety ratings although many standard safety features are optional on the Volt (and drive the cost up more). Clearly the Tesla is safer in a crash (no engine to be pushed into the cabin, nor gas to catch fire). The 3 also has various safety systems not on any other car such as side collision avoidance. Still some owners are not ready for the total EV takeover, and the Volt makes a great transition car - quite a bit better than most hybrids on the market.

Anyway, if Howard loves his Volt - more to him. Just few here are going to see the value against a Tesla, even if the Volt includes one or two features not on the 3.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

When we bought our Cmax energi one of the largest proponents of the Volt converted to the Cmax because it could go 3 across in the rear

https://cleantechnica.com/2012/10/11/gm-volt-com-creater-buys-ford-c-max...

RadOne | 29 maj 2019

I am a great driver and don't need any fancy technological aides, but I am in favor of everyone else having CTA so they don't hit me. Maybe not perfect system but if it prevents one car from hitting me, it is worth it.

syclone | 29 maj 2019

The fact is that The model 3 already has sub-par rear vision, especially on the passenger side. Citing questionable stats by AAA (even AAA admits that cross traffic alert systems are effective more than 1/2 the time), our resident Fudster has decided that if Tesla doesn't use it, it can't be any good. I have a very basic CTA system on my 2016 Toyota Camry. Once it starts to clear the cars next to it, it will warn about any oncoming danger, vehicle or pedestrian. Not perfect, but better than nothing at all.

RadOne | 29 maj 2019

I have it on all my other vehicles and insisted that my children have it on any car. IIt is better to have something that assists the driver than none at all. If all aids had to be perfect to be useful, there would not be any, and certainly no beta features.

dwakelee | 29 maj 2019

A see a few mentions here about how being a good driver can overcome the absence of something like the Rear Cross Traffic Alert feature, and almost defending its omission. When you get back to your parking spot and are pinned along side two giant Suburbans with tinted rear windows and their tall stance, there is just no seeing through them. The only option is to inch out slowly and hope for the best - really relying on the other drivers in the lot (or pedestrians) to see you pulling out and react to you. This is where the cross traffic alerts shine - giving you the information of their presence which you just wouldn't know otherwise. In a car allegedly equipped with a full sensor array capable of full self driving, this seems like a miss without an easy solution. The rear facing cameras are just not looking in the right place for that scenario.

I've experienced the Rear Cross Traffic Alert system in both an F150 and Caddy - it is a fantastic safety feature. In addition to the arrows on screen, the Caddy even rumbles the bottom seat cushion in the direction of the cross motion. Clearly the Teslas have way more capabilities in other regards, but I would totally take this over the recent not-ready-for-prime-time Emergency Lane Departure Avoidance that we were just graced with.

As others have mentioned, cross traffic alerts isn't something that can be added via a software update. Clearly they could add it with new production. In other vehicles the feature is typically implemented in rear tail lights - concealing the radar and providing the necessary angle and field of view. It would be totally awesome if Tesla also offered a retrofit with the option - say new tail lights with the integrated radar. Something similar to what they did with replacement of the dome light and the interior motion security feature. We can hope anyway.

SteveWin1 | 29 maj 2019

"I am a great driver and don't need any fancy technological aides"

In surveys, 2/3 of people rate themselves as "excellent" or "very good" drivers. By definition, half of people are below average drivers, so there's a good chance that you're a worse driver than you think you are.

howard | 29 maj 2019

M8B, while I know you won’t acknowledge it let’s just consider a few facts:

My 2016 Q3, 2017 Bolt, 2019 Volt and Son’s 2019 Jetta all have blind spot warning system built into the side view mirrors. Never have I had one fail to indicate when an object is in the blind field or false indicate when nothing is there. I have had numerous occasions where the Telsa does not detect a car in the blind spot and a couple of times it thought something was there. Not to mention that this is where you naturally are looking when considering a lane change. Not the center dash display. I DON’T USE IT at ALL on the Tesla!

