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So will FSD follow FUSC on 3rd party sales?

So will FSD follow FUSC on 3rd party sales?

With Tesla’s latest antics of removing FUSC on cars that were originally sold as FUSC for the life of the car....what are your thoughts on Tesla removing FSD on cars sold 3rd party with pre-paid FSD when no HW3 upgrade has been done yet?

I personally wouldn’t put it past them to remove the feature and resell it again to the new owner.

These shenanigans are getting pretty ridiculous.

rxlawdude | 2019年8月6日

Agreed!

lilbean | 2019年8月6日

Yep. Double dipping.

nothotpocket | 2019年8月7日

Yep, I think they will and honestly - I don't care if they do.

bp | 2019年8月7日

It's unlikely Tesla would remove FSD from vehicles that have been resold, because FSD is an option that was purchased when the vehicle was manufactured - and is listed in the purchase agreement.

FUSC (Free Unlimited Supercharging) is not listed anywhere in the purchase agreement. In the purchase agreement for our 2017 S 100D, supercharging isn't mentioned at all - for our 2018 X 100D, it's listed as "Supercharger Enabled" as a no-charge feature.

Since FUSC isn't listed in the purchase agreement, that provides Tesla more flexibility for providing that benefit.

Providing FUSC for new S/X makes a lot of sense - since Tesla needs to do something to increase the relative value of the higher priced S/X vehicles vs. the lower priced 3/Y - and probably should do more (adding 4 year maintenance, 8 year warranty, …).

If an item is listed in the purchase agreement, the owner should be able to assume that item will transfer on a resale, unless the agreement explicitly states the item is non-transferable or Tesla provides a refund for that item upon re-sale.

EVRider | 2019年8月7日

Tesla can do whatever they want for used cars that they sell, but they can’t remove FSD from privately-sold cars since it was purchased as an option. It’s less clear whether they would have to honor the free HW3 upgrade after the car changes hands, since that upgrade is not explicitly called out anywhere in your account.

However, unlike FUSC, which Tesla is trying to limit, they want to promote FSD so they might not remove the option even when they can.

Hammonddave | 2019年8月7日

At the beginning of the year when the first "Sale" was on, it was made quite clear that FSD was not transferable to new owners. Just like FUSC.

rxlawdude | 2019年8月7日

@Hammonddave, a citation would be helpful, as I don't think anyone here recalls anything like that.

packpike | 2019年8月7日

@Hammonddave, never heard that. As far as I've ever heard FSD goes with my car. If I sell it back to Tesla and they won't to remove it then it's their business (as far as I'm concerned), but removing it from a car that I sold to someone else would not be legal IMO.

EVRider | 2019年8月7日

There's no way Tesla would (or could) remove FSD on a privately-sold car and they never said they would do anything like that.

Silver2K | 2019年8月7日

Why do you need to even let Tesla know you sold the car? Just change the account info to the person you sold it to and have them manage it from there.

Tesla repairs the car based on the account info, not based on title info

EVRider | 2019年8月8日

@Silver2K: There are plenty of reasons not to give your existing account to someone else, and you can’t if you still own a Tesla and need the account for yourself.

reed_lewis | 2019年8月8日

The FSD and EAP follows the car, not the owner. So if your car had those, then if you sell it privately, it will follow the car. It is a bit more of an unknown if the car is sold to Tesla and if they were to disable it again, and charge you again for FSD.

But for a private sale, they cannot remove it.

murphyS90D | 2019年8月8日

The Monroney sticker for my car (1/16 S90D) states:

Parcel Shelf INCLUDED
Supercharger Enabled INCLUDED
Black Brake Calipers INCLUDED
Single Charger INCLUDED
Yacht Floor INCLUDED
Subzero Weather Package $1,000

That looks to me like Supercharging is in the same class as brake calipers.

There are 17 other items in the list. Six of those are INCLUDED.

Boonedocks | 2019年8月8日

@reed_lewis. The FSD and EAP follows the car, not the owner. So if your car had those, then if you sell it privately, it will follow the car. It is a bit more of an unknown if the car is sold to Tesla and if they were to disable it again, and charge you again for FSD.

There are more and more reports on TMC of used cars being bought outside of Tesla where FUSC has indeed been removed

2015P90DI | 2019年8月8日

They can, have and will continue to do so.....on cars they own. They won't do it on cars that they do not own. But any car traded into Tesla or lease return to Tesla, Tesla now owns that car. They can do what they want with it. Is it ethical to remove something that someone already paid for and then charge another buyer for the same thing? That's a different question. Spoke to my sales rep and per his own word, Tesla is in business to sell NEW cars, thus they want those to be most attractive to buyers. When I threw out the question "isn't that double dipping, selling the same thing twice?", I got an "ahhhhhhh, well..........." and so your car will be ready........

Boonedocks | 2019年8月8日

@2015P90DI

Unless they (TMC forum members) are blatantly lying then Tesla is indeed removing FUSC from 3rd party sales.

One example from the full thread:

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/3895099/

"Got an email response from Tesla stating they are indeed removing free supercharging from 3rd party vehicles they do not own. "Thank you for contacting Tesla! My records indicate that you purchased this vehicle from a third-party seller. Unfortunately as of April 23rd, 2019, all Tesla vehicles purchased at third-party dealers/vendors will lose their unlimited Supercharging statuses. There may have been a slight delay in some credits disappearing as our systems had to implement the change fleet-wide. I apologize for the inconvenience."

Silver2K | 2019年8月8日

Ev,

You can rename the account and change all info to buyer's info and create a new account for yourself with the old info.

packpike | 2019年8月8日

@murphyS90D - I believe that option that you’re showing just means that the car is capable of supercharging, not that it includes free supercharging.

EVRider | 2019年8月8日

@packpike is correct. "Supercharger Enabled" just means the car is capable of supercharging, nothing more. There was a time when this was optional on certain Model S's.

rxlawdude | 2019年8月8日

The question is, what is a "third-party seller." Is that the original owner in a private sale? The second owner in a private sale?

Or, does it ONLY mean any non-Tesla commercial auto dealership? (This could include, technically, any auction a dealer purchases the vehicle from.)

reed_lewis | 2019年8月8日

Not getting FUSC on sales of cars makes sense when the FUSC was supposed to be only for the original purchaser of the car. My late 2016 HW2.0 car shows as: "You have free, unlimited Supercharging for your current Tesla. If you choose to sell your current Tesla, free Supercharging will transfer to the next owner. " which means that the car has FUSC and it stays with the car.

OTOH someone I know who got FUSC because of a referral basically says that if he sells the car, FUSC goes away. There is no distinction between selling it to Tesla, and selling it to someone else.

This makes sense to me.

And as others have said, there is a difference between SuperCharging enabled, and FUSC. They are not the same. That is what happened with the 3 initially. People were pissed off that Tesla said that they 3 would be able to super charge, but took that to mean FUSC which is different.

rxlawdude | 2019年8月8日

@reed, precisely. Part of the misunderstanding is the fact that Tesla had offered "FUSC" for the CURRENT OWNER ONLY after they stopped "unlimited FUSC" in January 2017.
So most, if not all 2017s and later model years will NOT transfer with FUSC.