My 2016 Q3, 2017 Bolt, 2019 Volt and Son’s 2019 Jetta all have cross traffic warning systems. The Tesla DOES NOT!

The Tesla Adaptive Cruise has and will hard brake when someone moving faster sweeps over directly in front of you.

The Tesla Adaptive Cruise will hard brake when approaching a slower car with a faster car going past you and you move over behind the faster car.

Both of the above conditions are repeatable and dangerous. My 2019 Volt Adaptive Cruise has never hard braked under these conditions. It paces better and anticipates far better than the Tesla. Frankly there is no comparison in the relaxed driving comfort in the Volt under adaptive cruise compared to the unpredictable nature of the Tesla.

The enhanced auto pilot is also unpredictable with sudden slow downs and often erratic lane lane tracking behaviors. I DO NOT USE EAP.

I am sharing very unbiased opinions that you can fully continue to ridicule and discount. Anytime you are going to be in AZ I am happy to make arrangements for you to drive my Volt.

I was planning on buying another Tesla for AZ until I actually spent some time driving what I consider to be a very Beta based vehicle. I seriously hope it gets better, but so far the updates are not where the car needs to be unless you are in to the entertainment features which I am most definitely not. Dog mode is nice for those that would actually leave their dog in the car. I don’t need or use sentry mode. There has been very little that actually improves the drivability aspect of the car. But there sure is a lot of hype that everyone is counting on coming to fruition. Except for Tesla Fanboy Fanatics and to those it is already here and perfect.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

@howard I considered a Volt when we bought our Cmax. I like the Volt, especially the lightning bolt badge, but found the visibility in the car piss poor (no wonder you need aides to drive it safely).

You seem to be blurring facts and opinions together. I am fully aware of the different features and it is all a matter of opinion if the features are improving overall safety of everyone.

When you continue to label people as fanboi fanatics (not a term of endearment or admiration) you are just showing yourself to be the dickhead you are. Oh boy here comes another call.

FISHEV | 29 maj 2019

@andy.connor.e "What car is half the cost of a S+ Model 3 and has these features?"

2015 Subaru Legacy with Eyesight. $25K
2019 Tesla AWD. $52k.

thedrisin | 29 maj 2019

@SteveWin1. I thought the sarcasm was evident. I agree with you. Tired of hearing the argument that rear CTA is not necessary, doesn't work, and you must not be a good driver if you use it. If you read my subsequent post, I have CTA on all my other vehicles. Personally, I find it very helpful. IMHO, lack of CTA and sideview mirror BSM indicators is unfortunate.

howard | 29 maj 2019

M8B, when you continue to blindly defend the Tesla without really listening or considering the obvious. If your only come back is to nit pick a single issue what else are you. The visibility on the 2019 Volt is much better than the 2013 and sorry it is most certainly not worse than the over the left shoulder view in the M3. You miss the whole point or more aptly just deny the glaring facts that the Tesla is not only missing common features on all my other cars the ones it does have are not safe. I like you am sincerely hoping theses features/issues improve. That is about all we apparently agree on.

Magic 8 Ball | 29 maj 2019

My defense of TESLA is with eyes wide open and working fine. The obvious is, the fact you are blind to, is the insurance companies are not giving breaks for having the features and they are the ones who determine efficacy and value on the features.

You have opinions on the efficacy of the features, and if they are safer, but your opinions are simply not facts.

howard | 29 maj 2019

M8B, so now your Tesla defense is now the insurance companies. Did you give up on simply insulting me and GM. You are now the comic and it is I laughing. Seriously! As stated clearly the features are on all my other cars and missing on the Tesla. That is an irrefutable fact. Period. Funny Tesla is the only major car company that does not feel the added safety systems are worth including. My other cars to not suddenly apply the brakes for no apparent reason(s) as I have experienced numerous times and as reported repeatedly on the forum by others. I guess you feel that it is a Tesla safety check of the brakes and Tesla is far superior for randomly checking them. Never fail to amaze and entertain.

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